Washing machine problem

Merlin5 said:
That's a good idea about using a tyre air inflator, 50p a pop rather than £6 a can for compressed air. In this video, is the armature he inspects at 1:11 the same as a commutator?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HELgV4KOsT0&t=1m11s


I can undo the bolts to remove the motor, but there's a white plastic lever/latch thing with a thin wire attached which might prove tricky to take off in order to get the motor off, but I'll give it a go.
You can see it top left in this photo. https://i.postimg.cc/jjFX2ZBh/Motor.jpg


Also, just below it, maybe that silver cylinder is the capacitor, or perhaps there's more than one capacitor?
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Yes, that's the commutator - if you spin the motor while applying very fine sandpaper to it, it should clean up. Try to keep consistent pressure, but also be gentle to avoid snapping any of the contacts.

I'm not sure what that plastic arm is - it could be a tachometer or tensioner, but I have no idea.

And aye, best keep away from that capacitor. :eek:
 
darael said:
Yes, that's the commutator - if you spin the motor while applying very fine sandpaper to it, it should clean up. Try to keep consistent pressure, but also be gentle to avoid snapping any of the contacts.

I'm not sure what that plastic arm is - it could be a tachometer or tensioner, but I have no idea.

And aye, best keep away from that capacitor. :eek:
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Can I get a shock from sticking my fingers in the motor to touch the commutator, and why do you say stay away from the capacitor, because of electric shock too?
 
Merlin5 said:
Can I get a shock from sticking my fingers in the motor to touch the commutator, and why do you say stay away from the capacitor, because of electric shock too?
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You can never really tell if capacitors hold a charge until you've either measured them or had a zap of them - something that size could potentially stop your heart. You could short out the contacts on the capacitor with a screwdriver first, or connect a 240v bulb to it and you might see it glow for a second as it discharges.

As long as the motor is disconnected, you should be fine to be honest. But I prefer to err on the side of caution.

Disclamer: I should mention that I am not an electronics expert. :D
 
Hmm, in that case, if removing the motor involves anything to do with handling the capacitor, I'll just leave the motor where it is, **** the commutator and just buy an ecobubble. :D Unless of course the machine works properly again after installing the new brushes.
 
Merlin5 said:
Hmm, in that case, if removing the motor involves anything to do with handling the capacitor, I'll just leave the motor where it is, **** the commutator and just buy an ecobubble. :D Unless of course the machine works properly again after installing the new brushes.
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To be honest, you'll probably be completely fine if you're just disconnecting the motor using the white plastic block. Just be sensible and don't touch the capacitor.

I suspect you've had the machine unplugged for at least 24 hours now? If so, the chances of getting a shock from are much reduced.
 
At least look at the commuator before putting in new brushes ... ... I would also clean/square-up existing brushes with emery paper, before dropping in new brushes that you might not need, and can usually send back.

I've bought parts before online in case I need them, and return if I don't
 
I forgot to say, if the brushes are the cause of the fault then yes it should be fine without cleaning the commutator. But bear in mind that cleaning the commutator will not increase the life of the new brushes, it will also allow the motor to work more efficiently as there will be better contact.

Either way, if you clean it or not, once you install the brushes and run the machine on a long wash cycle with nothing inside it. If you have the option, also enable slow/half spin speed. For your next wash, keep the load to about a quarter of what you'd normally put in. Then increase to half on the next wash and 3/4 on the load after that. This will help bed the brushes in gently as they take shape to the commutator.

I've had brushes on my old Bosch replaced a couple of times and the first muppet of an engineer told me to run a normal load and I was none the wiser at the time. He also didn't take the time to blow out the old carbon dust that had built up over time. The machine acted weirdly during spin cycles as the brushes were bedding in.

The second time I had them changed, I used another company who, without prompt from me, warned me to do light loads and slowly increase how much I put in for the first few washes. He also took the time to blow the dust out from the motor and things went much smoother for me.
 
Yes, I'm on the verge of buying a Samsung Ecobubble 7kg or 8kg tomorrow from John Lewis which I should be able to get for £299.


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darael said:
@Merlin5
How did it go?
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Still not working with new brushes. Waste of £22. :( I'm currently editing a video to show you what's going on during a cycle including buzzing sounds. I'll upload it later. It's the only way you might be able to give me a better idea of what's wrong with it.

I think my old brushes were probably fine. The length of the new ones is the same meaning my old ones were barely worn down. I smoothed them with sandpaper but then one of the carbon pieces fell out the holder to somewhere at the bottom of the machine while fitting it. Can't be arsed to find it so I installed the new ones. I can't get proper access to clean the commutator, but in the video, I show it being rotated by me rotating the drive belt, so maybe you'll get an idea if it looks ok or not.

There have been a couple of instances today where during a rinse cycle the drum made a few clockwise rotations to agitate the clothes, filled with more water, then drum made a few anticlockwise rotations. Other than that, I've not been able to get it to rotate again. it just fills with water, then stops, I have to manually nudge the dial to move it on at which point it will make a buzzing noise. Move it on again, fill with more water, and so on. Eventually I'm able to get it to drain the water and open the door to an empty drum. In the video you'll hear the gurgling from the pipes under the kitchen sink when it removes the water.

Not just that, but when I use just the dryer part of the machine, again, no drum turning and an even louder buzzing noise. I demonstrate that in the video too.

I've no idea if there's a motor issue, circuit board issue, capacitor, solenoid, or if it's even worth trying to unclip the drainage hose and see if there's a blockage. When you hear the buzzing in the video, perhaps that'll help you tell me if you think there's an electric issue or not. I'm not prepared to mess around with any electrics in it. The only thing left I'm prepared to try is seeing if there's a blockage, but it looks like it might be difficult to get the clip off where the drain hose is connected in the machine.
 
Age of machine to me shows its only worth replacing. Pointless trying to fix buddy. You could throw a lot of money at it and still end up with a faulty beast.
 
Yep, I'm throwing no more money at it. If it's even worth seeing if there's a blockage, that'll be my last ditch effort before binning it.
 
Here's my video. I've shortened lots of bits that just go on for several minutes but feel free to skip through it, I only wanted to give an idea of what's happening. Starts with me rotating the commutator. Then the machine during a rinse cycle, the buzzing and no drum turning, stopping and manually moving the dial, water being drained out and opening the door. Then I turn the drier on and you'll hear the louder noise and no rotation.

 
Did you happen to notice where the buzzing was coming from? That sounds like the door linterlock, but I'm not sure - when I first heard it I thought it was the pump but it seemed to drain okay.

You've nothing to lose now, so I would wrap a piece of sandpaper around a small piece of wood and gently press it against the commutator while turning the motor to see if that cleans it. But to be honest, I'm not sure that's your problem - the burnt wires might be damaged enough to stop the motor working, but I am only guessing.

If it were me and I couldn't get it working, I'd buy a new Bosch - pretty much what I did a few months ago when my old Bosch became uneconomical to repair. Personally I don't like Samsung machines, but would consider an LG at a stretch.
 
darael, in my video, when I get close to the window of the drum, the buzzing is louder than when I move away towards the buttons above it, so I suppose it could be to do with the door lock? I thought it was the motor. The motor is located at the top (top right as you look at the machine from the front) at the back of the machine. But at the end of the video when I'm trying to get the drier to work, the buzzing is much louder. So, I dunno, jammed motor or capacitor problem? Do you think it's worth checking for a blockage or do you think that noise says it's an electrical fault?

I remember this machine kept tripping my fuse box at the time that it was working properly, so personally I think the motor is buggered. It probably is the commutator that needs cleaning to be honest but I've lost the motivation :p

I looked at every brand today in Currys and tested every door for the most comfortable grip. Hoover, Hotpoint, Bosch, Candy, Indesit, Beko, Grundig, LG, Samsung. Samsung and Grundig have 5 year warranties, LG too I think. Bosch 2 years, and everything else 1 year. Bosch is great, I've got a Bosch oven and it's so reliable. But the only washing machines that particularly appealed to me aesthetically are Samsung, Grundig and LG. Samsung wins it for me on price. They've got an 8kg Samsung Ecobubble reduced to £349 at the moment. If I can get John Lewis to price match and then use my John Lewis £50 gift voucher that I've had for ages, I might be able to get it for £299!

https://postimg.cc/m1M11F56

As my Hotpoint fills with hot and cold water and the Samsung only fills with cold, I've been advised to cap the hot water inlet. Can you possibly tell me where I would get a cap to cap it off and do they come in different sizes? I don't want to pay £25 for them to connect me, I'm guessing it should be easy enough for me to do?
 
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I've been doing a quick Google and the capacitor is something that came out which I didn't think of to be honest. I don't know how to test capacitors properly, but maybe somebody here could?

I had also wondered about the jammed motor and was hoping towards the end of your video you would spin the drum, which you did. It sounds like the drum bearings might be shot, but I can't be sure. Does the drum seem to wiggle a lot if you move it about? Like a sort of clicking noise if you move it up and turn or back and forward. I ask because if you watch your video, you can see a hell of a lot of movement between the drum and door seal at 3:45. If the bearings were gone, this would increase the strain on the motor and also make the machine even more uneconomical to repair.

The makes in your list that I would avoid like the plague are Hoover, Hotpoint, Candy, Indesit, Beko and Grundig. Samsung might be okay, but I'd prefer Bosch or LG.

I also have hot and cold outlets for my washer, but I didn't cap the hot water off when I got my first cold fill machine. I just turned it off using the small red lever and it's been good ever since. If you want to buy a cap, just visit a plumbers merchant and you will probably get one for less than £5.

Connecting the machine is a doddle, connect the cold water pipe to your outlets and push the drainage hose down the grey waste standpipe - just make sure the drainage hose isn't too low.
 
Mine stopped spinning the other week.

6 screws to take the back off, 2 big bolts to loosen the motor, unplug the loom, replace with genuine £90 motor off Amazon, do above in reverse.

The new motor is much quieter too.
 
On mine, looks like there's also a ground wire to unscrew and some pulley mechanism. Can't find my motor on Amazon but espares sell it for £139. Nah, I want the Samsung now. I'll miss having a dryer. Although tbh, I'd not used it for years.


darael said:
I've been doing a quick Google and the capacitor is something that came out which I didn't think of to be honest. I don't know how to test capacitors properly, but maybe somebody here could?

I had also wondered about the jammed motor and was hoping towards the end of your video you would spin the drum, which you did. It sounds like the drum bearings might be shot, but I can't be sure. Does the drum seem to wiggle a lot if you move it about? Like a sort of clicking noise if you move it up and turn or back and forward. I ask because if you watch your video, you can see a hell of a lot of movement between the drum and door seal at 3:45. If the bearings were gone, this would increase the strain on the motor and also make the machine even more uneconomical to repair.

The makes in your list that I would avoid like the plague are Hoover, Hotpoint, Candy, Indesit, Beko and Grundig. Samsung might be okay, but I'd prefer Bosch or LG.

I also have hot and cold outlets for my washer, but I didn't cap the hot water off when I got my first cold fill machine. I just turned it off using the small red lever and it's been good ever since. If you want to buy a cap, just visit a plumbers merchant and you will probably get one for less than £5.

Connecting the machine is a doddle, connect the cold water pipe to your outlets and push the drainage hose down the grey waste standpipe - just make sure the drainage hose isn't too low.
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Interesting, I didn't expect Grundig to be on the bad list.
Oh I won't be testing any capacitors, I'm not confident I wouldn't kill myself, lol. And I think I've seen two capacitors in this machine. I haven't wiggled the drum much but it feels pretty solid to me when I spin it. Thanks for the advice on plumbing it in and capping it, that gives me confidence.

If you check my opening post, there's a photo of my inlet and outlet hoses. That outlet hose raises up, through a gap in the adjoining cupboard and goes to the spigot under the sink, so yeah I believe the height is fine.
 
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I've disconnected the drain hose from under the sink no problem. But I can't turn the red wheel to disconnect the hot water pipe.

Also, I just found out that turning the longer red lever to 'off' stops all hot water to my sink, so I just needed to turn the smaller red valve next to the wheel. Thing is, I can't undo the red wheel by hand as it's too tight, and I don't have pliers wide enough. I'll need to buy some when I get a cap, probably from toolstation. Can you recommend me a pair of pliers or a tool I'll need to undo that wheel?

Edit: ah, I just found some large adjustable pliers that fit.

20191108-112321.jpg
 
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