There’s quite a gap between UBI and a general notion of ‘socialism’, by which I assume you mean Communism as seen in Russia/China etc.
After 16 years i've left local gov
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Soldato
Is this thread an attack on UC or the tories in general?
OP location says Swansea. Which I believe is held by Labour. Swansea is in Wales, also held by Labour.
Life in Wales doesn't appear to be noticeably better for it.
Tories will always tend to have issues with disgruntled local council staff as they tend to be more militant and therefore more left leaning.
OP location says Swansea. Which I believe is held by Labour. Swansea is in Wales, also held by Labour.
Life in Wales doesn't appear to be noticeably better for it.
Tories will always tend to have issues with disgruntled local council staff as they tend to be more militant and therefore more left leaning.
Caporegime
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Universal credit was bought in by the Tories, so I assume the op in his former job had dealings with it and is laying the blame at the people who implemented UC.
Associate
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That was when you went from working to not working I assume. I was fine on ESA.
It appears charlatans suffice.
Caporegime
Universal Income is not socialism. Please educate yourself on an issue before attempting to discuss it.
Universal Income may not directly equal socialism but it does necessarily imply a significant degree of centralised control of and regulation of the means of distribution and exchange if universal income is to be enough to provide for the 'basics' so it is a rather Socialist ideal (and unsurprisingly one were the sums don't make sense with current tech and societal conditions)
But UI is not incompatible with the *mostly* capitalist society we live in today.
The NHS is a socialist ideal but we haven’t decended into a Communist dictatorship because we have universal healthcare (despite what most Americans believe will happen if it is implemented in the USA).
It may be a socialist idea (small s), but it doesn’t equal ‘Socialism’ (used as a proxy for Communist dictatorship).
*Edit* Also, considering the previous thread on UI, it’s amazing how many libitarian and/or right-leaning members of the forum also like the idea of UI; seeing it as a line in the sand for ‘benefit scroungers’ — “use your UI in any way you want but don’t expect any additional help from the state if you waste it”.
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Caporegime
ui and UC are not remotely to be confused. Ones a dumb name for social benefits and the other is a utopian socialism dream state of employment.
Caporegime
Which was my point. So... thanks.
No it doesn't. It means the government is paying a form of welfare, which is exactly what happens in every capitalist country on this planet.
No it isn't. I'm not convinced that UI is a feasible policy, but it's sure as hell not socialist.
Associate
That 'solution' causes the same problem that we currently have, unsustainable levels of benefits based on heavier taxation on a dwindling base of tax payers. Benefits should be a short term safety net, not a way of life.
You're correct that society is on course for destruction and your solution will exacerbate it further.
This will probably derail the thread but where do you stand on immigration? Edit - motivation behind this question is whether you think migrants would then be entitled to the benefit regime you suggest.
Yep, it's actually OVERT communism. Didn't the Shadow Chancellor brandish Mao's Little Red Book in the House of Commons?
EDITT - The upside of Labour coming to power is maybe every town will get it's own 'Jezfest'
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The UI discussion has taken the thread off on a bit of a tangent but I don’t think anyone is confusing the two.
Wow 804,100 people claiming job seekers allowance or UC in Sep 2017.
Unemployed benefits are a fairly small fraction of welfare spending that would no doubt just be wasted on useless projects by the Gov anyway.
There's really no solution, too small and resourceless a country, too much of an underclass and sense of self entitlement, and potentially upcoming race/religion conflicts.
If only there was a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow, oh wait we don't don't get rainbows because we never have sun.
Unemployed benefits are a fairly small fraction of welfare spending that would no doubt just be wasted on useless projects by the Gov anyway.
There's really no solution, too small and resourceless a country, too much of an underclass and sense of self entitlement, and potentially upcoming race/religion conflicts.
If only there was a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow, oh wait we don't don't get rainbows because we never have sun.
Soldato
Agreed, nothing screams skint, benefit scrounger types like high-end, overclocked PC hardware.
Indeedy, Goes right along with the Satellite dish, large screen TV and the Sky sports subscription...!
On a more serious note, I dont actually begrudge long term unemployables for having these things that much.
If somebody is having to live on benefits for an extended period for whatever reason then they are also likley to have a lot of time on their hands.
As a way of filling that time, A full Sky sub, or even building and playing with a high end PC, is actually relatively inexpensive entertainment compared with the alternatives
If somebody is having to live on benefits for an extended period for whatever reason then they are also likley to have a lot of time on their hands.
As a way of filling that time, A full Sky sub, or even building and playing with a high end PC, is actually relatively inexpensive entertainment compared with the alternatives
Caporegime
How did you manage to escape the rat race Efour, I think I read you originally come from London, maybe not?
Did you just up and move to Sweden?
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