HID Conversion Kits

Phil W said:
Dude, you've stressed that point more than once now, you really don't need to drum it in any more.

OP : When i purchased HID's i also purchased Projector Lamps, it meant a much reduced chance of blinding oncoming drivers, but it also massively improved the light output on the road.

You seem to have already made your mind up if you have already purchased the ST170 Headlights, and the HID's, however bear it in mind for possible future upgrades :)
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He goes out his way to annoy and spam. Ignore him, works best :D.

I have already bought the HID kit but people on FFOC seem blinkered by it thus I didn't realise to the full extent of how dangerous these kits can be. I'd really hate to blind anyone.
 
Everyone seems to want HID's becuase their current lights are 'so poor'.

What people dont realise is that your average 4+ year old and 50k+ mile car will have poor lights not becuase they are not HID's but becuase the lenses become scratched and pitted over time and distance, and this reduces light output.
 
They are not *that* dangerous, no more dangerous than someone driving towards you and forgetting to turn their main beam off.

People dress then up to be accident causes because they are what they are, cheap kits from eBay etc.

In the time i had both sets (One on Halogen Lamps, the other on Projector Lamps), i got flashed probably 2-3 times in an evening drive, which is a lot really.
 
While I understand the points made about the need to use a projector with HID bulbs, what I still fail to understand is the variance in OEM fit HID systems.

While I find some cars absolutely fine to approach from an oncoming direction and refract through the rear view mirror, others physically blind me.

One in particular is the Range Rover. I suffer every time one decides to tailgate me or come from the opposite direction. How is this any different from people illegally fitting HID's?
 
The self levelling is not so much the issue here, it's the projector that's the important bit.

Even with the fastest self levelling servo in the world you are going to get flicker, it's just not possible to compensate for undulations in the road that quickly.
 
ColdFusion said:
One in particular is the Range Rover. I suffer every time one decides to tailgate me or come from the opposite direction. How is this any different from people illegally fitting HID's?
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Its a higher up vehicle, the lights are more on eye-level, hence being dazzled more.
 
Phil W said:
The point i was trying to make is that they are no *more* dangerous than Halogen lamps used incorrectly :)
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So? It's an irrelevent point. It's like moaning at somebody complaining about people walking around with guns by saying 'Its only as dangerous as somebody walking around with a chainsaw'.

Both are dangerous.
 
The above from the Department of Transport is just their opinion, not the use of the word "should". Parliament has not legislated on the matter directly so that's the end of it.
 
Phil W said:
They are not *that* dangerous, no more dangerous than someone driving towards you and forgetting to turn their main beam off.
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They are brighter than main beam lights and as previously mentioned are classed as disabling. You also have to remember that quite a lot of people are sensitive to light (common side effect of short sight), and that just because you are fine with really bright lights in your face doesn't mean everyone can tolerate them.

And again as previously mentioned regardless of how dangerous they may be in reality, if they are reported as the cause of an accident and subsequently found to be incorrectly installed (without levelling, washers and projectors) then you will be liable.

The simple reason why so many people are so adamantly against this is because its us it affects. We are the people that get blinded by inconsiderate modders who rationalise away to shortfalls of their chosen modification.
 
Muncher said:
The above from the Department of Transport is just their opinion, not the use of the word "should". Parliament has not legislated on the matter directly so that's the end of it.
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But is does say that according to the strict letter of the law they are not legal at all, and it is their view that they should be allowed providing some conditions were met.
 
[TW]Fox;11111884 said:
Everyone seems to want HID's becuase their current lights are 'so poor'.

What people dont realise is that your average 4+ year old and 50k+ mile car will have poor lights not becuase they are not HID's but becuase the lenses become scratched and pitted over time and distance, and this reduces light output.
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Not my reasoning, I'd be buying new ST lamps in any case :), simply want more light.
 
M0T said:
But is does say that according to the strict letter of the law they are not legal at all, and it is their view that they should be allowed providing some conditions were met.
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Sorry, I don't see how that can follow.

"Under these Regulations, HID/Gas Discharge/Xenon headlamps are not mentioned and therefore they are not permitted according to the strict letter of the law."

OK, so they are not mentioned at all in those regulations.


"Therefore a HID headlamp unit sold in the after market should:

3. Comply with RVLR as far as "use" is concerned.
In practice this means:

...
2. Once fitted to the vehicle it must have headlamp cleaning and self-levelling "

Hang on, now they're saying they are???? They have read between the lines and have imported requirements of ECE Regulation 98 and ECE Regulation 48 which are not there.


They're not making a rational argument. What they are effectively saying is that they would like to see the RVLR amended to mention HIDS. In practice the only way this could happen is at the MOT, the self levelling is something which is not practicable to test at MOTs therefore the regulations have not and are unlikely to be amended.

Again the reason why their statement begins with "the legal rationale" is because it's their opinion, there is no black and white law. You could turn up outside the Department of Transport offices and point at them installed in your car and there is nothing they, nor anyone else can do about it.
 
Muncher said:
Sorry, I don't see how that can follow.

"Under these Regulations, HID/Gas Discharge/Xenon headlamps are not mentioned and therefore they are not permitted according to the strict letter of the law."

OK, so they are not mentioned at all in those regulations.


"Therefore a HID headlamp unit sold in the after market should:

3. Comply with RVLR as far as "use" is concerned.
In practice this means:

...
2. Once fitted to the vehicle it must have headlamp cleaning and self-levelling "

Hang on, now they're saying they are???? They have read between the lines and have imported requirements of ECE Regulation 98 and ECE Regulation 48 which are not there.


They're not making a rational argument. What they are effectively saying is that they would like to see the RVLR amended to mention HIDS. In practice the only way this could happen is at the MOT, the self levelling is something which is not practicable to test at MOTs therefore the regulations have not and are unlikely to be amended.

Again the reason why their statement begins with "the legal rationale" is because it's their opinion, there is no black and white law. You could turn up outside the Department of Transport offices and point at them installed in your car and there is nothing they, nor anyone else can do about it.
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Nice post, I was just about to hammer out a similar response :)
 
So Muncher you have one of these kits I gather from a quick search, have you had many issues with other traffic users flashing you etc.
 
Since I've bought the kit I may aswell try it, If I encounter many issues with other road users or I feel I am bliding people I'll take it off and sell it. I know a LOT of people with kits like without issue. I can see it being a problem in older headlight units but surely it's less of a problem with modern headlight units?

I'm not willing to write it off totally from what you lot have said it seems Fox is leading the herd as usual anyway.
 
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