AKG K701/2, K712 and Beyerdynamic DT990 gaming comparison.

Minstadave said:
Do you need to do anything to enable binaural simulation with the SbZ, is it the surround setting?
Click to expand...
Apparently selecting headphones as output and SBX Pro Surround in Creative's software should automatically set Windows Playback device configuration to 5.1, but better to check that.
Software like games always defaults to that channel configuration (not many even having own settings) which tells them to produce 5.1/surround sound.
 
EsaT said:
K701 is fixed cable version and should be little cheaper price.
K702 uses mini-XLR connector for cable like other high end AKGs. (+ comes with alternate coiled cable)
Besides obvious easier changing of cable it would also allow using V-moda Boompro Mic if wanting to add mic without separate cable like in ModMic.


Besides having good binaural simulation Sound Blaster Z would likely be enough for gaming use.
For high dynamic range music like classical music it might have occasional problem:
In such music average signal level is low and you'll adjust volume to keep that comfortable and then you have momentary transients with lot higher volume.
And despite of public hallucination of lower ohms being easier that applies only if headphones don't need much power.
When headphones again need above average amount of power lowish impedance means power is taken as current.
And just like for electric network delivering more power as higher current is demanding also for headphone output.
250 ohm Beyers are basically easier load because they draw little current. (assuming output has adequate voltage)

Sound BlasterX AE-5 again would have one of the best headphone outputs of any soundcard capable to driving any normal headphone.

For gaming you really want binaural simulation.
It rises this level headphones to entirely new immersion level.
While with garbage headphones signal doesn't matter because they output garbage anyway...
Click to expand...

Not now they don’t.
 
Hey guys,

I'm new here, first post.

First I would like to thank all the people who put their time into writting those reviews/opinions/tests.
Second I'd like to apologize for hijacking this post, but it's been really hard to find the answer for my struggle and this post seems to be my best bet so far.

I've been trying to find the ideal answer for weeks, from reading mad lust envy's gaming guide(a thousand times) to searching youtube, google and reddit. The problem is that there are way too many posts with way too many conflicting opinions, not to mention old posts with outdated(?) info and prices, and even headphones who were never reviewed by mad lust but are supposed to be really good.

I want a headphone that gives me whatever slight edge I can get in locating enemies in FPS games(PUBG). If the headphone can also be fun for other uses without sacrificing this, thats a plus. Comfort is the second most important as I tend to sweat a lot while wearing headphones, or feel pain on my ears from the pressure of the pads (Ive only owned non-audiophile headphones so far). This will be my first audiophile headphone and is likely to be followed by a dac/amp as needed.

After a lot of research I've narrowed my options to what I can afford(250EUR max) and what I can find in germany (the list is not in order of preference):
- HD 598
- K712
- K702
- AD900x
- AD700x
- Beyers (DT880/990? I never quite got the difference, also the different Ohm options drive me crazy).

My feeling after reading so many reviews is that AKGs would be the winners.
HD598 are supposed to be really good at a lot of things but not as good as those others for gaming. I also find hard to find updated info on HD598 compared to other headphones for gaming (everything from 2014 and older). A big plus would be their price(from 110EUR) and availability here in germany.
AD900x and 700x would maybe be the best in pinpointing the enemy but no bass, and other cans (AKG) could do the same with a lil bit more bass. Also from reviews I saw I wasn't too thrilled by the build quality of those 2 audio-technica. Another negative point is that they are only cheap in USA, here they cost like 3x what they cost in the US, so I'd import them (they go for 100-150 EUR with shipping and import taxes, but I'd be a bit scared to buy them overseas)
Beyers really scare me because they have the 2 versions (880 and 990) and also all the different ohm options. From what I read they are well-rounded but not the best for the gaming purposes I wanted.

AKG really seem to stand a bit above the others, and they are also a bit more expensive than the others. And require amping. But i'm willing the sacrifice if they are really as good or better at locating enemies as the audio-technicas while also delivering a bit more fun.
As for which AKG to buy, unfortunatelly in Germany I can only find the K701, K702 and K712. No q701 or K7xx. I have no idea which one to pick (K702 or K712). In fact, as I've already explained, I'm not even sure the AKGs are the best for what I'm looking. AKGs are also a bit more expensive (160EUR and 210EUR for the k702 and k712 respectively), but at least they are available on german internet websites.

Could someone shed some light and help a desperate brother?
Am I right on my remarks based on my research?
Is the price difference for the AKGs justifiable? If so, for a gaming perspective, is there much difference between k712 and k702? Am I losing a lot in pinpointing the enemy if I go for the more well-rounded k712?


Sorry about the long post and thanks in advance.
 
henker said:
Hey guys,

I'm new here, first post.

First I would like to thank all the people who put their time into writting those reviews/opinions/tests.
Second I'd like to apologize for hijacking this post, but it's been really hard to find the answer for my struggle and this post seems to be my best bet so far.

I've been trying to find the ideal answer for weeks, from reading mad lust envy's gaming guide(a thousand times) to searching youtube, google and reddit. The problem is that there are way too many posts with way too many conflicting opinions, not to mention old posts with outdated(?) info and prices, and even headphones who were never reviewed by mad lust but are supposed to be really good.

I want a headphone that gives me whatever slight edge I can get in locating enemies in FPS games(PUBG). If the headphone can also be fun for other uses without sacrificing this, thats a plus. Comfort is the second most important as I tend to sweat a lot while wearing headphones, or feel pain on my ears from the pressure of the pads (Ive only owned non-audiophile headphones so far). This will be my first audiophile headphone and is likely to be followed by a dac/amp as needed.

After a lot of research I've narrowed my options to what I can afford(250EUR max) and what I can find in germany (the list is not in order of preference):
- HD 598
- K712
- K702
- AD900x
- AD700x
- Beyers (DT880/990? I never quite got the difference, also the different Ohm options drive me crazy).

My feeling after reading so many reviews is that AKGs would be the winners.
HD598 are supposed to be really good at a lot of things but not as good as those others for gaming. I also find hard to find updated info on HD598 compared to other headphones for gaming (everything from 2014 and older). A big plus would be their price(from 110EUR) and availability here in germany.
AD900x and 700x would maybe be the best in pinpointing the enemy but no bass, and other cans (AKG) could do the same with a lil bit more bass. Also from reviews I saw I wasn't too thrilled by the build quality of those 2 audio-technica. Another negative point is that they are only cheap in USA, here they cost like 3x what they cost in the US, so I'd import them (they go for 100-150 EUR with shipping and import taxes, but I'd be a bit scared to buy them overseas)
Beyers really scare me because they have the 2 versions (880 and 990) and also all the different ohm options. From what I read they are well-rounded but not the best for the gaming purposes I wanted.

AKG really seem to stand a bit above the others, and they are also a bit more expensive than the others. And require amping. But i'm willing the sacrifice if they are really as good or better at locating enemies as the audio-technicas while also delivering a bit more fun.
As for which AKG to buy, unfortunatelly in Germany I can only find the K701, K702 and K712. No q701 or K7xx. I have no idea which one to pick (K702 or K712). In fact, as I've already explained, I'm not even sure the AKGs are the best for what I'm looking. AKGs are also a bit more expensive (160EUR and 210EUR for the k702 and k712 respectively), but at least they are available on german internet websites.

Could someone shed some light and help a desperate brother?
Am I right on my remarks based on my research?
Is the price difference for the AKGs justifiable? If so, for a gaming perspective, is there much difference between k712 and k702? Am I losing a lot in pinpointing the enemy if I go for the more well-rounded k712?


Sorry about the long post and thanks in advance.
Click to expand...

Checkout this review, it's what convinced me to get the AKG 712's since i didn't just want them for gaming. Z reviews are quite entertaining and cuts through the audiophile BS
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XU4PCrXzhc&t=908s
 
henker said:
I want a headphone that gives me whatever slight edge I can get in locating enemies in FPS games(PUBG). If the headphone can also be fun for other uses without sacrificing this, thats a plus. Comfort is the second most important as I tend to sweat a lot while wearing headphones, or feel pain on my ears from the pressure of the pads (Ive only owned non-audiophile headphones so far). This will be my first audiophile headphone and is likely to be followed by a dac/amp as needed.

After a lot of research I've narrowed my options to what I can afford(250EUR max) and what I can find in germany (the list is not in order of preference):
- HD 598
- K712
- K702
- AD900x
- AD700x
- Beyers (DT880/990? I never quite got the difference, also the different Ohm options drive me crazy).
Click to expand...
All open headphones with fabric/velour pads are good for minimizing sweating.
While with leather/"pleather" pads closed headphones are exactly like ear muffs allowing no dissipation of heat through pads or headphone's cup.
More sound insulation basically also means more heat insulation.

Also cheaper headphones often have smaller ear pads making them even sit on ears, something what's called as "supra-aural" headphones.
Obviously some cheaper "circum-aural" headphones also have little budget sized ear pads.


AD700-serie basically lacks lower bass (x-model adds only little more) so better scratch that.
AD900 is better in that, but AKG K702 gives that bass at lot cheaper price having heck of price per performance ratio.
http://graphs.headphone.com/graphCo...]=3061&graphID[]=2661&graphID[]=2621&scale=30

HD595/8 are excellent but can't match that soundstage, so are notch behind in competitiveness, while having same neutral bass as K702.

AKG K712 has bigger soundstage but fun bass makes competitiveness little lower than HD595/8 because foot steps and such aren't so pronounced when there are lower frequencies around.
Though having equalizer profile with neutralized bass could likely give near top level competitiveness when needed.

From reading Mad Lust Envys guide you should have already scratched Beyer's DT880.
Technically better more neutral bass than in DT990 doesn't help when sound stage struggles.
DT990's sound stage is basically at level of HD595, so for competitiveness it's little below K712, though for fun fan factor it's little ahead.
But one thing where Beyer scores is head band with very good adjustment in it.
AKG's automatic adjustment might not work that well for all head shapes.



Also remember that likely hardly any game has proper binaural-simulation (with marketing focusing on graphics over anything else) so sound card with binaural simulation os lot surer than trusting games.
Fashion DACs as "stupid" single purpose devices don't give that.
Anyway lots of "Hifi" doesn't even have parts comparable to price.
Sound BlasterX AE-5 has top level D/A converter (what DAC means) and headphone output is one of the best of any sound cards and capable to driving any headphones without technical problem.
 
ToTheMax said:
Checkout this review, it's what convinced me to get the AKG 712's since i didn't just want them for gaming. Z reviews are quite entertaining and cuts through the audiophile BS
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XU4PCrXzhc&t=908s
Click to expand...

Thanks for the reply!

I'm familiar with his videos, and I watched all his reviews for the headphones I'm/was interested. The problem is that not every review he makes says anything about gaming/competitiviness. The K712 for example, he loves and praises it but he doesn't say anything about gaming.
I got the idea the Audiotechnicas(ad700x/ad900x) are not that good quality from his reviews.

Another problem with his reviews is that, eventho you say he cuts through the audiophile BS, to me it's still a bunch of gibberish what he says sometimes... Like when he says a headphone is more fun and another headphone is more serious. What am I supposed to take out of that?

He also compiles a list that he posts on reddit. It's nice but from his list I can't tell what is best, just see a bunch of headphones he recommends for gaming.

See where I'm going? It's nice to have all the information but it's also confusing :(


EsaT said:
All open headphones with fabric/velour pads are good for minimizing sweating.
While with leather/"pleather" pads closed headphones are exactly like ear muffs allowing no dissipation of heat through pads or headphone's cup.
More sound insulation basically also means more heat insulation.

Also cheaper headphones often have smaller ear pads making them even sit on ears, something what's called as "supra-aural" headphones.
Obviously some cheaper "circum-aural" headphones also have little budget sized ear pads.


AD700-serie basically lacks lower bass (x-model adds only little more) so better scratch that.
AD900 is better in that, but AKG K702 gives that bass at lot cheaper price having heck of price per performance ratio.
http://graphs.headphone.com/graphCo...]=3061&graphID[]=2661&graphID[]=2621&scale=30

HD595/8 are excellent but can't match that soundstage, so are notch behind in competitiveness, while having same neutral bass as K702.

AKG K712 has bigger soundstage but fun bass makes competitiveness little lower than HD595/8 because foot steps and such aren't so pronounced when there are lower frequencies around.
Though having equalizer profile with neutralized bass could likely give near top level competitiveness when needed.

From reading Mad Lust Envys guide you should have already scratched Beyer's DT880.
Technically better more neutral bass than in DT990 doesn't help when sound stage struggles.
DT990's sound stage is basically at level of HD595, so for competitiveness it's little below K712, though for fun fan factor it's little ahead.
But one thing where Beyer scores is head band with very good adjustment in it.
AKG's automatic adjustment might not work that well for all head shapes.



Also remember that likely hardly any game has proper binaural-simulation (with marketing focusing on graphics over anything else) so sound card with binaural simulation os lot surer than trusting games.
Fashion DACs as "stupid" single purpose devices don't give that.
Anyway lots of "Hifi" doesn't even have parts comparable to price.
Sound BlasterX AE-5 has top level D/A converter (what DAC means) and headphone output is one of the best of any sound cards and capable to driving any headphones without technical problem.
Click to expand...

Thank you so much for you reply!

In the end it all comes down to the AKG like I suspected. I'm still in doubt between the 2 as like you said, the bass from the K712 could make it harder for me to hear and locate footsteps/shots.
I was going to ask you about equalizing the K712 but you were quicker! Thank you!
How hard is it to drive those AKG? Everyone says they need amping, some people say a computer is enough. I got a "Z270 SLI PLUS" motherboard (https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/Z270-SLI-PLUS/Specification) with a Realtek ALC1220 Codec and a Asus Xonar DX (unfortunatelly not the DG).
Would I be able to drive it from one of these two options? If not, how much of an investment are we talking about to properly drive them?

Another headphone that got to my attention is the ATH-AD1000x. How would these compare to the AKGs for gaming? They are about the same price as the K712.
Unfortunatelly these are not shown on that website you liked with the graphs. I'd like to see how it compares to these other headphones.

Thank you again for your writeup and sorry about yet more questions.
 
henker said:
Hey guys,

I'm new here, first post.

First I would like to thank all the people who put their time into writting those reviews/opinions/tests.
Second I'd like to apologize for hijacking this post, but it's been really hard to find the answer for my struggle and this post seems to be my best bet so far.

I've been trying to find the ideal answer for weeks, from reading mad lust envy's gaming guide(a thousand times) to searching youtube, google and reddit. The problem is that there are way too many posts with way too many conflicting opinions, not to mention old posts with outdated(?) info and prices, and even headphones who were never reviewed by mad lust but are supposed to be really good.

I want a headphone that gives me whatever slight edge I can get in locating enemies in FPS games(PUBG). If the headphone can also be fun for other uses without sacrificing this, thats a plus. Comfort is the second most important as I tend to sweat a lot while wearing headphones, or feel pain on my ears from the pressure of the pads (Ive only owned non-audiophile headphones so far). This will be my first audiophile headphone and is likely to be followed by a dac/amp as needed.

After a lot of research I've narrowed my options to what I can afford(250EUR max) and what I can find in germany (the list is not in order of preference):
- HD 598
- K712
- K702
- AD900x
- AD700x
- Beyers (DT880/990? I never quite got the difference, also the different Ohm options drive me crazy).

My feeling after reading so many reviews is that AKGs would be the winners.
HD598 are supposed to be really good at a lot of things but not as good as those others for gaming. I also find hard to find updated info on HD598 compared to other headphones for gaming (everything from 2014 and older). A big plus would be their price(from 110EUR) and availability here in germany.
AD900x and 700x would maybe be the best in pinpointing the enemy but no bass, and other cans (AKG) could do the same with a lil bit more bass. Also from reviews I saw I wasn't too thrilled by the build quality of those 2 audio-technica. Another negative point is that they are only cheap in USA, here they cost like 3x what they cost in the US, so I'd import them (they go for 100-150 EUR with shipping and import taxes, but I'd be a bit scared to buy them overseas)
Beyers really scare me because they have the 2 versions (880 and 990) and also all the different ohm options. From what I read they are well-rounded but not the best for the gaming purposes I wanted.

AKG really seem to stand a bit above the others, and they are also a bit more expensive than the others. And require amping. But i'm willing the sacrifice if they are really as good or better at locating enemies as the audio-technicas while also delivering a bit more fun.
As for which AKG to buy, unfortunatelly in Germany I can only find the K701, K702 and K712. No q701 or K7xx. I have no idea which one to pick (K702 or K712). In fact, as I've already explained, I'm not even sure the AKGs are the best for what I'm looking. AKGs are also a bit more expensive (160EUR and 210EUR for the k702 and k712 respectively), but at least they are available on german internet websites.

Could someone shed some light and help a desperate brother?
Am I right on my remarks based on my research?
Is the price difference for the AKGs justifiable? If so, for a gaming perspective, is there much difference between k712 and k702? Am I losing a lot in pinpointing the enemy if I go for the more well-rounded k712?


Sorry about the long post and thanks in advance.
Click to expand...

Thanks to the rains forest's two month return window during Xmas time, I have cheekily brought and tested both the k712 and K702. Preference is very much for the K712 in my opinion with it being the slightly better all rounder and the extra boost on low end / base being welcome over the K702, not massively noticable to be honest, but it is there. I found both perfectly fine for pinpointing people to be honest, but I am not massively into very fast twitch FPS' so not sure how they hold up there, but no issue slaying monsters in witcher 3 :)

Comfort wise both are amazing. On paper the K712's do win out with nicer ear pads and what not. But for myself, with slightly larger ears I think, my ear tends to touch the mesh quiet a bit, so for myself on comfot, the K702's win out slightly, but once again, depends on your ear's because otherwise the K712's memory foam pads are lovely.

henker said:
How hard is it to drive those AKG? Everyone says they need amping, some people say a computer is enough. I got a "Z270 SLI PLUS" motherboard (https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/Z270-SLI-PLUS/Specification) with a Realtek ALC1220 Codec and a Asus Xonar DX (unfortunatelly not the DG).
Would I be able to drive it from one of these two options? If not, how much of an investment are we talking about to properly drive them?

Thank you again for your writeup and sorry about yet more questions.
Click to expand...

If it is of any value, I use the ASUS ROG Rampage board and find them able to drive the 712's okay. I did recently hook them up to a friend's schiit stack and they sounded even better there, so will be investing in that when the Magni 3 is back in stock which combined with the Modi 2 is a £250 stack or so. Having said that I am sure something like the Fiio E10k could drive them fine for around £60, but not an expert in this area either :) But for now, find the motherboard can drive them fine.
 
You can add an extra 5db of bass / sub-bass to the K702 by simply removing a couple of sticky pads from inside the rears of the ear cups. You can even stick the pads on a bit of kitchen foil to make the mod reversible.
 
The K712 have probably been my best all rounders. Did sell them on as whilst they did both gaming and music very well, I still preferred my HD650 for music and as I really needed a mic and could not be bothered with messing about with a modmic and a game specific DAC, I bought some PC363D's for gaming, which have impressed me for an all in one solution.
 
henker said:
The problem is that not every review he makes says anything about gaming/competitiviness.


In the end it all comes down to the AKG like I suspected. I'm still in doubt between the 2 as like you said, the bass from the K712 could make it harder for me to hear and locate footsteps/shots.
I was going to ask you about equalizing the K712 but you were quicker! Thank you!
How hard is it to drive those AKG? Everyone says they need amping, some people say a computer is enough. I got a "Z270 SLI PLUS" motherboard (https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/Z270-SLI-PLUS/Specification) with a Realtek ALC1220 Codec and a Asus Xonar DX (unfortunatelly not the DG).
Would I be able to drive it from one of these two options? If not, how much of an investment are we talking about to properly drive them?

Another headphone that got to my attention is the ATH-AD1000x. How would these compare to the AKGs for gaming? They are about the same price as the K712.
Unfortunatelly these are not shown on that website you liked with the graphs. I'd like to see how it compares to these other headphones.
Click to expand...
Without knowing if testing was actually done with binaural sound that can leave results rather vague.
Binaural sound has specific and lot harder requirements than any stereo music and even notably higher price doesn't necessary mean better for gaming.
Actually music can even benefit from smaller sound stage.

Like famous for music Sennheiser HD650 with likely Dolby Headphone in Mad Lust Envy's guide:
Soundstage:
The front/back depth isn't great. Let's get that out of the way. The width is good, but not close to being the best. The DT990 destroys the HD650 in both depth and width. So how's the air within the soundstage? Well, the problem with the HD650, is that it's a very full sounding headphone. Thick, warm tone tends to make the soundstage seems less airy and smaller.
Positioning:
Positioning and soundstage tend to go hand in hand, so if the soundstage isn't great, the positional cues will suffer. How did the HD650 fare positional-wise? Well, they were good. Not great, and could obviously be better...
Clarity:
You need clarity for soundwhoring in competitive gaming...
I've heard better overall (even the 990's are better for soundwhoring). The problem is that the HD650 is a very thick sounding headphone. Basically, the issues I explained in the soundstage section is what hurts clarity for gaming purposes.

Same things which give it its intimate "front row" musicality hurts gaming badly.
So better to focus to known headphones.
First minute of this is excellent quick test for sound stage with gun shots from different directions and distances:
This was another I used in comparison:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8xZp0WPwxs
You can easily test any headphones you have with those.
There should be literal feel of space with sounds coming clearly from different distances...
Instead of everything coming from next to ear/in front of face with some sounds just being more muffled than others. (like in cheap closed design garbages)
AKG K702 is pretty much aural "god mode/wall hack".


That ALC1220 is definitely capable to meeting human ear's accuracy when clearly lower ALC889 (at level of budget sound cards) is pretty much there.
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/high-end-pc-audio,3733-19.html

Realtek chips just lack proper binaural simulation and only some Gigabyte and MSI motherboards have bundled Creative's software set.
And hence would be stuck with what sound options games have (most games don't even have own sound settings) or Windows 10's Windows Sonic for Headphones which seems average.
Plain 2.0/stereo speaker mix is this sucky:
https://youtu.be/d1_20T8x_OI?t=12m56s
Though technical capability for driving headphones would be likely good enough even if MSI's marketing took little "artistic freedom".
With binaural-simulation from sound card game needs to only output standard 5.1/surround sound.

That Xonar DX is again weird card when Asus bundled Dolby Headphone (mediocre bass bloater) with it while 100 ohm output impedance makes it not so good for headphones.
While 250 ohm Beyers would be fine usual lowish ohm headphones would have rather bad (electric) damping factor.
And for some reason Asus seem to have that same lame output impedance in Strix Raid Pro and possibly Strix Soar.
While once again music might not care that hard, but for games you want good signal control of driver.


At the same time Creative has upped their game with Sound BlasterX AE-5 having all around excellent headphone output with near zero output impedance making it good fit for any headphone.

Very well priced Sound Blaster Z actually has very good D/A converter (that DAC) but headphone output is quite typical for sound card.
So adequency for AKGs isn't that certain.
At least for classical music with high dynamic range meaning lowish average signal level (used for setting volume) and then transients and moments with lot higher sound level demanding lot more power.
Though game sounds don't have such dynamic range, because it would be really annoying to play game, if you had ears almost ringing from gunshots once shooting match starts.
(or you wouldn't hear other game sounds if volume adjusted for gun shots)

AE-5 again doesn't have such questions.
It's certainly capable to driving basically any headphone loud and clear to make your hearing take course towards premature retirement.
 
EsaT said:
Without knowing if testing was actually done with binaural sound that can leave results rather vague.
Binaural sound has specific and lot harder requirements than any stereo music and even notably higher price doesn't necessary mean better for gaming.
Actually music can even benefit from smaller sound stage.

Like famous for music Sennheiser HD650 with likely Dolby Headphone in Mad Lust Envy's guide:
Soundstage:
The front/back depth isn't great. Let's get that out of the way. The width is good, but not close to being the best. The DT990 destroys the HD650 in both depth and width. So how's the air within the soundstage? Well, the problem with the HD650, is that it's a very full sounding headphone. Thick, warm tone tends to make the soundstage seems less airy and smaller.
Positioning:
Positioning and soundstage tend to go hand in hand, so if the soundstage isn't great, the positional cues will suffer. How did the HD650 fare positional-wise? Well, they were good. Not great, and could obviously be better...
Clarity:
You need clarity for soundwhoring in competitive gaming...
I've heard better overall (even the 990's are better for soundwhoring). The problem is that the HD650 is a very thick sounding headphone. Basically, the issues I explained in the soundstage section is what hurts clarity for gaming purposes.

Same things which give it its intimate "front row" musicality hurts gaming badly.
So better to focus to known headphones.
First minute of this is excellent quick test for sound stage with gun shots from different directions and distances:
This was another I used in comparison:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8xZp0WPwxs
You can easily test any headphones you have with those.
There should be literal feel of space with sounds coming clearly from different distances...
Instead of everything coming from next to ear/in front of face with some sounds just being more muffled than others. (like in cheap closed design garbages)
AKG K702 is pretty much aural "god mode/wall hack".


That ALC1220 is definitely capable to meeting human ear's accuracy when clearly lower ALC889 (at level of budget sound cards) is pretty much there.
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/high-end-pc-audio,3733-19.html

Realtek chips just lack proper binaural simulation and only some Gigabyte and MSI motherboards have bundled Creative's software set.
And hence would be stuck with what sound options games have (most games don't even have own sound settings) or Windows 10's Windows Sonic for Headphones which seems average.
Plain 2.0/stereo speaker mix is this sucky:
https://youtu.be/d1_20T8x_OI?t=12m56s
Though technical capability for driving headphones would be likely good enough even if MSI's marketing took little "artistic freedom".
With binaural-simulation from sound card game needs to only output standard 5.1/surround sound.

That Xonar DX is again weird card when Asus bundled Dolby Headphone (mediocre bass bloater) with it while 100 ohm output impedance makes it not so good for headphones.
While 250 ohm Beyers would be fine usual lowish ohm headphones would have rather bad (electric) damping factor.
And for some reason Asus seem to have that same lame output impedance in Strix Raid Pro and possibly Strix Soar.
While once again music might not care that hard, but for games you want good signal control of driver.


At the same time Creative has upped their game with Sound BlasterX AE-5 having all around excellent headphone output with near zero output impedance making it good fit for any headphone.

Very well priced Sound Blaster Z actually has very good D/A converter (that DAC) but headphone output is quite typical for sound card.
So adequency for AKGs isn't that certain.
At least for classical music with high dynamic range meaning lowish average signal level (used for setting volume) and then transients and moments with lot higher sound level demanding lot more power.
Though game sounds don't have such dynamic range, because it would be really annoying to play game, if you had ears almost ringing from gunshots once shooting match starts.
(or you wouldn't hear other game sounds if volume adjusted for gun shots)

AE-5 again doesn't have such questions.
It's certainly capable to driving basically any headphone loud and clear to make your hearing take course towards premature retirement.
Click to expand...

Sorry for the late reply! Thank you so much for your help!

I've decided I'll buy the K712 and later decide if I go for an external dac/amp or if I buy the AE-5.
For now I'll test it with my motherboard.


Cheers
 
chief barker said:
How are you finding this AMP?

How would this fare with a pair of AKG K702s and my Panasonic home cinema system?

I need to get something because the wife is moaning about the noise from the surround sound when she's trying to sleep.

Cheers.
Click to expand...

The AMP sounds very good. As in I’m not hearing any difference as if it was directly through the soundcard but with more volume. Things certainly sound clearer since I’m getting more power. Which is so nice now.

The sweet spot I found with the Auzentech X-Fi Prelude is -9.8dB so it doesn’t clip, Windows volume 100% and the AMP at 8 o'clock. The off position is 7 o'clock.

Though when I took the headphones off my head to hear how loud the external sound was, I’m a bit now concerned it is going to be picked up with the Modmic.
 
As far as the mic goes with these, my mate went with the cheap zalman lapel mic clipped onto the cable of his 7xx's. For the price, I genuinely cannot fault it. He's every bit as clear as everyone else. Just... a random "worth considering" when trying to mic a set of headphones. The Zalmans about a £6 rather than nearer £45 for a modmic.

Alternatively a stereo extension lead taped/braided to a suitable mini xlr cable and a "flexible laptop mic" (google image search to see what I'm on about then the usual places for random cheap parts) would probably be quite tidy too. Basically, this (but made to look a bit nicer).

bmVHcgi.jpg

I'm still a big lover of the senns for the nice cable replacement mic effort.

I'm in the chasing pack as far as positional gaming headphones go, 598SR's are pretty awesome to my ears at the moment though :)
 
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Mercutio said:
As far as the mic goes with these, my mate went with the cheap zalman lapel mic clipped onto the cable of his 7xx's. For the price, I genuinely cannot fault it. He's every bit as clear as everyone else. Just... a random "worth considering" when trying to mic a set of headphones. The Zalmans about a £6 rather than nearer £45 for a modmic.

Alternatively a stereo extension lead taped/braided to a suitable mini xlr cable and a "flexible laptop mic" (google image search to see what I'm on about then the usual places for random cheap parts) would probably be quite tidy too. Basically, this (but made to look a bit nicer).

bmVHcgi.jpg

I'm still a big lover of the senns for the nice cable replacement mic effort.

I'm in the chasing pack as far as positional gaming headphones go, 598SR's are pretty awesome to my ears at the moment though :)
Click to expand...

You mean the v-moda boompro + senn combo?

For Senns you need adapter tho, or modding it, right? coz of the lock system?


I'll just get a table microphone to go with my AKG. I still think its better, at least if you wanna use speakers instead you dont need to have your headphones around your neck
 
Hmm, I wonder... What it would be like hooking up my old Creative Audigy 2 ZS to the AKG K702? Or how it would hold up to todays cards...
 
I'm considering new headphones, was going to go with the usual razer etc but saw these, but not sure if my AMD Asus croshair 6 will power these, it's go a supreme fx chip but the ohms thing confuses me, is it bigger number better sound but requires more power to run?
 
V F said:
Hmm, I wonder... What it would be like hooking up my old Creative Audigy 2 ZS to the AKG K702? Or how it would hold up to todays cards...
Click to expand...
Now that's old card. I think I had one.... uh fair dozen years ago.
In fact looks to be old enough for it to have only Win7 drivers from Creative.

It has likely normal for sound card Red Book compliant combined headphone/line out. So 2V rms max for low current draw and ~1V to low impedance.
For headphone gaming it likely has lacking features.
And software package is certainly horrible pile of multiple components with IIRC auto installed splash screens to Windows start-up.
Definite not good old times in that...

Budget level Audigy Fx certainly isn't worser while having lot better software.
 
sgavan said:
I'm considering new headphones, was going to go with the usual razer etc but saw these, but not sure if my AMD Asus croshair 6 will power these, it's go a supreme fx chip but the ohms thing confuses me, is it bigger number better sound but requires more power to run?
Click to expand...
While its RC4580 output opamp isn't comparable to say Objective2 and is little below best sound cards these AKGs aren't some Hifiman HE-5, or god forbid HE-6 "ear speakers".

Headphone impedance tells only their AC resistance, not how much power they need.
Power need is down to efficiency.
Something not usually clearly told and often "obfuscated" by using dBs for 1V signal.
Which can mean quite a lot current and high power for low impedance headphones.

But these AKGs and Beyers are rather average in their efficiency.
250ohm Beyers just draw little current, but for example some mobile devices could lack adequate voltage to give good volume.
(250 ohm impedance just doesn't draw enough current/power from such voltage)
While AKGs don't need as much voltage, they draw more current being equally demanding to outputs.
 
EsaT said:
Now that's old card. I think I had one.... uh fair dozen years ago.
In fact looks to be old enough for it to have only Win7 drivers from Creative.

It has likely normal for sound card Red Book compliant combined headphone/line out. So 2V rms max for low current draw and ~1V to low impedance.
For headphone gaming it likely has lacking features.
And software package is certainly horrible pile of multiple components with IIRC auto installed splash screens to Windows start-up.
Definite not good old times in that...

Budget level Audigy Fx certainly isn't worser while having lot better software.
Click to expand...

I thought that. It only got me curious when I found it going through my hardware stash.

He did tweak the package for Windows 10. https://danielkawakami.blogspot.co.uk/2017/01/sb-audigy-series-support-pack-62.html

Which will no doubt be from the last driver in 2014. http://support.creative.com/Products/ProductDetails.aspx?catID=1&prodID=4915&prodName=Audigy 2 ZS&CatName=Sound+Blaster



I’m just wondering if I should looking into trying other op-amps for the Auzen X-Fi Prelude...
 
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