Intel 10th Gen Comet Lake thread

[humbug]

There is no need to be so aggressive calling people fools - maybe they only justify their relations with Intel.

But AMD is the indisputable market/technology/innovation leader in the x86-64 ecosystem.
You have:
- N7 process node vs 14nm process node;
- PCIe 4 vs PCIe 3;
- 65-watt Ryzen 7 3700X and 15-watt Ryzen 7 4800U vs 125-watt Core i9-10900K;
- innovation regarding chiplets design vs old approach with monolithic dies which has limits on core-count;
- cheap vs expensive.

Add 64Bit X86 to that, X86_64 in windows, AMD64 is what's widely used in Linux based servers.

Intel started 64Bit with Itanium but after a decade of trying to get it to work it was AMD who had the breakthrough with AMD64 in 2003 with Opteron and a year later with the Athlon64 Desktop CPU's, by this stage AMD had integrated AMD64 into X86, that's how we have X86_64

Intel tried to compete by actually making Itanium CPU's with how far they had got with development, but they were large, inefficient slow and crap, Intel gave up eventually and adopted X86_64, now AMD and Intel are tied at the hip, it could have been very different, AMD integrated AMD64 into X86 because Intel wanted to cancel AMD's X86 Licence, now they can't because if they do that they lose 64Bit.

Edit: also add first X86 multicore CPU's to that list with the Athlon X2 and X4.

I have said it before and i'll say it again, i rate AMD way above Intel when it comes to technology development ability.

 

[Kelt]

Intel is still tops when it comes to stagnation ability, though, kudos where kudos is due.

 

[humbug]

Intel is still tops when it comes to stagnation ability, though, kudos where kudos is due.

lol...

 

[chrcoluk]

So word is that z490 is not selling well at all (not surprised). Expect some price cuts.

Z490 and PCI-4.0 will need popcorn budget also.

At the prices boards are at

You guys may wanna start saving for rocket lake next year. Word is Both Nvidia and AMD new graphics cards at the top of the range saturate gen 3 x16 pcie slots so 10th gen or earlier Intel systems will see reduced performance until 11th gen arrives next year.

They wont be anywhere near it, my 1080ti peaks at about 7% of gen 3 16x, The average load is below 3% of bus bandwidth. So if we add a couple of generations, they not going to be 10+ times faster on bus bandwidth. I have even been stating in comments sections on motherboard reviews I think its a huge waste of valuable pcie resources to assign so much bandwidth to the gpu slot. e.g. I would think it better to have a 8x slot and as a result 2 extra nvme slots at 4x each without using the shared board bandwidth. The gpu's wouldnt slow down at all, I think that could be done at pcie gen 3 never mind gen 4, I think at gen 4 you could have the slot at 4x, and no noticeable gpu slowdowns.

I think gigabyte on one of their boards, made it so if certain nvme slots get used the primary pcie slot drops to 8x, I think hardware unboxed mentioned it in a video.

 

[Grim5]

At the prices boards are at


They wont be anywhere near it, my 1080ti peaks at about 7% of gen 3 16x, The average load is below 3% of bus bandwidth. So if we add a couple of generations, they not going to be 10+ times faster on bus bandwidth. I have even been stating in comments sections on motherboard reviews I think its a huge waste of valuable pcie resources to assign so much bandwidth to the gpu slot. e.g. I would think it better to have a 8x slot and as a result 2 extra nvme slots at 4x each without using the shared board bandwidth. The gpu's wouldnt slow down at all, I think that could be done at pcie gen 3 never mind gen 4, I think at gen 4 you could have the slot at 4x, and no noticeable gpu slowdowns.

I think gigabyte on one of their boards, made it so if certain nvme slots get used the primary pcie slot drops to 8x, I think hardware unboxed mentioned it in a video.

I'll belive Nvidia first, they belive pcie4 will make a difference so until benchmarks say otherwise I will side with them

I mean heck, the 5700xt already benefits from pcie4 in some games - what do you think cards that are twice as fast are gonna do

 

[humbug]

Some Comet Lake Z490 boards may not support Rocket Lake afterall, so possibly no PCIe4 on some Z490. Intel has the change some VRMs, Rocket Lake is not Effient.

Nvidia are pushing Ampere to be performance tested on Ryzen through fears of PCIe3 bottlenecking.

https://youtu.be/onZqz0JYtMQ?t=1369

 

[Destination]

It would appear Intel are sorting out their problems with a rebranding exercise.
Intel
Intel Inside
Intel Core
Intel Faff powered by Core
with test terms they will confuse the market and once again gain market share.

 

[tyler_jrb]

They wont be anywhere near it, my 1080ti peaks at about 7% of gen 3 16x, The average load is below 3% of bus bandwidth. So if we add a couple of generations, they not going to be 10+ times faster on bus bandwidth. I have even been stating in comments sections on motherboard reviews I think its a huge waste of valuable pcie resources to assign so much bandwidth to the gpu slot. e.g. I would think it better to have a 8x slot and as a result 2 extra nvme slots at 4x each without using the shared board bandwidth. The gpu's wouldnt slow down at all, I think that could be done at pcie gen 3 never mind gen 4, I think at gen 4 you could have the slot at 4x, and no noticeable gpu slowdowns.

I tend to agree. It's a nice thing to have pcie gen 4.0. But it likely won't make much if any difference on next gen cards. Most games don't even benefit from 8x-16x with a 2080Ti. So say a 3080 at 30% faster won't max 3.0 16x. Even a 3090 again is unlikely to do so.

The vast majority of games notice minimal gains going from even pcie 2.0 16x to pcie 4.0 16x with 5700XT. Nvidia saying to reviewers use pcie 4.0 in my eyes means maybe the performance gap isn't as massive as we all hoped and so use 4.0 for those extra percentage point/s.

However will still be interesting to see if it does on next gen or not. I'm not forking out £14-1500 for a 3090 or sidegrading to a 3080 so for me it hasn't become something i'm immediately worried about.

 

[shamus21]

Some Comet Lake Z490 boards may not support Rocket Lake afterall, so possibly no PCIe4 on some Z490. Intel has the change some VRMs, Rocket Lake is not Effient.

Nvidia are pushing Ampere to be performance tested on Ryzen through fears of PCIe3 bottlenecking.

https://youtu.be/onZqz0JYtMQ?t=1369

I have said before this will be an issue. If you want PCIe 4 on a Intel motherboard you would be better of waiting for next years new chipset. At best you will get some sort of halfway house job with the current batch of Z490 boards.

 

[fx1]

There is no need to be so aggressive calling people fools - maybe they only justify their relations with Intel.

But AMD is the indisputable market/technology/innovation leader in the x86-64 ecosystem.
You have:
- N7 process node vs 14nm process node;
- PCIe 4 vs PCIe 3;
- 65-watt Ryzen 7 3700X and 15-watt Ryzen 7 4800U vs 125-watt Core i9-10900K;
- innovation regarding chiplets design vs old approach with monolithic dies which has limits on core-count;
- cheap vs expensive.

I call BS.

Its taken AMD all this time and a process node advantage and they still cant outperform intel. So on AMD's best day and intels worst they still cannot beat intel in games and single threaded performance. All they can do is cut prices and give more cores.

£430 10 core 20 thread 10850k 5.2ghz is a great CPU on a solid Z490 platform. PCIe Gen 4 is pointless. To the people on here who know very little about how bandwidth works. Adding more lanes to the motorway doesnt increase the 70mph limit. With the death of SLI its even less important now than ever.

Over the years the AMD sytems i have owned have always had problems with drivers and other gremlins my intel systems just dont have.

Im glad AMD can finally compete with intel (kind of) Without AMD id never get a 10 core 5.2ghz for £430.

 

[humbug]

I call BS.

Its taken AMD all this time and a process node advantage and they still cant outperform intel. So on AMD's best day and intels worst they still cannot beat intel in games and single threaded performance. All they can do is cut prices and give more cores.

£430 10 core 20 thread 10850k 5.2ghz is a great CPU on a solid Z490 platform. PCIe Gen 4 is pointless. To the people on here who know very little about how bandwidth works. Adding more lanes to the motorway doesnt increase the 70mph limit. With the death of SLI its even less important now than ever.

Over the years the AMD sytems i have owned have always had problems with drivers and other gremlins my intel systems just dont have.

Im glad AMD can finally compete with intel (kind of) Without AMD id never get a 10 core 5.2ghz for £430.

5 year old account with 3 posts and he comes on to defend Intel, you're way too late.

 

[pete910]

 

[fx1]

5 year old account with 3 posts and he comes on to defend Intel, you're way too late.

Im building a NV 3090 rig with a 10850K.

If AMD was better i would use that. But its not so it really doesnt matter.

Its hilarious how people who own AMD chips come to the Intel Comet lake thread to call people trolls.

I buy what ever is best performance for games.

I find it hilarious that AMD can finally compete but not really win in gaming still. Ive been around long enough to know that it will be short lived. Intel has the $$ to maintain its advantage longer term. AMD advantages are never clear cut and even shorter lived.

Ive had plenty of hassle over the years with AMD's dog crap drivers and chipset support bugs. Their validation sucks. Their GPU drivers are just as bad. They trail Nvidia in software no different.

Im sure an AMD rig is a great budget build for some. I just dont do budget.

 

[humbug]

Im building a NV 3090 rig with a 10850K.

If AMD was better i would use that. But its not so it really doesnt matter.

Its hilarious how people who own AMD chips come to the Intel Comet lake thread to call people trolls.

I buy what ever is best performance for games.

I find it hilarious that AMD can finally compete but not really win in gaming still. Ive been around long enough to know that it will be short lived. Intel has the $$ to maintain its advantage longer term. AMD advantages are never clear cut and even shorter lived.

Ive had plenty of hassle over the years with AMD's dog crap drivers and chipset support bugs. Their validation sucks. Their GPU drivers are just as bad. They trail Nvidia in software no different.

Im sure an AMD rig is a great budget build for some. I just dont do budget.

The problem is you called out what @4K8KW10 said without offering a single dispute to anything he said, you just did what classic strawmen would do, have done and still do and that is to counter with "AMD not as good as Intel because gaming" as if :A we would disagree Intel get higher FPS in most game, for now, and :B as if that is all that matters, as if it overrides everything else because if as a Strawman that is the only thing you have it must. Right?

A lot of people simply don't care about 10% more FPS at 1080P with the fastest GPU, they might care more that they can complete their other hobbies in half the time while dumping half the thermal waste into their room. Those are valuable traits to have in a product too and for people who appreciate those traits yes it absolutely does make that product superior to the other.

BTW, referring to AMD's CPU's as "budget alternatives" because they cost less also doesn't win you anyone over to your argument, it shows a serious lack of good faith in your arguments.

 

[Grim5]

Im building a NV 3090 rig with a 10850K.

If AMD was better i would use that. But its not so it really doesnt matter.

Its hilarious how people who own AMD chips come to the Intel Comet lake thread to call people trolls.

I buy what ever is best performance for games.

I find it hilarious that AMD can finally compete but not really win in gaming still. Ive been around long enough to know that it will be short lived. Intel has the $$ to maintain its advantage longer term. AMD advantages are never clear cut and even shorter lived.

Ive had plenty of hassle over the years with AMD's dog crap drivers and chipset support bugs. Their validation sucks. Their GPU drivers are just as bad. They trail Nvidia in software no different.

Im sure an AMD rig is a great budget build for some. I just dont do budget.

The thing is if AMD owners didn't participate in this thread it would be totally dead because the 10 people who own a 10th gen cpu isn't enough to keep this thread alive

 

[Deleted User 456458]

The thing is if AMD owners didn't participate in this thread it would be totally dead because the 10 people who own a 10th gen cpu isn't enough to keep this thread alive

why does a thread need to be kept alive?

Anyway, CML has good appeal to the oc community esp with its imc being the strongest ever for dual channel. You just won’t find that audience here.

 

[Journey]

Anyway, CML has good appeal to the oc community esp with its imc being the strongest ever for dual channel. You just won’t find that audience here.

I know the 10th Gen chips are feat of engineering for Intel, but claiming they have good appeal to the OC community is literally because there is nothing else, it doesn't make them good chips to overclock, they are boring as heck. Why you rely on having an good IMC to make overclocking interesting, something, somewhere went horribly wrong.

 

[Grim5]

why does a thread need to be kept alive?

Fair enough. Hopefully 11th gen is a better CPU

 

[fx1]

The thing is if AMD owners didn't participate in this thread it would be totally dead because the 10 people who own a 10th gen cpu isn't enough to keep this thread alive

The chips must be selling so badly that i have had to keep looking around to find a decent deal on the 10850k. The 10900k is price gauged the 6 and 8 core K SKU's are always out of stock. There was 67 10900ks in stock somewhere and i came to order and it sold out before i pressed checkout. Amazon hasnt seen stock for ages.

People seem to over estimate the "productivity" market on forums. It really isnt that popular from the self build custom market. Far more people game for a hobby than do anything like video editing. So gaming is the most important metric for most high end PC's You only have to look how Nvidia are dominating the tech news with their new GPU's.

Productivity probably isnt even 1% of the market that gaming is. AMD has taken market share in the low end space because of value for money and finally catching up with IPC. Lets not confuse that with being faster or better for 95% of situations.

 

[Journey]

The 10900k is price gauged the 6 and 8 core K SKU's are always out of stock.

Don't for one minute confuse lack of supply, with high demand. Intel are suffering still from the fallout from '18/'19 shortages due to 10nm being, well not being really, so they are limited as to what they can supply.

Trying to save face by releasing a product with 10c/20t just to try and keep up says an awful lot about the position they have gotten themselves into, nothing speaks more than this.