Steam prices! Grey key sites! and the I love/hate developers thread - Enter if you dare!

Nexus18 · 4 Feb 2016 at 16:33

I will pay as little as I can for a game or any product in the world for that matter.

If I can buy a game key from a legit site for £5-25 instead of the usual amount of £40+ then guess who I am going to go with and there isn't a single thing that anyone can do about it

VincentHanna · 4 Feb 2016 at 16:33

So cdkeys isn't considered grey market?

In that case I pay the best price I can get and yet ones the devs are supposedly also happy with.

FoxEye · 4 Feb 2016 at 16:37

VincentHanna said:
So cdkeys isn't considered grey market?

Sorry, who said that?

VincentHanna · 4 Feb 2016 at 16:40

Well Greenmangaming is legit? Surely CD Keys are about the same price?

FoxEye said:
Throughout this thread and in the other I advocated using authorised resellers and not to pay the full Steam price. Typically the auth resellers are charging approx 2x the grey market price, whilst Steam might be charging 4x the grey market price (outside of sales). We all know Steam is useless unless they've got a sale on.

How many games have I bought from Steam outside of sales? About 2 out of 200. Those were titles I really wanted on release and weren't cheaper elsewhere. Even if I buy on release, GreenMan (etc) are normally cheaper than Steam. But still legit. The difference is, the devs are happy with what the auth resellers are charging. They are appropriate prices for our region.

FoxEye · 4 Feb 2016 at 16:42

Also Boycey, just for you I will say right now I am not completely innocent and untainted

There is 1 game in my Steam library that I purchased from the grey market (a few years back). It left me with such a bad taste in my mouth, to the extent that I have never used the grey market again, and don't intend to.

But yes, that 1 game in my library to this day reminds me how easy it is to abandon your principles. I won't repeat that mistake.

VincentHanna said:
Well Greenmangaming is legit? Surely CD Keys are about the same price?

One is an "authorised reseller" that buys keys direct from the publisher, at prices agreed for their region. (GreenMan)

The other sources their keys from ???? and is not an authorised reseller (CDKeys).

Uncle Petey · 4 Feb 2016 at 16:49

Can you imagine what FoxEye would be like if he was religious or a vegan? :eek:

Jono8 · 4 Feb 2016 at 17:00

FoxEye said:
Throughout this thread and in the other I advocated using authorised resellers and not to pay the full Steam price. Typically the auth resellers are charging approx 2x the grey market price, whilst Steam might be charging 4x the grey market price (outside of sales). We all know Steam is useless unless they've got a sale on.

How many games have I bought from Steam outside of sales? About 2 out of 200. Those were titles I really wanted on release and weren't cheaper elsewhere. Even if I buy on release, GreenMan (etc) are normally cheaper than Steam. But still legit. The difference is, the devs are happy with what the auth resellers are charging. They are appropriate prices for our region.

Also we've discussed my MM purchases (codes from UK graphics cards) to death. I will not concede that purchasing a code from a UK graphics card promotion is the same as buying one from a foreign region. I've outlined the reasons before, and there are plenty who agree with me.

It's fine if you choose to consider them the same thing, but they really aren't.

e: Could I do more to support the devs? Yes, I could. I could choose to pay full Steam RRP. I could buy two copies of every game.

But crucially, I don't actively seek to pay less than the best price available legitimately in the UK. And that, I feel, is all that is required for a clean conscience.

My conscience is clean too, and yes buying an NVidia game code is just another way for you to get a key cheaper by bypassing the full UK retail price.

You would have bought it from the authorised resellers you listed earlier if you care so much about the publishers and paying a fair price. Instead you asked if anyone on here was willing to sell you one for a cheaper price.

If Tomb Raider is only worth £6.70 to the people in Ukraine then that is all it is worth to me as well.

You assume a developer has lost money because I bought the Ukraine version....well if that is the case I am going to assume a developer lost money because you bought a cheap NVidia key of MGS5.I could say they lost a sale from you just as much as you can say they lost a sale from me.

In reality ( I don't know about you and MGS5) but I would not even have entertained the idea of buying Tomb Raider until it was under £10 anyway and would have waited a few months. Therefore the developer has lost nothing and still made a sale at a price they deemed the game was worth.

Do you buy absolutely everything you buy from authorised resellers of the brand/product in question? Do you make sure nothing you ever buy is sourced from outside of UK retail/wholesale channels? My guess is no, because it would be exhausting and stupid.

zophiel · 4 Feb 2016 at 17:00

the savings i make on not buying full RRP ripoff price i spread the wealth to other developers by buying there games too.

Anyway, surely the developers just get paid a wage to make the game. The publishers then add a big % to the price. Unless it a complete indie group. Then most of them go through greenlight for pre purchases for cash or kickstarter campaigns

Boycey0211 · 4 Feb 2016 at 17:03

FoxEye said:
Also Boycey, just for you I will say right now I am not completely innocent and untainted

There is 1 game in my Steam library that I purchased from the grey market (a few years back). It left me with such a bad taste in my mouth, to the extent that I have never used the grey market again, and don't intend to.

But yes, that 1 game in my library to this day reminds me how easy it is to abandon your principles. I won't repeat that mistake.

One is an "authorised reseller" that buys keys direct from the publisher, at prices agreed for their region. (GreenMan)

The other sources their keys from ???? and is not an authorised reseller (CDKeys).

What are you on about abandoning principles lol, I don't pirate games and I'd never buy a stolen key. I will however take advantage of the fact that steam are doubling prices for digital goods based on location.

I've supported devs my fair share too, I've paid £90 each for two games from devs that have consistently made an effort to do something new in a competitive market. EA are not doing that, therefore don't get my £90.

If the games were genuinely worth the asking price, I would always pay it, but they aren't. Games from major devs have taken a nosedive in quality and quantity of content in recent years. Do we just suck it up and keep paying to find out how little content there is? Or not feel as cheated by getting a legit half priced key?

Jono8 · 4 Feb 2016 at 17:05

zophiel said:
the savings i make on not buying full RRP ripoff price i spread the wealth to other developers by buying there games too.

This is a very good point as well. I literally could not afford to spend £40 on every game I buy/wanted and therefore I would probably only buy a couple of games a year. Lower prices therefore results in me buying more games.

FoxEye · 4 Feb 2016 at 17:06

Jono8 said:
My conscience is clean too, and yes buying an NVidia game code is just another way for you to get a key cheaper by bypassing the full UK retail price.

But the full UK retail price was paid. This is the bit you're failing to comprehend.

If - and it's an if because none of us know - Konami decided to sell nVidia a bunch of cheap MGS5 codes, for the UK market, then they did so voluntarily.

I simply took a code from someone who bought a UK graphics card and didn't want the game.

I'm not saying you should not seek to save money, ever, and should always buy everything through Steam. I like getting games cheaper through auth resellers and through GFX card codes. Those codes are sold with the express permission of the publisher, FOR THE UK MARKET.

Does that not make sense?

Boycey0211 said:
If the games were genuinely worth the asking price, I would always pay it, but they aren't. Games from major devs have taken a nosedive in quality and quantity of content in recent years. Do we just suck it up and keep paying to find out how little content there is? Or not feel as cheated by getting a legit half priced key?

So the way to combat perceived lower quality of games is to give the devs less money? What do you think the outcome of that will be? Better games? When they won't have as much money for things like QC?

CyberCrow · 4 Feb 2016 at 17:14

Lmao this thread is ace,every ones blowing smoke up each other an goiing around an around in the same old circle lol.
This has got to be one of the worst an pointless discussions on the forums lol.

Fox it don't matter what you say people will all ways go for the cheaper option, its human nature.

Boycey0211 · 4 Feb 2016 at 17:15

FoxEye said:
So the way to combat perceived lower quality of games is to give the devs less money? What do you think the outcome of that will be? Better games? When they won't have as much money for things like QC?

Well essentially, yes.

So, a AAA game comes out, reviews are mediocre and base price of said game is £60, but I still want to try it knowing I might be disappointed.

In my eyes, I have 2 options. 1, don't buy at all. 2. Buy a LEGIT EU KEY for £30.

By your methods, it would rule out the key site, so I wouldn't buy at all.

Devs have immediately lost out on a sale, even though it was cheaper than they were demanding.

And I wouldnt bring up the QC question. When EA/Dice et al cant be arsed to QC their AAA flagship titles, its not because of sales.

Jono8 · 4 Feb 2016 at 17:16

FoxEye said:
But the full UK retail price was paid. This is the bit you're failing to comprehend.

If - and it's an if because none of us know - Konami decided to sell nVidia a bunch of cheap MGS5 codes, for the UK market, then they did so voluntarily.

I simply took a code from someone who bought a UK graphics card and didn't want the game.

I'm not saying you should not seek to save money, ever, and should always buy everything through Steam. I like getting games cheaper through auth resellers and through GFX card codes. Those codes are sold with the express permission of the publisher, FOR THE UK MARKET.

Does that not make sense?

Yes, I am not disputing that. I am saying that the fact you went down this avenue stopped the developer getting a full UK price which is what you seem so vehemently against.

Also the Nvidia codes specifically state - "Offer may not be substituted, exchanged, sold, or redeemed for cash or other goods ".

But I guess you are ok with being involved in flaunting those terms and conditions :/

FoxEye · 4 Feb 2016 at 17:18

Boycey, where are you buying "legit EU keys" from? That's very different from buying keys priced for India/China/Brazil.

I'm interested to know, because none of the key sites I've looked at told you where the keys were sourced.

Boycey0211 · 4 Feb 2016 at 17:19

FoxEye said:
Boycey, where are you buying "legit EU keys" from? That's very different from buying keys priced for India/China/Brazil.

I'm interested to know, because none of the key sites I've looked at told you where the keys were sourced.

I did mention earlier, CJS cd keys

Region Free

The game keys we are selling are sourced from the EU. They are completely region free and include all languages. This means that since this is a steamworks game, you can activate the key from anywhere in the world. There are absolutely no region locks.

Are the CD Keys Genuine?

Absolutely. We source our games from leading interactive entertainment distributors, and do not condone piracy in any way. None of our activation codes are from illegal key-generators. Each code that is sent to each customer is unique and unused. It authenticates with the official online systems of the game publisher such as Steam or Origin, giving you furthur assurance that you are buying a genuine game.

Doogles · 4 Feb 2016 at 17:20

If there was a problem with grey sites then Steam/Ubi/Origin/GOG would all revoke these keys (like has happened in the past), however this isn't the case most of the time so they must either be legit or only just bordering legit. I am not paying full price for most games the only few exceptions are games I know I will love otherwise I will wait until it has hit a price I am happy with and this seems to come from key sites. Also if you get a region locked game and activate it you can get banned so you run the risk of this if you do decide to go the very cheap route (one I have only made once or twice on secondary accounts).

Armadillo · 4 Feb 2016 at 17:25

Haggisman said:
To counter your analogy of outsourcing CS etc. as consumers, we can choose to use a company which has e.g. a UK based customer support team rather than one in India, and many people do.

Not sure what certain companies having uk support and being able to choose to use/support them has to do with it.

All I'm saying is, if the various publishers can take advantage of the global marketplace, don't complain when consumers do. Have everything in house, complain away. Outsource various stuff for cheapest price, then stfu when consumers do the same.

SE went worldwide and outsourced the port of tomb raider to nixxes in the netherlands. Presumably it was the best option (financially), but when it comes to consumers, nah, you stay in your little corner of the world and buy where we tell you.

Haggisman said:
Don't be surprised if games companies do the same and choose to focus on a market (consoles) which will give them sales at UK prices rather than sales at Indian/Ukrainian/etc. prices

Happens on consoles as well, more on the xbox one because of the easy region switching. Always deals appearing for X on Y marketplace with instructions on how to switch and buy and then go back to your own region.

StrongSad · 4 Feb 2016 at 17:26

FoxEye said:
But the full UK retail price was paid. This is the bit you're failing to comprehend.

If - and it's an if because none of us know - Konami decided to sell nVidia a bunch of cheap MGS5 codes, for the UK market, then they did so voluntarily.

I simply took a code from someone who bought a UK graphics card and didn't want the game.

I'm not saying you should not seek to save money, ever, and should always buy everything through Steam. I like getting games cheaper through auth resellers and through GFX card codes. Those codes are sold with the express permission of the publisher, FOR THE UK MARKET.

Does that not make sense?

So the way to combat perceived lower quality of games is to give the devs less money? What do you think the outcome of that will be? Better games? When they won't have as much money for things like QC?

Proof.... You have zero evidence to back that up. You are assuming that Nvidia paid for the key. It was never going to be retail price though.

I did say this before but you did not reply.
Did you buy a CD key that enriched somebody other than the Developer to save some money?. Was it also a non transferable key.. (terms and conditions of offer to GTX card buyer)

Now I don't think anybody here would say that is a bad thing or something that the suppliers do not know goes on. lets face it, if Nvidia/whoever wanted to stop you selling on promotional keys, they could and would.

I think your issues is with people taking from poorer countries the offers made to them by retailers.... Which is fair comment. Can someone post the prices for some games available in the regions we are talking about? because I am sure they are not that much cheaper in those countries. Interested to know. Genuinely interested in retail prices....

FoxEye · 4 Feb 2016 at 17:26

Jono8 said:
Yes, I am not disputing that. I am saying that the fact you went down this avenue stopped the developer getting a full UK price which is what you seem so vehemently against.

But you don't know how much nV paid Konami for the codes

And neither do I.

Also the Nvidia codes specifically state - "Offer may not be substituted, exchanged, sold, or redeemed for cash or other goods ".

But I guess you are ok with being involved in flaunting those terms and conditions :/

Right, well there you've got a point.

I never read the t&cs, in all honesty. But no, it doesn't bother me. The UK price was paid, the other chap didn't want it, I did.

Games that I've bought from GFX card promotions (and don't feel guilty about, in the slightest) account for 4 out of 200 games in my library, btw.

Strudders said:
I think your issues is with people taking from poorer countries the offers made to them by retailers.... Which is fair comment. Can someone post the prices for some games available in the regions we are talking about? because I am sure they are not that much cheaper in those countries. Interested to know. Genuinely interested in retail prices....

They tend to be <1/2 of the cheapest offer at any time on any of the authorised resellers.

They very much are cheaper. Much cheaper.