Your bad driving encounters

[Rroff]

The extra speed is fine until it isn't. Speed and inconsiderate driving often go together as well.

Big speed variance to the speed limit both above and below often goes together with inconsiderate driving - I caught up behind someone driving well below the speed limit last night who was driving me up the wall - though partly that was because both times we came to a good overtaking place there was traffic coming the other way - especially the longer straight there was cars spaced just enough to deny me overtaking at the start and middle of it I really hope there was something wrong with their car rather than driving like that intentionally - I was proper raging by the time I got past them as I've encountered just a few too many in the last few days.

 

[ICDP]

That’s anger management issues, not bad driving issues.

You are moving the goalpost because someone driving slowly is not the same as someone speeding. The argument wasn’t about “big speed variance”.

 

[Rroff]

That’s anger management issues, not bad driving issues.

You are moving the goalpost because someone driving slowly is not the same as someone speeding. The argument wasn’t about “big speed variance”.

My side of it is irrelevant here - doesn't change the fact that poor and inconsiderate driving often goes hand in hand with people who drive at a speed significantly different to the speed limit both faster and slower.

EDIT: No anger management issues anyhow, yeah I was worked up a bit more than usual but just blew it off by venting to myself - didn't change how I was driving in respect to the other person.

 

[Mr_Sukebe]

There is always going to be a subjective side to it but there are breaking or bending the laws in ways which have little to no impact on anyone else and ways in which have a big impact on everyone else - just because some people might speed a little doesn't justify inconsiderate driving and personally think it perfectly reasonable to expect people to drive considerately without expecting them to apply the rules as per textbook.

And who’s defining what “with consideration” means?

If it’s not written down, it’s arbitrary, and different people will have different interpretations.

 

[Rroff]

And who’s defining what “with consideration” means?

If it’s not written down, it’s arbitrary, and different people will have different interpretations.

It isn't really arbitrary - while not possible to do it perfectly you can attempt to accommodate and not unnecessarily inconvenience other drivers and make the roads work better for everyone - failing to merge in turn and trying to push another driver out who was initially already ahead of you for example isn't really subjective. And frankly to say that kind of behaviour is enabled by people having a loose interpretation of the speed limit is laughable.

 

[Mr_Sukebe]

Again, just because you consider it inappropriate, doesn’t make any difference to the person in question.

In their opinion, he was doing the right thing. Picture this, that the guy driving like a muppet had stoped near you. Do you genuinely believe that he’d be remorseful, apologise and agree that he was driving like a muppet?

I think that we both know the answer to that.

The point is really really simple, once people start considering driving laws arbitrary, things start going to ****, as they are currently doing and it’s happily demonstrated by the sheer number of different types of crap driving that we see, whether that is breaking the speed limit (just a bit, cos that’s ok), parking on double yellow (won’t be long), parking in a disable bay (I drive an Audi and am too important to want to walk another 20m across the car park).

 

[ICDP]

And who’s defining what “with consideration” means?

If it’s not written down, it’s arbitrary, and different people will have different interpretations.

Exactly. Speed limits are not an arbitrary choice depending on a particular drivers whims. Anyone stating that a bit of speeding is OK, while someone driving a bit slow is not, are on very shaky ground.

In fact the law would punish someone doing 10mph over limit despite their pathetic arguments of, “but I’m a competent driver”. Yet someone doing 30 on an NSL would be doing absolutely nothing illegal.

 

[Rroff]

Again, just because you consider it inappropriate, doesn’t make any difference to the person in question.

In their opinion, he was doing the right thing. Picture this, that the guy driving like a muppet had stoped near you. Do you genuinely believe that he’d be remorseful, apologise and agree that he was driving like a muppet?

I think that we both know the answer to that.

The point is really really simple, once people start considering driving laws arbitrary, things start going to ****, as they are currently doing and it’s happily demonstrated by the sheer number of different types of crap driving that we see, whether that is breaking the speed limit (just a bit, cos that’s ok), parking on double yellow (won’t be long), parking in a disable bay (I drive an Audi and am too important to want to walk another 20m across the car park).

If most people drove precisely to the speed limit it still wouldn't have an effect on those who are inconsiderate and uncaring in general.

Exactly. Speed limits are not an arbitrary choice depending on a particular drivers whims. Anyone stating that a bit of speeding is OK, while someone driving a bit slow is not, are on very shaky ground.

In fact the law would punish someone doing 10mph over limit despite their pathetic arguments of, “but I’m a competent driver”. Yet someone doing 30 on an NSL would be doing absolutely nothing illegal.

You can't take speed in isolation - it is the knock on effect - someone doing 20 MPH over the speed limit on an empty motorway is far less disruptive and far less likely to result in a serious incident than someone doing 20 MPH below the speed limit on a decent bit of NSL road at a busy time of day. Someone doing 30 MPH in an NSL might be doing nothing illegal but that doesn't mean it is considerate or that they are doing the best they can do make the roads work best for everyone.

 

[keyser van someone]

Imagine what the roads will be like when everyone knows an EV that can do 0-60 in 5 secs I think everything will be great with no issues.

 

[pastymuncher]

Followed a brand new Range Rover (looked top end with four exhausts) today from one side of Elgin to the other and through seven junctions and two roundabouts they didn't use their indicators once. I know JLR cars have their problems but I didn't know that indicators not working was one of them!! I see this a lot these days and it seems to be getting worse.

Funnily enough, just outside Elgin a Range Rover had broken down and was being winched onto a recovery truck. Good old JLR!!

 

[Uther]

The no indicator thing is definitely getting worse, it's bloody annoying waiting to pull out from a junction or roundabout and they can't be arsed to indicate as they turn off.

 

[Rroff]

and two roundabouts they didn't use their indicators once

I had a colleague following me the other day who kind of complained afterwards because I was straight lining and not indicating when going straight over on this and a couple of similar roundabouts along the route:

Spoiler

Also this same one once a women following me very exaggeratedly went around it and indicated and then was giving me a sarcastic handclap which I think was a commentary on my approach - but then when we were waiting in the queue at the lights further down the road she then sat there not noticing we'd started moving because she was on her phone!

Obviously straight lining in general isn't a good habit.

 

[ICDP]

The no indicator thing is definitely getting worse, it's bloody annoying waiting to pull out from a junction or roundabout and they can't be arsed to indicate as they turn off.

Yep, that is annoying. Though having said that how many times have you been caught out by the left indicating buffoons who carry on past multiple exits on a roundabout?

So ironically you end up not being held up any more than normal, as you should always sensibly wait to see if they actually mean it.

 

[Rroff]

The no indicator thing is definitely getting worse, it's bloody annoying waiting to pull out from a junction or roundabout and they can't be arsed to indicate as they turn off.

Personally I won't go until someone has committed - seen several instances just this week of people indicating on roundabouts then doing something else causing other people to have to slam on the brakes because they just went on the indicator.

 

[ICDP]

You can't take speed in isolation - it is the knock on effect - someone doing 20 MPH over the speed limit on an empty motorway is far less disruptive and far less likely to result in a serious incident than someone doing 20 MPH below the speed limit on a decent bit of NSL road at a busy time of day. Someone doing 30 MPH in an NSL might be doing nothing illegal but that doesn't mean it is considerate or that they are doing the best they can do make the roads work best for everyone.

What a ridiculous statement. Of course you have to take speed in isolation, because there are speed limits.

Driving 20mph over the limit is against the law, driving 20mph below the limit isn’t. You keep conflating inconsiderate with dangerous, the two things are not mutually inclusive.

 

[Rroff]

What a ridiculous statement. Of course you have to take speed in isolation, because there are speed limits.

Driving 20mph over the limit is against the law, driving 20mph below the limit isn’t. You keep conflating inconsiderate with dangerous, the two things are not mutually inclusive.

This seems to be me more like you are trying to justify driving at what you know is an unreasonable amount below the reasonable speed for limit and conditions.

The level of problem driving say 20 MPH over the limit presents depends hugely on the speed limit and conditions, like wise driving 20 MPH under the limit - it might not be illegal but that doesn't mean it isn't both inconsiderate and unnecessarily causes a dangerous situation which could be avoided.

EDIT: And personally I'm complaining about both dangerous and inconsiderate drivers and there is often considerable crossover.

 

[Mr_Sukebe]

I had a colleague following me the other day who kind of complained afterwards because I was straight lining and not indicating when going straight over on this and a couple of similar roundabouts along the route:

Spoiler

Also this same one once a women following me very exaggeratedly went around it and indicated and then was giving me a sarcastic handclap which I think was a commentary on my approach - but then when we were waiting in the queue at the lights further down the road she then sat there not noticing we'd started moving because she was on her phone!

Obviously straight lining in general isn't a good habit.

If I didn’t know better I’d say that sounds both you are her have different standards on what is “appropriate”.

But hey, don’t try to think through why that might be and whether you could or should reconsider your own attitude.

 

[Rroff]

If I didn’t know better I’d say that sounds both you are her have different standards on what is “appropriate”.

But hey, don’t try to think through why that might be and whether you could or should reconsider your own attitude.

Part of the reason I posted was for comments. Personally I don't think that going through the motions of using the roundabout like it was a larger one accomplishes anything meaningful and in fact can cause more chances for confusion or opening up space people might try to use stupidly.

 

[Sho]

The no indicator thing is definitely getting worse, it's bloody annoying waiting to pull out from a junction or roundabout and they can't be arsed to indicate as they turn off.

This has become a commmon theme lately. No one likes indicating especially on roundabouts..
Mini roundabouts are the worse. If I’m indicating right and go around the roundabout… I just know other drivers will fail, and will give you the most ugliest look and make it look like you’re at fault.

 

[Rroff]

This has become a commmon theme lately. No one likes indicating especially on roundabouts..
Mini roundabouts are the worse. If I’m indicating right and go around the roundabout… I just know other drivers will fail, and will give you the most ugliest look and make it look like you’re at fault.

Just glad there aren't many of those mini roundabouts around here.