Are EV’s really the way to go?
- Thread starter inflames
- Start date
It looks like it's exhaust pipe has just been violated...
Caporegime
What exhaust pipe?
Soldato
Most people working for the NHS or local councils aren't rich. But they do need a car to get to work, and paying £400 a month for a BEV and £100 for electric is a very attractive deal compared to £300 a month for an ICE + £200+ for dinosaur juice. Especially after spending the last few months queueing for fuel.
An abundance of used leased EVs will improve the 2nd hand market in a few years as well.
This comes back to the ‘how are people affording cars thread’ and not this one.
People have different priorities and you can’t really compare buying and running a used car to a new one.
People buy new cars because they want them, not because they need them. The irony is that if people stop buying new cars for what ever reason (like in 2020-2022), used car prices utterly rocket and become unaffordable for those people who buy cheap used cars.
As the above poster said, if you want a new car, it’s entirely sensible to consider a BEV and basically comes down to the cost to run for X years by what ever method. Right now owning rather than leasing is very much the better option if you have the cash due to the strong residuals.
If anything the people who leased new cars, particularly BEVs are probably kicking themselves right now given how much they would have spent on them (particularly those who took them out in 2019). The leasing companies are making a killing on BEV leases right now due to the crazy residuals.
I could trade in my Model 3 after 6 months and get nearly all my money back, madness.
People have different priorities and you can’t really compare buying and running a used car to a new one.
People buy new cars because they want them, not because they need them. The irony is that if people stop buying new cars for what ever reason (like in 2020-2022), used car prices utterly rocket and become unaffordable for those people who buy cheap used cars.
As the above poster said, if you want a new car, it’s entirely sensible to consider a BEV and basically comes down to the cost to run for X years by what ever method. Right now owning rather than leasing is very much the better option if you have the cash due to the strong residuals.
If anything the people who leased new cars, particularly BEVs are probably kicking themselves right now given how much they would have spent on them (particularly those who took them out in 2019). The leasing companies are making a killing on BEV leases right now due to the crazy residuals.
I could trade in my Model 3 after 6 months and get nearly all my money back, madness.
Soldato
There's plenty of decent lease deals around. At least, there was in January when I signed up, prices have gone up a bit since then.
In total, I'll pay 31% of the retail price over 3 years for my lease. If I'd bought new instead, considering inflation over those 3 years I'd probably need to sell a 3 year old car for around 75% of it's original value to break even. That's without the cost of the finance to buy or, if you have the money upfront, without considering the benefit of saving/investing that money.
It could go either way, maybe I would have been better off to buy, maybe not. It's not going to be a big enough difference that i'm kicking myself over the choice however.
Wife is NHS and we get our EV (Kia E-Niro) next Friday under a salary sacrfice scheme. £204 p/m for 3 years. We spend (or spent) £317 per month (average) just on diesel. If I charge the Kia at home all the time, under my current tarrif it will cost me £92.48 per month to charge (average).
So for less than we would have spent in diesel we can have a brand new car plus all the running costs. Then factor in no servicing costs, no MOT costs, no repair costs, no breakdown cover needed, no tyre replacement, no insurance required, we should save somewhere in the region of £200 per month - and never need to worry about fuel shortage's.
Soldato
Residuals are really strong. A colleague did a trade in for his 3 year old M3LR with Tesla and got £500 more than he paid for it new!
Yup, those who leased Tesla Model 3’s in 2019 must really be kicking themselves.
Paying £450-600 a month for 2-3 years and then the lease company getting almost as much, if not more for the car than they originally paid for it when they sell it. That’s due to a combination of big RRP rises, the OZEV grant at the time and incredible residuals. That is some mega profit for those lease companies.
Compare that to those that bought them with cash, on finance or PCP are basically able to get their money back.
On the actual topic of this thread, I very much agree with this guy's perspective:
and particular this part:
Where I live, it is pointless driving if you just need to transport yourself and little else as you spend most of the time sitting in traffic. My average speed in my car over the past 3 months is 16.5mph.
and particular this part:
Where I live, it is pointless driving if you just need to transport yourself and little else as you spend most of the time sitting in traffic. My average speed in my car over the past 3 months is 16.5mph.
(e: on the basis they are mostly company purchases - 2/3 were)
.. to what extent can you get the same bik advantages if you buy privately, do companies do pcp ? (would they have been better off with cash option.)
tesla lease finance in the usa now reported to be mandating that leasees can no longer buy them at the end of the term (as was usually possible there) to enable Tesla to control the 2nd hand market, and even use them for hertz/avis supply - sneeky.
For 2nd hand ev's is data on the cost of extended warranties a known quantity, for model3 8year std warranty on battery+drivetrain will probably cover 2nd owner,
but failure/diagnosis of electronic parts is goung to be a new frontier for the DIYer.
Eh?
It’s pretty clear, if you lease you pay a fixed fee to rent the car for a fixed period. The lease company benefits (or loses out) on any residual gains or losses.
Any other option the purchaser benefits or looses on the residual value.
The tax incentives are irrelevant, the lease company is still getting £450-600 a month for something which is worth the same now as they paid for it 2 years previously, even if the purchaser was paying £300 from their net salary.
In either scenario they could have paid as little as nothing over 2 years if they bought it or they could have paid £300-600 a month for it on a lease. Which do you think is the far better option in hindsight?
The reality is, nearly all BEVs have always held their value really well, even from the early Leaf’s/Zoe’s. Lease costs have largely been pretty high due to the purchase price despite the strong residuals. Lease companies have always been making good money from these deals.
Car companies want the cars back at the end of the lease because they can sell the used cars for top dollar very easily and they have dealer networks crying out for stock. It’s pretty self explanatory really.
Soldato
In built up metropolitan areas, there's already alternatives to cars. The sound and smell of traffic in London is very different to what is was a decade ago and it's a much more pleasant thing to be around. It's mostly electric cabs, electric busses, construction / delivery vehicles and executive limos.
Choosing to drive an ICE around there now is a very expensive hobby.
not entirely - if, like most, it's a company purchased ev partly chosen for the bik, it's probably a lease and you had a preferential lease, so, no option to benefit from price inflation/residuals, or if you choose to take car cash option( do you still get bik) you wouldn't get as good a deal on a private lease or pcp terms, and you end up offsetting greater expenditure against the residuals that now belong to you.
How much do those lease cars coming onto the market actually sway it ?
Soldato
It’s a lot better than it used to be although for a while it was getting worse when people were using cars rather than public transport. This seems to have reverted back now. Always great to see the air quality index sat at 1-2 while the rest of the country is usually higher (it’s 3 at the moment across the UK but that’s still low).
You can buy them at the end of lease most the time I’m pretty sure. So you can make the gain
Soldato
Running cars into the ground has got to be more environmentally friendly than keeping churning out new cars.
Soldato
No S Sherlock.
Soldato
Depends how many more miles it’s got before it’s run into the ground. https://www.reuters.com/business/au...become-cleaner-than-gasoline-cars-2021-06-29/