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7970 vs 680 thread.

I totally agree with you and approach life with my eyes wide open with a healthy dose if cynicism. I'd just like to see someone with some morals and the cash to back it stand up and be counted. Unfortunately we as a species are intrinsically selfish. Play any multi player game and see how many people play support roles and how little thanks they get. That's what p's me off about all this corporate team player c##p, the ones who talk about it most are the most selfish. Explains why both myself and my wife have never got on in large companies, too damn honest!

So far I haven't jumped on either gpu because I feel the truth is neither are worth the current price. That doesn't mean I won't buy one though once the market settles!
 
Troezar said:
I totally agree with you and approach life with my eyes wide open with a healthy dose if cynicism. I'd just like to see someone with some morals and the cash to back it stand up and be counted. Unfortunately we as a species are intrinsically selfish. Play any multi player game and see how many people play support roles and how little thanks they get. That's what p's me off about all this corporate team player c##p, the ones who talk about it most are the most selfish. Explains why both myself and my wife have never got on in large companies, too damn honest!

So far I haven't jumped on either gpu because I feel the truth is neither are worth the current price. That doesn't mean I won't buy one though once the market settles!
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Gaming is also a sham IMO.

I mean FFS, when did it become OK to palm off some one with a £50 game that lasts for three hours because you couldn't be assed to put in the work for some one who doesn't like playing online?

Now I will admit, I'm a bit of a hermit. And, due to that the only games I like to play are co op games. When playing competitive games I tend to lose my rag quickly and when the crap talking comes I end up slagging people off.

Just not my thing. So now we have games like MW2 and MW3 that offer about four hours of entertainment to some one like me. Then they rely on YOU to make a game out of it by giving you a simple map.

Kerching !

Now Fallout 3? at least 70 hours of solid gameplay there with all the DLC. You know? it relies on nothing but itself to give you that entertainment. Not a few maps that leave it all down to you.

But that's what has happened to the gaming market. Sooner or later these small "RARE" type developers are guzzled up by a corporation and, just like Nvidia and AMD

LESS IS MORE !

Going back to the 680 for a minute I truly do find the 2gb vram amazingly stingy. It's almost like Nvidia have this vram sales method similar to dating women.

"Treat em mean, keep em keen !". No offence like, but I had a 470 and a pair of 295s out dated by a single game. And what stunk to absolute high heaven is that technically these were still amazingly capable cards with the 295 pipping a 480 yet, they were rendered chocolate teapots by their lack of vram.

At least AMD seem to be far more generous with it. I mean crikey, the 6950 @ £169 has bloody 2gb !

What's that saying about the 680 ?!?!?!
 
mmj_uk said:
Like you said Fermi was faster.

GTX480 was a bigger die but faster than 6970.
GTX680 is a smaller die but faster than 7970.

See the trend? most people don't care about die size they care about the outright performance.
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If people don't care about the die size then they would not mention it in regards to performance and efficiency when its in there favour period, its either important or it isn't in a discussion, when buying its a different matter fastest is the fastest and that not what i talking about.

No different than Brent on [H] moaning about the beta driver on the launch of the 7xxx with the issues of CF, but saying hey look NV have WHQL driver out on release and that's what AMD should have done and my reply to that would be, would you have been any happier if the AMD launch driver were WHQL but still in the exact same state.
WHQL was the important factor or the performance because he was moaning about the performance of the driver at the time and not whether they were beta or WHQL.
 
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ALXAndy said:
It would get shut down in a heartbeat mate.

I know a good few ex game reviewers. All of them were chased out of the industry due to being honest. One of them hasn't been able to get any work reviewing since he told Driv3r like it was.

It's mostly the company I keep that keeps me on my toes. I usually know the truth.

It's all very similar to when I worked in sales running a call centre in the USA. Still under NDA with that so I do need to be careful what I say, but let's just say that you can take a bottle of herbal snake oil that cost 40 cents to make (most expensive bit being the plastic bottle) and then sell it to some one for $59 with a recurring shipment every month.

It's not about what you have and what it can do, it's all about how you sell it mate. Making people happy with what they are buying, even if it's a load of old crap.

I was in that job for three years all told before I finally broke down and couldn't keep doing it. I'm a very honest person, and I don't like seeing people mis sold a load of crap. We had a product in one day that was literally a sachet of powder and the way they were selling it was completely dishonest and relied on scaring people.

It's a very cut throat world out there. The sad fact of life is mate that people are never usually interested in the truth as the truth isn't very exciting.

Let's take the Xfactor. It's rigged from the ground up. Auditions are rigged, only showing on TV what they want you to see. If you are very good? you get to go on TV. If you are very bad? you get to go on TV. However, they pre screen all of the contestants so if you're not very good looking or what not but CAN sing (IE won't sell records to kids or make people laugh at you) then they just turn you away.

Then all of the acts are "sold" to us. IE - right from audition level it's clear to see who will make the live shows because their auditions include all the sob stories ETC. They are already playing on our emotions for votes.

Next step? rigged. Even if we vote some one in they can change it and keep some one in, meaning all of those thousands of phone calls (and pounds) were just really a waste as they get to choose and so on.

It's extremely linear mate, but then most sales are. I still remember to this day the graphs we used to show our new employees where you basically railroad the person on the phone into the end result - a sale !!!!

So yes. I know far more about how this all works than others will, as basically it has been my business in some shape or form for nearly a decade.
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At the core of it all is dumb people, that will unfortunately never change.
 
MaxP779 said:
At the core of it all is dumb people, that will unfortunately never change.
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Indeed. Roll on Xfactor 2012 :rolleyes:

It's a sad day when companies need to constantly ram crap in your face.

I remember a day where something sold based on how good it actually was and how it was worth the money.

Then you spread the word. None of this marketing nonsense.

Thing is, all of this crap they feed us (the adverts, demo videos for tessellation and graphs and charts) all cost us money. So all of that rubbish that Nvidia started putting into the market all needs to be paid for.

So if you just went out and bought a 680 not only did you pay for the 680. You paid the manufacturing cost, the costs of advertising and the reviewers. And all of the adverts slapped all over websites.
 
ALXAndy said:
LESS IS MORE !

Going back to the 680 for a minute I truly do find the 2gb vram amazingly stingy. It's almost like Nvidia have this vram sales method similar to dating women.

"Treat em mean, keep em keen !". No offence like, but I had a 470 and a pair of 295s out dated by a single game. And what stunk to absolute high heaven is that technically these were still amazingly capable cards with the 295 pipping a 480 yet, they were rendered chocolate teapots by their lack of vram.

At least AMD seem to be far more generous with it. I mean crikey, the 6950 @ £169 has bloody 2gb !

What's that saying about the 680 ?!?!?!
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Considering how close the two cards are, it tells me that the extra gig of VRAM is unnecessary. IMHO the only thing the 4GB 680s will have is a little more future proofing, as right now that extra gig in the 7970 is obviously wasted. But then, many people looking at the 7970 and 680 aren't worried
about the future proofness of the card, they are after the best numbers.
 
Woden said:
Considering how close the two cards are, it tells me that the extra gig of VRAM is unnecessary. IMHO the only thing the 4GB 680s will have is a little more future proofing, as right now that extra gig in the 7970 is obviously wasted. But then, many people looking at the 7970 and 680 aren't worried
about the future proofness of the card, they are after the best numbers.
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I wish I could turn back time to the point where AMD switched to 2gb and all of the reviewers slagging them off (/glares at Bit Tech again).

I'll never forget the reviews of the 6950 and 6970 where they slated AMD for frivolous use of things like vram. In the end AMD made a cut down version of the 6950.

But now? hah ! in your face !

It is not possible to max out BF3 on a 560ti without serious stutter and lag. However, the 6950 manages perfectly playable framerates.

Bit tech even changed their monthly recommendations from Nvidia cards to AMD ones over night.

Yet, the 560ti was hailed as an amazing mid ranged card. Shame it's been rendered useless so soon !

All it takes for me is the thought of Frostbite III and I shudder. It seems DICE do like pushing the envelope, as they only used FBII a couple of times before designing a new one (and that's good IMO, push the boundaries).

2GB could be proved useless with one game. And at £400+ that's worrying.

Edit. Wait til you see how much Nvidia charge for that future proofing. £500-£600 by all accounts !
 
Well that has been an informative thread, loving all these comparisons.

Seriously though ALXAndy, you said no arguing, then proceeded to argue with people lol.

I see no corruption with any of the reviews, or any of them recommending anyone to sell a 7970 and get a 680.

As for marketing, both sides are guilty of that, it essential as when the actual products are similar, you need something like a brand specific feature to sway it one way or the other.
 
I was looking forward to participating in this thread when my 680 turned up seeing real world experiences, what clocks people were getting and some healthy debate.

Instead I just see pathetic behaviour from people that I suspect should know a lot better, no wonder this forum has a bad rep.
 
Redemption80 said:
Well that has been an informative thread, loving all these comparisons.

Seriously though ALXAndy, you said no arguing, then proceeded to argue with people lol.

I see no corruption with any of the reviews, or any of them recommending anyone to sell a 7970 and get a 680.

As for marketing, both sides are guilty of that, it essential as when the actual products are similar, you need something like a brand specific feature to sway it one way or the other.
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There is a stark difference between discussing something and arguing mate. Arguing usually results in heavy usage of the word troll, complete with psychiatric evaluations and at times, flat out insults.

I'm no kid. Infact, I'm closing in on 39 years old. At this time in life I am able to have a discussion without resorting to insulting people.

You will note that there has been some very worthwhile open and honest discussion in this thread. Some things people won't agree on, but that's fine. If we all agreed on one thing then.......

We would all have Ipads and Geforce cards.

And the world would be incredibly dull and predictable.
 
There is just so much bull excrement in the Graphics Forum now. A lot of mindless twaddle. Now you're actually less likely to get trolled in GD than here.
 
Sin_Chase said:
Did you just liken those nVidia users to the types who choose Apple products?

Really?

Credibility dissolved in 1 second flat. 1 strike away from Ignore.
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Have you been reading the thread? properly?

Try to. If you don't want to or you aren't interested then hey, that's cool. But picking out a few lines of text and then jumping to a conclusion is bad, mmkay.

If you mean - Do I feel that Nvidia are very clever and shrewd and have a brainwashed bunch of followers? then yes, guilty as charged, slap me on ignore.

By that of course I mean that there are actually people out there who sold their 7950 and 7970s in order to buy this new Nvidia card that is no better than what they had.

There are probably people who do equally stupid things over a new AMD card. Me? I don't do any of it.

Point of fact is that when I bought my 7970 Nvidia had absolutely nothing to offer at all.

The 580 3gb was more money, slower in absolutely everything, did not support three screens on one card in surround... I could go on all night.

There was just no way, as much as I tried, to convince myself that the 580 3gb was worth buying over the 7970.

Now though? the 680 is not the step up from the 7970 that the 7970 was in regards to the 580.
 
straxusii said:
I was looking forward to participating in this thread when my 680 turned up seeing real world experiences, what clocks people were getting and some healthy debate.

Instead I just see pathetic behaviour from people that I suspect should know a lot better, no wonder this forum has a bad rep.
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Well you know what to do, start a 680 users thread, hopefully all the BS fanboy talk will be kept to a minimum, otherwise suspensions will fly.
 
It's good to know there are plenty of other people out there that can see post all the hype. Gives me a little more faith in humanity :)

Does make me wonder if it wasn't all about share price just how quickly would technology advance? I'd just like to see something revolutionary in my lifetime, like the discovery of electricity must have been.

Keeping it on topic I really don't know what to buy right now it seems so close. I'm hoping that means a price war, fingers crossed ;)
 
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