2008 German GP - Race 10/18

NathanE · 20 Jul 2008 at 18:21

Could it not just possibly be that Heikki knew that his team mate had been faster all weekend and decided to let him through?

The team may have said to Heikki something like "Lewis could still win this from our calculations if he can get past you in the next xxx seconds". So then Heikki made the decision by himself and I'm sure judging from Lewis' appreciation in the press conference that he will be buying the drinks for Heikki tonight.

It's barely any different to be honest from when Kimi had to let Massa past in France when his exhaust broke. OK it wasn't his fault. But he was a couple tenths slower per lap than his team mate. So he let him past without any struggle because there is no point fighting your team mate when you know his car is faster.

Duke · 20 Jul 2008 at 18:23

Hamilton was much quicker after passing him, so probably would have held himself up a lot, trying to keep him behind and would have been slapped silly if caused a crash.

Fishman · 20 Jul 2008 at 18:29

If Kova hadnt let Hamilton past then Heidfeld would have come out in front of both of them, one of many benefits and justifications to it

Cavallino · 20 Jul 2008 at 18:29

NathanE said:
Could it not just possibly be that Heikki knew that his team mate had been faster all weekend and decided to let him through?

As I said earlier. Had Alonso been Kova's seat. Do you think he wouldve let him through?

I honestly doubt it. And further more, it shows that Mclaren have unofficially adopted a number 1 driver...

Which isnt a bad thing really since it seems to work at Ferrari during the Schumacher days.

But the ultimate point I was trying to make is that Hamilton ultimately benefited from the switch... not only Hamilton but the team... how?

By letting Hamilton through, the team was able to maxmise further points in the constructors championship as well.

As to how it can be interpreted, well the footage caught Ron making hectic communications over the radio when Hamilton was on Kova's tail. No brainer really

To me this situation is no different to that of Austria 2002 with the Ferraris, irrespective of whether Hamilton is faster than Kovalainnen or not, lets not forget that Kova is driving the same car as Hamilton.... and more importantly as one of the great UNBIASSED and BRITISH commentator said:

Catching up is one thing... passing is another.

knip · 20 Jul 2008 at 18:32

So........did i miss much?

Cavallino · 20 Jul 2008 at 18:32

knip said:
So........did i miss much?

No move along

knip · 20 Jul 2008 at 18:34

Cavallino said:
No move along

Oh come on, one of you give me a brief run down, I missed it!

Cavallino · 20 Jul 2008 at 18:35

knip said:
Oh come on, one of you give me a brief run down, I missed it!

In a nutshell?

HAMILTON CHEATED

Hehe. No. Hamilton drove a blinding race. Mclaren nearly messed up his strategy too but he was able to recover it for the team. Quality drive.

Dup · 20 Jul 2008 at 18:39

They half did that stategy on purpose to give him a chance to prove himself I reckon. Cracking race, really enjoyed it. Hopefully the top 10 are overtaking like that all race next year.

I was entertained and that's the main thing. There is some hope for the sport after all!

knip · 20 Jul 2008 at 18:40

Cavallino said:
In a nutshell?

HAMILTON CHEATED

Hehe. No. Hamilton drove a blinding race. Mclaren nearly messed up his strategy too but he was able to recover it for the team. Quality drive.

Brilliant! I just watched the highlights on ITV website, any news on Glock?

Saw the two bits of overtaking on Massa and Piquet as well. :cool:

And where the Hell did Piquet pull that podium finish from!!! :eek:

Cavallino · 20 Jul 2008 at 18:42

knip said:
And where the Hell did Piquet pull that podium finish from!!!

Glock is ok... in hospital overnight to make sure everything is a-ok.

And piquet? Good question. It was luck really. The SC came out at the right time for the guy and he was on a 1 stopper compared to everyones two stopper strategy.

knip · 20 Jul 2008 at 18:45

Cavallino said:
And piquet? Good question. It was luck really. The SC came out at the right time for the guy and he was on a 1 stopper compared to everyones two stopper strategy.

Goodo, dont mind Renault winning as long as its not Fred.

(Ta for the info, was hell missing it)

NathanE · 20 Jul 2008 at 18:46

Cavallino said:
As I said earlier. Had Alonso been Kova's seat. Do you think he wouldve let him through?

I honestly doubt it. And further more, it shows that Mclaren have unofficially adopted a number 1 driver...

Which isnt a bad thing really since it seems to work at Ferrari during the Schumacher days.

But the ultimate point I was trying to make is that Hamilton ultimately benefited from the switch... not only Hamilton but the team... how?

By letting Hamilton through, the team was able to maxmise further points in the constructors championship as well.

As to how it can be interpreted, well the footage caught Ron making hectic communications over the radio when Hamilton was on Kova's tail. No brainer really

To me this situation is no different to that of Austria 2002 with the Ferraris, irrespective of whether Hamilton is faster than Kovalainnen or not, lets not forget that Kova is driving the same car as Hamilton.... and more importantly as one of the great UNBIASSED and BRITISH commentator said:

Catching up is one thing... passing is another.

Of course Alonso wouldn't as he and Hamilton were locked in a bit of a fight last year... ?

You pretty much answered your own conspiracy here:

"But the ultimate point I was trying to make is that Hamilton ultimately benefited from the switch... not only Hamilton but the team... how?

By letting Hamilton through, the team was able to maxmise further points in the constructors championship as well."

The sum total of letting LH past were 1) LH winning and 2) more points for the team in total. Heikki is a team player, just like LH, so the decision to let LH past was a no brainer.

Ron was pressing the "pit radio" button. He wasn't talking to any drivers. But even then the FIA has recordings and if he said anything like "Move over let LH past" McLaren would be punished.

Your conspiracy is incredibly far fetched and quite construed too.

G_D · 20 Jul 2008 at 18:55

Cavallino said:
Agreed. Piquet got there by luck.

Hamilton built up a 12 second lead then went down to 5th due to the SC and still made the 1st place.

Hamilton for Driver of the Day really.

And once again shows how ITV arrive at their decision for Driver of the Day with no foresight or understanding of what has unfolded.

Im sorry what!??!? Martin Brundle knows a vast amount about what is going on and always shows great understand of the development of the race. What you really mean is their opinion happened to differ from your and you have then got very carried away with your opinion of their decision.

As for the reason why, yes i agree that he came 2nd by luck, that is unquestionable. However without that luck he was still going to be 6th or 7th which he was going to achieve from no where which would have been a very good drive anyway. Then once he was in the lead (yes by luck) he didn't Choke at all and held off both Ferraris, both BMWs and a McLaren, only Hamilton got past, which i think for a new drive to do in an inferior Renault is good going really.

Cavallino said:
As I said earlier. Had Alonso been Kova's seat. Do you think he wouldve let him through?

I honestly doubt it. And further more, it shows that Mclaren have unofficially adopted a number 1 driver...

Which isnt a bad thing really since it seems to work at Ferrari during the Schumacher days.

But the ultimate point I was trying to make is that Hamilton ultimately benefited from the switch... not only Hamilton but the team... how?

By letting Hamilton through, the team was able to maxmise further points in the constructors championship as well.

As to how it can be interpreted, well the footage caught Ron making hectic communications over the radio when Hamilton was on Kova's tail. No brainer really

To me this situation is no different to that of Austria 2002 with the Ferraris, irrespective of whether Hamilton is faster than Kovalainnen or not, lets not forget that Kova is driving the same car as Hamilton.... and more importantly as one of the great UNBIASSED and BRITISH commentator said:

Catching up is one thing... passing is another.

Alonso wouldn't have let him past no, but that is more a reflection on how Alonso's relationship developed an McLaren more than anything else. As has already been said Kimi let Massa go in France. I don't think it is fair to compare this to what happend in 2002 i find that frankly ridiculous. That was one drive breaking heavily at the end of the race to let the other win. What happened today was one drive let of to let the other get on with the race. Kovalainen was not going to win the race, Hamilton could and Kovalainen just got out the way and let them both get on with it.

Things are not so black and white as you have just made out. You cant say any time one team mate goes past the other that is wrong as that is just simply not the case. What happened today was not wrong in anyway.

Cavallino · 20 Jul 2008 at 19:04

NathanE and GD. I see your points of view, but I dont share them Im afraid

So I think we'll agree to disagree on this since no matter what either of us say wont change each others minds

UKTopGun · 20 Jul 2008 at 19:06

Cavallino, youre complaining that everyone else was complaining in 2002, when in fact you are now complaining when no one else is complaining.

This makes it 'even'

Damn, I'm pretty sure that made no sense.

G_D · 20 Jul 2008 at 19:09

Cavallino said:
NathanE and GD. I see your points of view, but I dont share them Im afraid
So I think we'll agree to disagree on this since no matter what either of us say wont change each others minds

Lol very diplomatic of you and to an extent i am ok with that answer. Means i can relax and not have to argue like mad with you as like you say, not going to change my mind either. But then thats because im right

Cavallino · 20 Jul 2008 at 19:09

UKTopGun said:
Cavallino, youre complaining that everyone else was complaining in 2002, when in fact you are now complaining when no one else is complaining.

This makes it 'even'

Damn, I'm pretty sure that made no sense.

Im a Ferrari fan. But even I thought that Austria 2002 was down right wrong and did not agree with the decision made by Ferrari to let Schumacher through.

By the same token, I dont agree with what was pulled today.

This is my opinion which I am entitled to... I hope!

And you made sense dont worry

Cavallino · 20 Jul 2008 at 19:10

G_D said:
But then thats because im right

But.. Im right too! How can this be?

The Universe shall implode!

NathanE · 20 Jul 2008 at 19:12

Cavallino said:
NathanE and GD. I see your points of view, but I dont share them Im afraid
So I think we'll agree to disagree on this since no matter what either of us say wont change each others minds

Will you agree in 24 hours when it is clear the FIA has no intention of punishing McLaren?

If no then I'm afraid I don't see your point of view at all.