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Why does ATI limit overclocks and Nvidia do not.

This is the original Overclokers UK Forum. I think 99.99% of us are not shy of taking a soldering Iron to hardware in the pursuit of extream performance.

Having someone post about how problematic it is to need to use a couple of bits of software to improve the overclocking range of a card is a little difficult to comprehend.

This made me faceplam really hard.
 
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RavenXXX2 said:
@ jigger, I'm just highlighting the fact you have to go through hoops to overclock an ATI card, not so with Nvidia, is that so hard to comprehend?
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No, what you're doing is pointing out the obvious to the informed. Why, god only knows, but for some reason you persist regardless.
You're a very clever bloke (or bird, I don't know) who knows a great deal about gfx cards and has a massive input in to these forums.
Why not use these skills and start some positive threads instead of the flame bait from the last few weeks/ months. I have a lot of respect for what you know and have gaind some good knowledge from reading your, and other peoples post on here.
Recently every thread seems to degrade to some form of futile argument caused by a pointless thread/post about nothing.
 
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Obviously a number of people are not informed when they keep posting about how to bypass the overclock limits in CCC, this is a discussion forum, I started a genuine thread on a matter than can effect people overclocking, all I see is ATI owners trashing the thread or others having a go because life is hard for them, instead of giving relevant reasons why I can overclock my Nvidia card to the limits and not my £300 5870 enthusiasts card out of the box.
 
This thread makes it look like you cant take a 5000 card past a 50Mhz overclock so you could be infact a source of misinformation yourself.

Maybe you should start a thread covering the basics of taking a 5000 card to 1000Mhz plus to help the misinformed.

What next the "Why the hell cant Nvidia build a card thats as fast as ATI's but within the same thermal overhead when ATI can" Thread.
 
jigger said:
This thread makes it look like you cant take a 5000 card past a 50Mhz overclock so you could be infact a source of misinformation yourself.
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If were not for third party software and enabling a hack that may cause stability problems, you couldn't get past that 50Mhz barrier, the other option is to flash the cards bios voiding the warranty, see where I'm going with this?
 
Its a non issue. Both cards can be clocked. Both makers took steps to cover themselves, be it making overclocking harder, or voiding warrantys. Simple as and OP would never ever have started a thread like this before a well advertised change of hardware.

I would like to inform everyone regarding the action we have taken and will now continue to do so against the individuals who are causing threads which are created in this area of the forums (Graphics Cards) to descend into an all out slanging match and generally spoiling the threads for everyone else.
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This was clearly started as an 'nvidia are doing this better than ati' thread; if this was started by a newbie or someone not familiar with the graphics card forums fair enough, Raven knows what he is doing. One of the three sticked threads shows it is simple enough to get round the ati limits.
 
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el Kuarlos said:
Its a non issue. Both cards can be clocked. Both makers took steps to cover themselves, be it making overclocking harder, or voiding warrantys. Simple as and OP would never ever have started a thread like this before a well advertised change of hardware.



This was clearly started as an 'nvidia are doing this better than ati' thread; if this was started by a newbie or someone not familiar with the graphics card forums fair enough, Raven knows what he is doing. One of the three sticked threads shows it is simple enough to get round the ati limits.

When one of the few people <drunkenmaster> who regularly tries to put informed answers on threads finds himself in an argument of semantics with a troll and a mod, something is amiss.
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Clearly you are wrong, why would I make a thread when I had the ATI card, it make sense that I move to a 480 and find I have no restrictions on my cards overclocking potential and find it annoying that my £300 5870 did. A mod has been actively posting in this thread so don't pull the flamebate thread nonsense. Do you see me flaming anyone, no I guess you don't. Yet you and others are descending the thread to a low level, post about the topic and stop having a go.
 
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@ Gashman Exactly, do you see me getting personal? and flaming members left right and center and causing the thread to descend in to the bowels of depravity, I simply post about a genuine grievances I have had regarding ATI cards, feel free to share your view but don't get personal and off topic.

If you have nothing constructive to say then simply ignore the thread, if people feel that way then the thread simply fades away, simple really.
 
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Reading this thread has just left me utterly annoyed at you for complaining over absolutely nothing, really, good work.


Also just because someone buys a 5850+ doesn't mean they know how to overclock safely, a lot of people have more money than sense.
 
Raven do not let any of these thred trashers tell you what you can and can not discuss. You raised a valid point for discussion and yet again i am afraid to say the ATI brigade arrive feeling they have to justify everything by pulling you and the subject down.

The funny thing is, The matter in hand is not even a negative one. Ok you have to use some software to unlock the true overclocking value on ATI cards, so what. The point Raven is asking is, he wonders why you have to on ATI on not on Nvidia. But as this forum has got again recently it just brings in the children.
 
Stanners said:
Raven do not let any of these thred trashers tell you what you can and can not discuss. You raised a valid point for discussion and yet again i am afraid to say the ATI brigade arrive feeling they have to justify everything by pulling you and the subject down.

The funny thing is, The matter in hand is not even a negative one. Ok you have to use some software to unlock the true overclocking value on ATI cards, so what. The point Raven is asking is, he wonders why you have to on ATI on not on Nvidia. But as this forum has got again recently it just brings in the children.
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This is it, I can understand 5400 owners not caring about this threads subject matter but it's something I feel needs highlighted, you purchase a £300 GFX card from ATI and have to use unofficial ways to overclock your card past the 900 Mhz limit " ridiculous limit of 775 core on a 5850 " which may cause stability problems the way afterburner does it, I fail to see why anyone would not see this as legit issue when you compare it to the 480 I bought where I could go straight in and whack the core up to 1090 if I wish to do so.
 
Also ATI implement on die VRM protection on 5000 series gpu's for programs like furmark they treat as power virus an protect the cards VRM from going boom.
 
Its not a legit issue as if you are concerned about overclocking, you can buy an Asus or MSI.

No one is forcing you to choose a brand that locks their overclocking.
 
It's not just one brand, it's all reference 5850's and 5870's, apart from MSI and Asus who charge a premium for their cards as well, you could buy the cheapest 480 going and still have the same access to overclocks as the most expensive 480 going, I feel this is fair, I find being limited to measly overclocks and then using software and editing a CFG file and potentiality having issues as described below from the afterburner readme.

Added configuration file switch allowing power users to unlock unofficial overclocking codepath in AMD display drivers (similar to AMDGPUClockTool, ATITool and RivaTuner overclocking implementation on AMD graphics cards).
Unlike AMD's official ADL SDK overclocking ways, unofficial ones are not limited with CCC clock limit but have some alternate disadvantages (e.g. PowerPlay support limitation).
Please take a note that unofficial overclocking methods are not supported either by AMD or by MSI, so unlock and use it at your own risk.
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Then dont buy the cheapest one? Asus + MSI cards normally arent that much more expensive, and they save you having to void your warranty with overvolting, plus you have no need to do anything like Bios flashing.

Some AIBs like Sapphire dont support overclocking at all, and even went as far as to completely remove their voltage tweaks. ATI dont design their graphics cards to allow you to overclock, that they even include some extra headroom is a bonus enough.

The premium that Asus and MSI charge is worth have overclocking covered by the warranty, plus much better built and cooled cards in most cases.

Its your choice to buy what you want. If you dont want limited overclocking, then dont buy a card that doesnt support it. ATI dont have to allow overclocking at all on their cards. You pay to buy the specification advertised, overclocking is not included in that. If you want to buy a card to overclock, buy a brand that supports it.

As already said, most people who buy graphics cards dont overclock them at all.
 
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