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17 year old girl allowed to kill herself Legally

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by B&W, Jun 5, 2019.

  1. Minusorange

    Mobster

    Joined: Nov 25, 2005

    Posts: 3,776

    Not to mention many methods result in failure leaving the person in a worse state and other methods pose danger to others (carbon monoxide suicide is quite effective, but deadly to others too)

    Is it so wrong to want a painless, effective and least "mess other peoples days up" method for suicide ?
     
  2. 413x

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jan 13, 2010

    Posts: 15,926

    Location: Cardiff

    If you are religious I can see your perspective.
    Otherwise I cannot understand why you seem so intent on keeping someone alive who genuinely wants to die.

    What if you were locked in solitary confinement and someone and you believed you were never getting out. You wanted to end your life but someone said.. No. You have 80 years of this left?
    Its not their decision to make
     
  3. Schlong&Stable

    Mobster

    Joined: Apr 27, 2013

    Posts: 3,966

    Yes, absolutely. Intelligence is in a large part genetic, but so are a plethora of other things.
     
  4. B&W

    Soldato

    Joined: Oct 3, 2003

    Posts: 6,875

    Location: Birmingham

    Not religious, I don't believe someone should kill themselves due to severe depression and PTSD.

    There are options, and as always time heals.

    Over time, people change they're feelings change, life is not static.
     
  5. StriderX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 18,640

    Does time heal cancer, pretty sure it kills you if you leave it unattended and if it's inoperable, you're just waiting for death. Why can't Mental illnesses be as severe?
     
  6. B&W

    Soldato

    Joined: Oct 3, 2003

    Posts: 6,875

    Location: Birmingham

    Because cancer will kill you, mental illnesses do not.
     
  7. Rossi~

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 5, 2010

    Posts: 18,559

    I've seen first hand, time in fact do the opposite, especially where medicated.

    So as a result, you can suffer for longer with a serious mental illness, but it's okay because you'll not die of it?
     
  8. Liquid_Entity

    Soldato

    Joined: Apr 11, 2006

    Posts: 5,621

    Location: East Grinstead, W Sussex

    Having watched a program last night on care homes for the old. There's no chance I'm going to become a bed ridden, pant staining useless lump of human tissue. Bring in the voluntary harmless suicide I say.
     
  9. B&W

    Soldato

    Joined: Oct 3, 2003

    Posts: 6,875

    Location: Birmingham

    There is always hope, this is what it is to be human even at your darkest hour there is hope.

    She was 17 for god's sake, not fully developed mentally as an adult. At that age people make so much mistakes, they should not be allowed to make this fatal mistake.
     
  10. Chojin

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Nov 21, 2004

    Posts: 2,179

    There should be barriers in place to prevent these kind of things. If all else fails they could mandate that the person must have enough money to fund cryogenic freezing. When a cure for their problem becomes available and it's possible to resuscitate, then they must be brought back to life.
     
  11. mjt

    Capodecina

    Joined: Aug 31, 2007

    Posts: 17,581

    Are you seriously suggesting that Aktion T4 is comparable to the current euthanasia process currently legal in Benelux? It is EXTREMELY tightly regulated and, for want of a better word, difficult to euthanise patients in these countries. Doctors and other medical professionals can be prosecuted if they do not follow the very strict procedures.

    Please educate yourself before posting such offensive comments in future.
     
  12. Werewolf

    Commissario

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 27,489

    Location: Panting like a fiend

    So how long do you propose they should have tied her down, and force fed her against her will?

    5 years?
    10 years?
    25 years?

    As that's what it would effectively have taken and even if she ever appeared to have changed her mind, how do you know that the moment she was given a couple of minutes alone she wouldn't have used another method? (run in front of a bus on a court visit, jumped off a balcony, cut her wrists with broken glass the list is almost endless).

    She wasn't someone taking pills or jumping off a bridge on the spur of the moment, she was sadly someone who had obviously had treatment for years but still felt the same way and the only way to stop her would have involved a complete deprivation of liberty bodily autonomy (worse than almost all criminals) potentially for the rest of her life in which time she would still be suffering, which is to put it bluntly pretty ******* inhumane.

    She was someone who was clear in her mind what she wanted, able to argue for it, and in the end took a very slow way to do it when other options were denied her and the only way left was to refuse to allow things into her body.

    I believe in trying to save people when possible and if possible prolong life, but not at all costs and not when the person is lucid enough to make their wishes clear and any other option would be against their will and effectively torture.
    You appear to have a very simplistic view that life should be preserved regardless of the persons long term and argued for wishes and suffering.
     
  13. Colonel_Klinck

    Hitman

    Joined: Oct 3, 2007

    Posts: 738

    Location: London, UK

    Euthanasia doesn't mean that at all. It means that the person wants to end their life, not that they aren't fit for life.

    Good I'm glad you're happy but not everyone is the same, she isn't just suffering from depression is she. None of us have walked in her shoes so have zero idea how she feels.

    I would rather die that have my parents murdered just so I could have some meaning to life, that meaning being revenge. Thanks but no thanks.

    What happens to to the rapist is irrelevant here. This is about the girl not him. As you say you have no idea what it feels like so stop judging her and her situation.

    Yes some people will live satisfying lives despite being raped but lots of others won't.

    That last paragraph makes no sense in regards to this story. This has nothing to do with young people being integrated into society, what does that even mean? You sound like my grandparents talking about my generation when I was a teenager 30 years ago. The same thing every generation seems to say about the generations that follow them. Freedom of choice is never a bad thing. They just have a different way of seeing things in the Netherlands. Who are we too judge them. And she wasn't just "depressed", she was in constant physical and psychological pain.
     
  14. Jumper118

    Mobster

    Joined: Oct 17, 2012

    Posts: 4,807

    Location: Leeds

    lol i cant read
     
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2019
  15. B&W

    Soldato

    Joined: Oct 3, 2003

    Posts: 6,875

    Location: Birmingham

    She had been on the drip before and recovered from it, so it's not like she will be physically held down for years. Depression has phases.

    Clear in her mind for a 17 year old girl who puts on her bucket list "ride a scooter" , "get a tattoo", etc. Not really mature is she then?

    As depression is increasing in our society this sets a dangerous example of things to come.

    The real question is why is it increasing so much, what is happening in society?
     
  16. FoxEye

    Capodecina

    Joined: Feb 17, 2006

    Posts: 19,921

    Location: Cornwall

    The cause was known. Trauma from being raped. Trauma she could not overcome.

    You seem to be arguing for a one-size-fits-all approach to mental illness.
     
  17. aardvark

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Jan 2, 2005

    Posts: 7,767

    Location: leeds

    i simply don't believe that there is a trauma that cannot be managed given the right help - and i don't believe the majority of the medical community believes it either.
     
  18. StriderX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 18,640

    If someone cut of your head, is that trauma that can be managed? or is that simply obviously irreparable.

    I keep feeling people are downplaying how awful sexual abuse is, especially at the age of puberty which defines every other event in your life, her very being was irreparable as far as she was concerned.
     
  19. Roar87

    Soldato

    Joined: May 10, 2012

    Posts: 5,069

    Location: Leeds

    Her believing it was trauma she couldn't overcome doesn't necessarily mean she couldn't give enough time, in 5 years she might have been able to cope better, in 15 or 20 years she might have had a family and a new life. That opportunity is gone now for her so we'll never know.
     
  20. aardvark

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Jan 2, 2005

    Posts: 7,767

    Location: leeds

    I know many people who have suffered the same and have been able to live normal healthy lives - it takes a long time and its not easy but it can be done, and it has been done and is continuing to be done by millions of people.