Air Con Suggestions

As has been said almost all units, for home instalation come pre-charged, however you do need to note that they are pre-charged a set amount to fill a set length of pipework between the interior and exterior units.

All details are in the manuals, but basically if you use a different length of pipework than the recommended length, you will need to alter the amount of gas in the system to get it to work at its most efficient level.

If you need the refrigerant level altered, you will need to call in an F-Gas certified engineer to do the necessary alterations to the amount of gas within the system.

Also if you are extending the pipework, for instance you need the exterior unit further away from the interior than the set length supplied with the kit will allow, you will need the extended pipework and any joints correctly brazed and cleaned and vacuum tested and pressure tested before attaching the extension to the kit system, as any impurities could seriously damage the compressor or other parts of the system, so you will most likely need to call in an installer for that.



The only thing I would add, is that since the change in the law in April this year, I really do not know where the legality of these kits stand now.

Under the new laws, it is illegal to sell any amount of any refrigerant to anyone who is not a certified F-Gas engineer. It is also illegal for unqualified people to work on any equipment filled with any kind of refrigerant, whereby that work might cause some refrigerant to leak out.

These kits come pre-filled, so they are selling refrigerant to unqualified people, and unqualified people will be fitting the kits, and might possibly leak some refrigerant during install, even if by accident. So a few legal pitfalls could occur.

Personally i would not take the risk now, but I guess it is up to the individual.
 
Risk? Worst case you do leak the gas and have to call an installer to re-charge it?

And have the installer report you for leaking gas, and trying to fit the system in the first place, which they are now legally obliged to.

And then you are possibly liable for hefty fines (up to £200,000) as you were trying to fit a system when not qualified, which is apparently a criminal offence now.
 
And have the installer report you for leaking gas, and trying to fit the system in the first place, which they are now legally obliged to.

And then you are possibly liable for hefty fines (up to £200,000) as you were trying to fit a system when not qualified, which is apparently a criminal offence now.
I thought refrigerant gas was safe these days.
 
As has been said almost all units, for home instalation come pre-charged, however you do need to note that they are pre-charged a set amount to fill a set length of pipework between the interior and exterior units.

All details are in the manuals, but basically if you use a different length of pipework than the recommended length, you will need to alter the amount of gas in the system to get it to work at its most efficient level.

If you need the refrigerant level altered, you will need to call in an F-Gas certified engineer to do the necessary alterations to the amount of gas within the system.

Also if you are extending the pipework, for instance you need the exterior unit further away from the interior than the set length supplied with the kit will allow, you will need the extended pipework and any joints correctly brazed and cleaned and vacuum tested and pressure tested before attaching the extension to the kit system, as any impurities could seriously damage the compressor or other parts of the system, so you will most likely need to call in an installer for that.



The only thing I would add, is that since the change in the law in April this year, I really do not know where the legality of these kits stand now.

Under the new laws, it is illegal to sell any amount of any refrigerant to anyone who is not a certified F-Gas engineer. It is also illegal for unqualified people to work on any equipment filled with any kind of refrigerant, whereby that work might cause some refrigerant to leak out.

These kits come pre-filled, so they are selling refrigerant to unqualified people, and unqualified people will be fitting the kits, and might possibly leak some refrigerant during install, even if by accident. So a few legal pitfalls could occur.

Personally i would not take the risk now, but I guess it is up to the individual.

Best tell halfords, they're still selling it to anyone that wants it. They have a bit about a change in law, but suggest it's still okay to sell to anyone not in the trade. Or is it another one of those laws that's designed to keep certain people in a job when it's fairly easy to diy it.

https://www.halfords.com/motoring/engine-oils-fluids/air-con/ez-chill-auto-air-conditioning-recharge
 
And have the installer report you for leaking gas, and trying to fit the system in the first place, which they are now legally obliged to.

And then you are possibly liable for hefty fines (up to £200,000) as you were trying to fit a system when not qualified, which is apparently a criminal offence now.
This doesnt mean that there is any risk in buying it and installing it, and then getting a local installer to just evac the system and release the gas. The legislation (or rather fines) are against the proven release of gas to atmosphere...
 
The new legislation and fines cover the sale of ANY refrigeration gas to a non certified person.

So legally no one without full F-Gas certification can buy or sell any refrigeration gas whether that gas is supplied is in a small canister, or included in a ready to fit system, or any other method of delivery.

The new legislation and fines also cover the installation of ANY refrigeration system by a none qualified person.

They also cover the accidental or deliberate release of ANY refrigeration gas, by anyone, qualified or not.

The deliberate release has been a criminal act for a while, but there was no penalty for accidental release, but they have now expanded that, so that an accidental release is now liable to a civil penalty, of up to £100,000.

Basically the legislation now requires you to be fully F-Gas certified to buy, install, or work on ANY refrigeration, air conditioning, heat pump, or environmental system, that uses any gas covered by F-Gas Certification, be it a domestic, commercial, or industrial system.


https://www.coolingpost.com/uk-news/f-gas-violators-face-200000-fines/
 
I dont read that as any risk for buying the equipment and then not commissioning it. Although i do find it amusing that big retailers such as applicances direct continue to sell full AC systems to anyone, as it is clearly in contravention of the above.
 
If you are non certified, you cannot buy any refridgeration gas, and as a retailer they should not sell it to any one who is not certified.

If that gas is in a pre charged split air kit, or a easy fill top up canister, or in a commercial cylinder, makes no difference.
 
Yeah, we get it :p It is amusing that the retailers do not seem to have caught onto this.

As a normal purchaser, no real risk, though. Just play it safe by getting a local installer to make the final connections and test it all before the gas is released.
 
The risk for a normal purchaser is that ALL certified installers have to, by law, notify the authorities of any refridgerant purchases by non certified people, that they come across.

So when, as you say you call the installer to make the final connections and release the pre charge into the system, they then report you to the authorities for having purchased the system, in the first place.

If you buy an empty two part split air system, and get the installer to add in the gas (not just release pre charged) then you will be ok.
 
Just waiting for them to start selling R1234YF, My car takes this and it not being used in normal a/c plant or chiller.

Got plenty of R134a and a little R410a sitting at home.
 
I am currently converting a couple of our small environmental chambers to run on 1234yf.
Its just so damn expensive.
Our supplier does 5kg of 404a at about £280
5kg of 1234yf is over £750 :eek::eek:
 
Blimey, I been to talking to a lot of engineers and they have all been complaining about the price of refrigerant.

I went to my old site which has several plants that runs on R507 and a 1 ton cylinder (780kg) is about £30k.

One of the systems has 25,000 Kg of the stuff!!
 
Just waiting for them to start selling R1234YF, My car takes this and it not being used in normal a/c plant or chiller.

Got plenty of R134a and a little R410a sitting at home.

It'll get cheaper once and more commercial installations start to use it - I stocked up on R134a and 410 when I heard they were "being phased out".
The latest and greatest is R77 - nothing but CO2, in few years it'll be standard for mobile AC as well, I'd bet.

The risk for a normal purchaser is that ALL certified installers have to, by law, notify the authorities of any refridgerant purchases by non certified people, that they come across.

So when, as you say you call the installer to make the final connections and release the pre charge into the system, they then report you to the authorities for having purchased the system, in the first place.

If you buy an empty two part split air system, and get the installer to add in the gas (not just release pre charged) then you will be ok.

Balls. Read up on your F-gas certification.

If you are non certified, you cannot buy any refridgeration gas, and as a retailer they should not sell it to any one who is not certified.

If that gas is in a pre charged split air kit, or a easy fill top up canister, or in a commercial cylinder, makes no difference.

More - were you listening, the last time you did your cert?

If you are non certified, you cannot buy any refridgeration gas, and as a retailer they should not sell it to any one who is not certified.

If that gas is in a pre charged split air kit, or a easy fill top up canister, or in a commercial cylinder, makes no difference.

Complete rubbish.
 
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Some of the modern mini-splits have a COP as high as 4:1, so 400% efficiency. Obviously this is dependent on circumstances..

If you have Solar PV on the property as well, you can take the 1kW of solar generated and turn it into 3-4kW of Heating/cooling. Thats free, as you are using on-site generated power (ie your heating/cooling is falling from the sky!)

What are you talking about? 3-4kW from 1kW? That's impossible. So is 400% efficiency.

If you could get 3-4kW from 1kW you would be very, very rich, but would also have broken the laws of physics.
 
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