BMW and M Power Owners

Sorry ad but you're not talking sense.

The below is very rough and ready

I just had a quick check and a loan of ( as an example) 26k over 2 years brings 1400 interest at circa 5.5%

So only 55 of the equivalent monthly payment would be covering interest. Let's say you're 280 just now, That's nearly 5.5k paid off of the value of the car over 2 years, less whatever deposit you've left.

So after 2 years you'd have circa 19-20k as a ( pessimistic) balloon to clear in whatever way you seen fit. Would the car lose 30% over 2 years and cause you to lose out? Doesn't look like it in this case

You'd also have a get out whenever you like with rebate of interest etc.
 
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At least with the lease option you "know" how much you're coughing up in total. The same can't be said with the finance option.

In the end it all comes down to personal circumstances. The guy wants a car for a short period.
 
Which is fine, I've no problem with that in the slightest! I would potentially lease a car myself if i was looking for something brand new, but it's not likely to be the cheapest way to do things that is pretty much the only point i'm making.
 
rodenal said:
Sorry ad but you're not talking sense.

The below is very rough and ready

I just had a quick check and a loan of ( as an example) 26k over 2 years brings 1400 interest at circa 5.5%

So only 55 of the equivalent monthly payment would be covering interest. Let's say you're 280 just now, That's nearly 5.5k paid off of the value of the car over 2 years, less whatever deposit you've left.

So after 2 years you'd have circa 19-20k as a ( pessimistic) balloon to clear in whatever way you seen fit. Would the car lose 30% over 2 years and cause you to lose out? Doesn't look like it in this case

You'd also have a get out whenever you like with rebate of interest etc.
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The only important thing here is the £1400 monthly payments on the loan................ Nothing else really matters as you'd be paying £1400 a month from your disposable income :eek::eek::eek: No matter what small savings you would earn from getting a loan vs leasing, that's still £1400 a month. Maybe for the 2yr period I should eat bread and water and never leave the house all month bar going to work ;)

Time for some more :eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

Had a quick look at finance deals and what others on the M135i deals thread on PH have been offered. It wasn't close to being good value and as low cost as the lease over the 2yr period, it really is just that simple.

Throwing around figures on interest cost, owning car valve, etc is great, but you'd have to put down a huge deposit and you'd be in the finance deal, which if leaving would cost you financially (cannot even be bothered to do any calcs as it doesn't matter anymore) and even if you wanted to see it through and own the car, you'd have to pay £10-12k at the end.

My first paragraph covered the horrible loan figures and I've already given reasons for my choice and how it works out well for me financially for owning such a car for the 2yr period.

rodenal said:
Which is fine, I've no problem with that in the slightest! I would potentially lease a car myself if i was looking for something brand new, but it's not likely to be the cheapest way to do things that is pretty much the only point i'm making.
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But it is the cheapest way of doing this with an M135i for 2yrs, 3-4yrs as you have said is a completely different kettle of fish :D:D:D

I'd never driven or even considered one until I saw this deal, but thankfully after driving one I was won over almost immediately. The Integra felt like a Model T on the way home from the dealership :(

On another note a friend is leasing a 435i for over £500pcm. He wasn't best pleased when I mentioned that even with the same engine and transmission, the 435i was slower and the engine put out around 14hp and 35ft/lbs less than mine. He should have grabbe done of the M deals in December for around £500pcm. Now that was a a stonking deal, if you wanted such a mental car for a short period!
 
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-Ad- said:
The only important thing here is the £1400 monthly payments on the loan................ Nothing else really matters as you'd be paying £1400 a month from your disposable income :eek::eek::eek:

Time for some more :eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

Had a quick look at finance deals and what others on the M135i deals thread on PH have been offered. It wasn't close to being good value and as low cost as the lease over the 2yr period, it really is just that simple.

Throwing around figures on interest cost, owning car valve, etc is great, but you'd have to put down a huge deposit and you'd be in the finance deal, which if leaving would cost you financially (cannot even be bothered to do any calcs as it doesn't matter anymore) and even if you wanted to see it through and own the car, you'd have to pay £10-12k at the end.

My first paragraph covered the horrible loan figures and I've already given reasons for my choice and how it works out well for me financially for owning such a car for the 2yr period.
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You aren't picking up the point.

£1400 is the TOTAL interest ONLY on the full loan sum. You are only paying that total interest sum over the 2 years plus repayment money. The interest portion of the monthly payment is about £58. There is no £1400 per month as even though you are charged interest on the full sum there would effectively be a big lump due at the end that you need to ensure the car is worth more than (and it almost certainly would be in this case)

i.e lets assume its still £280 a month payment, £222 of that is paying off the initial repayment part.

You don't have to put down a huge deposit at all, generally speaking they would be looking for between 5-10%, so on a 26k example £1300-£2600.....all of which comes off the cost of buying the car, not just an upfront payment on rental.

Anyway this is irrelevant, I was simply pointing out that the lease is not some sort of all singing all dancing cheap deal.

It is what appears to be a nice way to rent the car for two years, at a not too expensive outlay for a 300bhp car

It is not (or doesn't appear to be rather) the cheapest way to have use of that car for two years
 
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On a completely unrelated note I went to try a championship white Type R today after initially having a look at some of the 125 coupes, leaving disappointed and realising that if it was to replace my car (which is undecided) it should really be a hatch of sorts anyway.

Anyway I was completely underwhelmed by it, which is a shame as I really liked my diseasel civic. For something that's apparently worth about £9k more than my "ancient" 330 coupe I couldn't think of a single thing I was impressed by. I've not driven a type R for a couple of years but it really just wasn't quick enough. The little 1 series was a much better feeling all rounder for similar cash. Felt bad telling the dealer it wasn't remotely interesting for me but no point wasting his time!

May also go and drive an edition 30 gti but tbh I may well hang on to the e46 for some time - which is a surprise to me as I get bored incredibly easily
 
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Even if you financed a 26K car over the period of 60 months and then looked to repay the total at the 24 month mark you'd have shelled out over 4K more on a 5.99% apr rate.

To break even you'd be looking to sell the car at somewhere around the 20K mark, assuming a reasonable rate of interest rebate, which your unlikely to do as a PX due to VAT so would need to be private sale, reducing the potential value of the car further.

Sounds like a reasonable way of running a new car for 24 months to me...
 
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Why would 60 months come into anything?

The car is only intended to be owned for 2 years. The buyer wants to use some sort of PCP

The term is only 2 years and the repayments are only adding up to say £6k over the 2 years with a lump at the end.

Deposit is, as example above £1300 (yes you would ideally want to put more down, you don't have to). The loan sum (total) is £24.7k, however only £6000 of that is being repaid over the 2 year period with a lump thereafter.

The repayments are (roughly):

Total interest on a 24.7k loan over 2 years at 5% (example) £1375.00 - divided by 24 = £57.29 per month

Repayment amount = £6000/24 = £250

Total £307.29...you could easily work this to circa £280 as per the lease

as i've mentioned a number of times this is real rough stuff but you'd then have a sum due of £18,700 after 2 years to either pay or sell the car and recover ...which in this case you'd easily get back. Scale it up a bit as undoubtedly the car is a bit more, the message doesn't change.


Maybe i'm being really daft here but this is simple stuff
 
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60 months was used as an example of an HP agreement, obviously the fewer months you pay over the less you have to repay due to interest but the higher the monthly costs.

But to take your PCP example and to calculate it using a proper PCP calculator from a broker, the numbers, whilst based on a slightly higher starting price of 28.2K as thats the price on the site I've found for the 3dr Auto, work out as

OTR Price £28,228.80
Deposit £1,700.00
Balance to Finance £26,528.80
Monthly Payment £512.24
Final Payment (GFV) £16,974.00
Total Amount Payable £30,967.76
APR % 6.2%

So again £200 a month give or take more than what the lease is going to cost, he can walk away at the end or sell as its a GFV, but again how much more are you likely to make on selling the car? enough to recoup the £200 x 24 = £4,800 he's paid out on the car? good luck...
 
I really don't agree but there's no point in going round in circles tbh

Why would you accept 6.2% as an example? The first broker I looked at had the car at 27.8k and mentions BMW will do 4.9%

Even the old shape coupe at 2 years old and 20k has held its value very well
 
Rodenal : your example is no cheaper than the lease price. There is no advantage only you are taking the risk that 1) it's future value is more than the remaining balance and 2) you can sell the car yourself for that value.

For the sake of a couple of hundred pounds over two years; let someone else take the risk and hassle.
 
rodenal said:
I really don't agree but there's no point in going round in circles tbh

Why would you accept 6.2% as an example? The first broker I looked at had the car at 27.8k and mentions BMW will do 4.9%

Even the old shape coupe at 2 years old and 20k has held its value very well
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Whats not to agree with? The figures I've posted are a valid example. The 1% a year will make somewhere in the region of £300 difference over the 24 month term and the OTR price is again a couple of hundred different, again making a few £ a month difference.

A dealer might sell a car at that sort of age for a early 20's but there is a big difference between a dealer selling and the price you get as a px/buy or selling privately with the considerable aggravation of doing so. On top of that you have the larger monthly outlay with no guarantee that you'll recoup any of the difference in 2 years.

For minimising monthly outlay, eliminating the risk of being hit if the values fall heavily by factors such as an LCI or market being flooded by used 2 year old ex lease cars etc and aggravation of selling on I'm struggling to see where he could do any better over a 2 year term?
 
Don't get me wrong I "get" the argument, just don't see any cut and dried " wow this is cheap" conclusion.

You're right about dealers and the kind of margin at that money but you're then into a whole new private sale vs trade in and relative cost to change discussion

Maybe its closer than I thought at first, fair enough tbh - just doesn't seem like its been properly considered in some cases....which is a bit worrying given its a not insignificant sum to spend over 2 years on anything imo. Especially when you have no real break clause
 
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alx said:
On a different note I'm going to test drive a Z4M coupe tomorrow, looking forward to it :D
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Come out tonight :D

rodenal said:
I really don't agree but there's no point in going round in circles tbh

Why would you accept 6.2% as an example? The first broker I looked at had the car at 27.8k and mentions BMW will do 4.9%

Even the old shape coupe at 2 years old and 20k has held its value very well
Click to expand...

rodenal said:
You aren't picking up the point.

£1400 is the TOTAL interest ONLY on the full loan sum. You are only paying that total interest sum over the 2 years plus repayment money. The interest portion of the monthly payment is about £58. There is no £1400 per month as even though you are charged interest on the full sum there would effectively be a big lump due at the end that you need to ensure the car is worth more than (and it almost certainly would be in this case)

i.e lets assume its still £280 a month payment, £222 of that is paying off the initial repayment part.

You don't have to put down a huge deposit at all, generally speaking they would be looking for between 5-10%, so on a 26k example £1300-£2600.....all of which comes off the cost of buying the car, not just an upfront payment on rental.

Anyway this is irrelevant, I was simply pointing out that the lease is not some sort of all singing all dancing cheap deal.

It is what appears to be a nice way to rent the car for two years, at a not too expensive outlay for a 300bhp car

It is not (or doesn't appear to be rather) the cheapest way to have use of that car for two years
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Think we got our wires crossed on the previous post RE: £1400. I was reading that as £1400pcm for a large loan, which isn't out of the question, whereas you were talking about PCP :)

But, over 2yrs using a rough calc with random and fairly high final payment figure, it would be:
26xm.jpg
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So nearly double what I'm paying now to rent if for 2yrs (albeit a random final payment picked out). There would be £1400 worth of interest in there, but it's still a silly option unless you span it out over a number of years want to own the car at the end of it.

So I'm clearly sticking to my guns that this is the cheapest and most affordable way to get an M135i for 2yrs :D
 
DAIR said:
Don't see what the big deal is. If Ad wanted to actually own the car or keep it for longer than 3 years then of course a a PCP or Cash would be a better option.

He's chosen a car that he wants to run for no more than 2 years. What's the issue?
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The point isn't that he took the wrong deal, it is obvious he did not.

The point is that it not the omg amazing bargain people seem to think it is, that's all.
 
-Ad- said:
Come out tonight :D





Think we got our wires crossed on the previous post RE: £1400. I was reading that as £1400pcm for a large loan, which isn't out of the question, whereas you were talking about PCP :)

But, over 2yrs using a rough calc with random and fairly high final payment figure, it would be:
26xm.jpg
[/URL]

So nearly double what I'm paying now to rent if for 2yrs (albeit a random final payment picked out). There would be £1400 worth of interest in there, but it's still a silly option unless you span it out over a number of years want to own the car at the end of it.

So I'm clearly sticking to my guns that this is the cheapest and most affordable way to get an M135i for 2yrs :D
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You have missed the key point there, the optional final value is much lower than the expected value of the car. So you can have back the difference between this figure and the cars value if you opt to pay it and sell the car.

This could be a much as 5-6k or so back your way. And your purchase price seems high, a base spec car with zero options is available for under 27k from brokers.
 
How about Fox buys the car for £27k, leases it to -Ad- for 2 years at £290 PCM, plus the deposit, then after that Fox gets the car back to sell for ££££'s profit.

Resolved :)
 
Fox the problem as I've pointed out is that it's a big could and in reality there are no guarantees that in 24 months time the values won't have collapsed due to all these deals that have been kicking about for the last 6 months. A zero option car is also.going to be a lot less desireable than something well spec'd so the lease makes sense for the term he's looking for. Its hard to see if there would be a significant difference in the end in comparison of the different finance approaches , but leasing does one thing and that's reduce the monthly outlay significantly.

The price I've started from in my examples has been the 3Dr auto if that makes any difference...
 
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