Tower block fire - london

[Trusty]

If you'd got to the top, you maybe could have survived, the top looks like it was hardly touched. If people could have got to the top, a helicopter still could have saved people.

Absolutely horrific picture, every room just black..

 

[StriderX]

If you'd got to the top, you maybe could have survived, the top looks like it was hardly touched.

Absolutely horrific picture, every room just black..

You'd be inhaling 500-1000C hot black toxic smoke regardless. Though atleast you'd not burn horrifically like with bare flame.

 

[Trusty]

Really? If you lay down with clothing around your mouth? i know it's all hearsay, we don't really know what the outcome would have been.

 

[jas72]

Ignoring that this has occurred on the doorstep of the UK's most glaring example of wealth inequality is a mistake whichever side of the political divide you feel you come from, those with no ears for the angry need to consider if they have any clue or life experience of what is going on here!

It was a fascinating to read that in the same borough 1 bed apartments were being sold for 1M+ and that the borough is one of the richest in the country.

 

[Tefal]

Really? If you lay down with clothing around your mouth? i know it's all hearsay, we don't really know what the outcome would have been.

rising from all 4 sides would be hot smoke, unless theres a strong side wind (which would blow one sides hot smoke over you, i cant se how fresh air would reach you.

 

[jas72]

wonder if it was one of those bombs waiting to happen that got recalled years ago.

then maybe people can stop blaming the cladding and point the pitch forks elsewhere

so you are saying a fridge explosion was the reason for a fire going from 4th to 23rd floor in 40 minutes?

Come on have you not seen the two streaks of flame cutting up the sides of the building it leads to no other conclusion.

That coupled with cheap plastic windows ....

 

[asim18]

Pre-cladding, the fire would not have spread, anyone with half a brain can see that two sides of the building became an enormous chimney creating huge temperatures which the adjacent windows simply weren't built to withstand, from there fire easily entered homes all the way up the building. It's evident from the live images shown.

Pre-cladding the flames would have done nothing more than blacken the outside concrete/brickwork.

Pre-cladding advice was to stay in your apartment.

Bang on.

Bare building would have gotten hot but there would simply be no path for the fire to go upwards. The silly panels between each window simply created the perfect way for the fire to climb upwards easy like a ladder.

 

[Tefal]

Bang on.

Bare building would have gotten hot but there would simply be no path for the fire to go upwards. The silly panels between each window simply created the perfect way for the fire to climb upwards easy like a ladder.

what about all the flammable things that where reported left in the corridors?

 

[asim18]

what about all the flammable things that where reported left in the corridors?

The corridors would have to be jam packed full of rubbish for it to have a domino effect and trail inside another flat - let alone the ENTIRE building, they are just items dotted around, it's not a trail of petrol . There are still gaps between material/rubbish indoors for things to just burn out without spreading.

Are you telling me there was a perfect trail of flammable items which went all the way from the origin flat right to the flat in the top floor corner?? Just no.

From what I can see the fire spread into other flats through the windows. It's as simple as that. The fire entered through the windows

There's no way items dotted around corridors would cause a fire to spread through the stairs to every single other floor.

The building was designed to contain fire no? So a fire would not just burn up though the floor boards of the person upstairs. There would have to be a perfect route including through the stairs and that is extremely unlikely.

 

[Trusty]

rising from all 4 sides would be hot smoke, unless theres a strong side wind (which would blow one sides hot smoke over you, i cant se how fresh air would reach you.

Yeah, looking at the worst pictures again, there would be no chance, i was thinking the building was wider, sort of allowing an area in the middle that would be relatively untouched.

 

[Rroff]

Really? If you lay down with clothing around your mouth? i know it's all hearsay, we don't really know what the outcome would have been.

Fires are strange things I'd say small chance some of the top might have been possible to survive at but large chance of not.

 

[terley]

I don't understand why everyone is so angry that the true victim count haven't been announced yet..

It would be horrible for people to be confirmed dead if their remains haven't been found..

 

[terley]

Not sure if this has been posted, but this is the crowd sourced google doc list of the missing - it is live and being updated regularly
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1WZjalk4rbj3lLl6XwzSZ6Vt_jq_a68h9miFziD4C_gE/edit#gid=0

 

[dowie]

If you'd got to the top, you maybe could have survived, the top looks like it was hardly touched. If people could have got to the top, a helicopter still could have saved people.

Absolutely horrific picture, every room just black..

only if perhaps there was some maintenance room/area you could have sealed off with wet towels etc.. assuming you even had access to the roof and realised that it would be safer than your flat

alternatively assuming you got there before it was covered with smoke and someone in the emergency services managed to get a helicopter to winch you off it

it is rather unlikely tbh.. on the other hand, if like in LA, there was a helipad and emergency access then perhaps some people could have been saved

 

[Mr Jack]

I don't understand why everyone is so angry that the true victim count haven't been announced yet..

It would be horrible for people to be confirmed dead if their remains haven't been found..

People are angry, that doesn't breed rational responses.

 

[Rroff]

Not sure if this has been posted, but this is the crowd sourced google doc list of the missing - it is live and being updated regularly
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1WZjalk4rbj3lLl6XwzSZ6Vt_jq_a68h9miFziD4C_gE/edit#gid=0

Some of that makes for grim reading :|

 

[dowie]

Not sure if this has been posted, but this is the crowd sourced google doc list of the missing - it is live and being updated regularly
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1WZjalk4rbj3lLl6XwzSZ6Vt_jq_a68h9miFziD4C_gE/edit#gid=0

Crazy how many people are in some of the flats... aside from the new ones they're all 1 and 2 bed flats? Yet there are 7 people in one flat, 6 of them adults. This is sadly perhaps part of the reason why the authorities can't release accurate figures yet - not all the tenants are necessarily officially known, other family members might well be living there or lodgers or visiting friends etc..

 

[B&W]

Crazy how many people are in some of the flats... aside from the new ones they're all 1 and 2 bed flats? Yet there are 7 people in one flat, 6 of them adults. This is sadly perhaps part of the reason why the authorities can't release accurate figures yet - not all the tenants are necessarily officially known, other family members might well be living there or lodgers or visiting friends etc..

Horrific, I just hope all of them suffocated quickly instead of being burned to death. We really need to make these flats better, people should not be suffering like this.

 

[dowie]

I don't understand why everyone is so angry that the true victim count haven't been announced yet..

It would be horrible for people to be confirmed dead if their remains haven't been found..

partly because there has been lots of fake news - if you look at Facebook comments etc.. there is some narrative going around that there were 600 people there and between 150 and 300 dead, stories of 100 bodies at some hospital and a big cover up etc..etc..

as if that wouldn't get found out/exposed by the press pretty quickly

 

[Rroff]

stories of 100 bodies at some hospital and a big cover up etc..etc..

Yeah seems a bit unlikely - it would have been noticed if they were bringing dead out in that number while the event was unfolding and fairly obvious to see that until very recently they've not really even got to the upper floors in any capacity that would have allowed that number to be removed yet and people would certainly notice if they had started removing them in that number now.

On another note video on youtube - can't link to it due to language - of the reaction of the fire crew on one of the first engines to arrive when they first saw what they were arriving to and as someone said in the comments they then still went in even though they were literally gob smacked at what they were encountering.