AMD has decided to extend the life of AM3 + platform.

Martini1991 · 3 Sep 2011 at 13:58

Final8y said:
And your not reading my point.

Your saying that BD should be released on AM3 no matter what & maybe AMD thinks otherwise.

No I never? :confused:

You're actually not reading, or misunderstanding. One of two.
When I said ;
"BD won't work in all AM3 boards due to not everyone having one pin wired"

Isn't that enough of a clue that I NEVER said just release BD on AM3?
I'm saying, why did they even bother to make AM3+ to release Zambezi?
Just go straight to FM2 on Komodo.

Final8y · 3 Sep 2011 at 13:58

davieg said:
Thats what I was trying to get at, at that point surely it would have made more sense to jump to the new socket with the new architecture, than do a few maybe crippled versions that very well may spoil the rep of the CPU, if the rumours are true about it not being able to work to its full potential in either AM3 or AM3+?

Makes sense if everything was ready at the same time but its the same with waiting for the next best thing & when its here then there is a new one on the way. You have to stop at some point & take what's on offer at the time.

wannabedamned · 3 Sep 2011 at 14:02

davieg said:
Thats what I was trying to get at, at that point surely it would have made more sense to jump to the new socket with the new architecture, than do a few maybe crippled versions that very well may spoil the rep of the CPU, if the rumours are true about it not being able to work to its full potential in either AM3 or AM3+?

The Bulldozers will work as intended on AM3+

It's the design process that was crippled.

Martini1991 · 3 Sep 2011 at 14:03

wannabedamned said:
The Bulldozers will work as intended on AM3+

It's the design process that was crippled.

Emphasis

Final8y · 3 Sep 2011 at 14:07

Martini1991 said:
No I never?
You're actually not reading, or misunderstanding. One of two.
When I said ;
"BD won't work in all AM3 boards due to not everyone having one pin wired"

Isn't that enough of a clue that I NEVER said just release BD on AM3?
I'm saying, why did they even bother to make AM3+ to release Zambezi?
Just go straight to FM2 on Komodo.

The problem is first you say there is no point with AM3+ because mobo makers have shown that BD can work on AM3.
And then you say what i have been saying all along with some AM3 mobos wont work.

And because Komodo & FM2 is not here yet and want to release stuff this year and not wait till next year.

davieg · 3 Sep 2011 at 14:08

wannabedamned said:
The Bulldozers will work as intended on AM3+

It's the design process that was crippled.

But why is the design process crippled? Due to the AM3+ socket? If so wouldnt they have gone hang on we need a totally new socket and board design?
Or is it the design of the CPU and changing the board/socket would have made no difference whatsoever, thus making the AM3+ cripples the CPU design as not right.
Ah well I suppose it will get cleared up one way or the other eventually, yeah I suppose it could be that FM2 wouldnt be ready for a while after AMD wanted to launch, am not sure how long a new platform would take to design/produce etc anyone know, and when would AMD have finally decided what socket etc BD had to go on in the design process as they started designing this new arch years ago?

Martini1991 · 3 Sep 2011 at 14:18

davieg said:
But why is the design process crippled? Due to the AM3+ socket? If so wouldnt they have gone hang on we need a totally new socket and board design?
Or is it the design of the CPU and changing the board/socket would have made no difference whatsoever, thus making the AM3+ cripples the CPU design as not right.
Ah well I suppose it will get cleared up one way or the other eventually, yeah I suppose it could be that FM2 wouldnt be ready for a while after AMD wanted to launch, am not sure how long a new platform would take to design/produce etc anyone know?

It's crippled due to the socket as they were keeping backwards compatibility.

But since Zambezi hasn't even launched yet.
The socket that BD was meant for has changed a few times.

davieg · 3 Sep 2011 at 14:22

Martini1991 said:
It's crippled due to the socket as they were keeping backwards compatibility.

But since Zambezi hasn't even launched yet.
The socket that BD was meant for has changed a few times.

But then their official stance is that Zambezi isnt backwards compatible with any other socket? Did they try and make it backwards compatible officially and something wouldn't work right so they ended up with an off design that wouldnt run like they wanted in anything?
Also what in the board/Socket would cripple the performance of the CPU out of interest?
It still doesnt make sense to me why thats all, not saying its not what happened.

Elevon · 3 Sep 2011 at 14:36

I did find this old article about the design etc...

Advanced Micro Devices said that its next-generation desktop processors code-named Zambezi will use socket AM3+ platforms, which will be backwards compatible with the firm's existing AM3 products. While the latter is an advantage for the platform, it may be a disadvantage for eight-core processors based on Bulldozer micro-architecture.

"The existing G34 and C32 server infrastructure will support the new Bulldozer-based server products. In order for AMD’s desktop offering to fully leverage the capabilities of Bulldozer, an enhanced AM3+ socket will be introduced that supports Bulldozer and is backward-compatible with our existing AM3 CPU offerings," an official from AMD said in an interview with Planet3DNow web-site.

Apparently, it was possible for AMD to make Bulldozer microprocessors compatible with existing AM3 infrastructure, but in order to do that, the company would have to sacrifice certain important features of the new core.

"When we initially set out on the path to Bulldozer we were hoping for AM3 compatibility, but further along the process we realized that we had a choice to make based on some of the features that we wanted to bring with Bulldozer. We could either provide AM3 support and lose some of the capabilities of the new Bulldozer architecture or, we could choose the AM3+ socket which would allow the Bulldozer-base Zambezi to have greater performance and capability," the official said.

The compatibility with older microprocessors allows AMD to simplify transition to the new micro-architecture and process design since the new AM3+ platform will support inexpensive chips from day one. However, such compatibility also means that AMD Zambezi processors will only support dual-channel memory controller. Considering the fact that all modern high-end Intel Core i7 processors with up to six cores feature triple-channel memory controller, it is unclear how AMD plans to "feed" eight cores of Zambezi with dul-channel DDR3 without creating bottlenecks.

http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/cpu/display/20100826225852_Desktop_Bulldozer_Processors_Will_Require_New_Platforms_AMD.html

Final8y · 3 Sep 2011 at 14:40

Well done Elevon.

Martini1991 · 3 Sep 2011 at 14:45

davieg said:
But then their official stance is that Zambezi isnt backwards compatible with any other socket? Did they try and make it backwards compatible officially and something wouldn't work right so they ended up with an off design that wouldnt run like they wanted in anything?
Also what in the board/Socket would cripple the performance of the CPU out of interest?
It still doesnt make sense to me why thats all, not saying its not what happened.

I really couldn't tell you.
It was touted AM3 on 890FX not so long ago.

Their official stance is Zambezi isn't supported on AM3.

~>Dg<~ · 3 Sep 2011 at 14:46

so basically its all up in the air and no one knows

if the performance was a good leap from phenom 2 cpus but worked in am3 boards it would be a great upgrade path and i think this is what a lot who have p2 stuff want to know

gareth170 · 3 Sep 2011 at 14:49

Elevon said:
I did find this old article about the design etc...

http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/cpu/di...rocessors_Will_Require_New_Platforms_AMD.html

yes thats what i said in the other thread

Martini1991 · 3 Sep 2011 at 14:52

Meh, we'll sit tight, wait for launch.

Final8y · 3 Sep 2011 at 14:55

Martini1991 said:
Meh, we'll sit tight, wait for launch.

Exactly which is better than what was posted before the Ninja stole it.

Martini1991 · 3 Sep 2011 at 14:56

Final8y said:
Exactly which is better than what was posted before the Ninja stole it.

Because I can't be fussed.

Final8y · 3 Sep 2011 at 15:02

Martini1991 said:
Because I can't be fussed.

There are times that much comments are what they are when products are not going to see the light of day, but there is no point when we can all find out for ourself when the product hits the self.

zoomee · 3 Sep 2011 at 21:52

EDIT!

DONT WANT TO BE STARTING FALSE RUMOURS LOL! - Ignore my post!

Martini1991 · 3 Sep 2011 at 21:59

Komodo is FM2, thus having a massively different pin layout.
How on Earth would AM3+ fit Komodo?

gareth170 · 3 Sep 2011 at 22:04

zoomee said:
I'll admit I ain't read most of this thread but heres something interesting to throw into the equation: Asus have just released a test BIOS for their 790series of boards for BD too!!!

the point some of us are making, yes BD may work in some am3 boards, but it doesn't mean it will give all the performance/give all features has with am3+ boards.