AMD THREADRIPPER VS INTEL SKYLAKE X

[Rroff]

Or internal capture card that use pci-e slots that intel what you to pay top dollar for the non gimped editions. x2 graphics cards? That'll be $999 please.
Why has nobody mentioned the DLC RAID key that they want to charge for either?
Imagine if this was samsung or apple, there would be a lot more fuss about it.

Probably due to lack of awareness and that a lot of people don't RAID I only had vague awareness of it.

If Intel start doing that kind of thing too often with too many features they are going down consumers don't like those kind of stunts it is one of the few ways you can get consumers voting with their feet.

 

[TheF34RChannel]

Or internal capture card that use pci-e slots that intel what you to pay top dollar for the non gimped editions. x2 graphics cards? That'll be $999 please.
Why has nobody mentioned the DLC RAID key that they want to charge for either?
Imagine if this was samsung or apple, there would be a lot more fuss about it.

Don't say something without having done the research: you can do normal RAID as previously in X299. It's VROC, RAID CPU, that'll cost money and it's cheap as compared to their being only 1 other card manufacturer that currently offers it for ten times as much money for the server market. Intel offering it in a much cheaper package is great! However the Internet being as daft as always does not understand the different types of RAID implementations and immediately jumps to conclusions and starts throwing tantrums - how predictable. That said, they shouldn't have offered it to HEDT at all, imo.

 

[Panos]

Or internal capture card that use pci-e slots that intel what you to pay top dollar for the non gimped editions. x2 graphics cards? That'll be $999 please.
Why has nobody mentioned the DLC RAID key that they want to charge for either?
Imagine if this was samsung or apple, there would be a lot more fuss about it.

Must add, DLC RAID key PER RAID type. If you want raid 1 is one key. If you want raid 5 is different key. If somehow you want both, you have to pay double.
In addition, there aren't enough PCI-E lanes even on the top of the range CPU for any meaningful big workstation.

 

[Mercutio]

this thread needs ripping. it's awful

lets all agree both platforms are slow and what we really want is a 100c200t chip that doesnt need a cooler at all and overclocks to 10ghz

Actually, a chip where the hardware can multi-thread a single thread on the fly (I know, I know ) if we're wishing

 

[gavinh87]

Don't say something without having done the research: you can do normal RAID as previously in X299. It's VROC, RAID CPU, that'll cost money and it's cheap as compared to their being only 1 other card manufacturer that currently offers it for ten times as much money for the server market. Intel offering it in a much cheaper package is great! However the Internet being as daft as always does not understand the different types of RAID implementations and immediately jumps to conclusions and starts throwing tantrums - how predictable. That said, they shouldn't have offered it to HEDT at all, imo.

That's fine. But those that think this is ok better get prepared for the future of intel. What's next? Unlocking dimm slots? Its either a feature of a motherboard or it is not, it shouldn't be an add on via a license key or however they are going to implement it.

 

[Panos]

That's fine. But those that think this is ok better get prepared for the future of intel. What's next? Unlocking dimm slots? Its either a feature of a motherboard or it is not, it shouldn't be an add on via a lisence key or however they are going to implement it.

Actually using the KabyLake-X on the X299 platform is that. If you want to use your motherboard, you have to buy more expensive CPU

 

[gavinh87]

Actually using the KabyLake-X on the X299 platform is that. If you want to use your motherboard, you have to buy more expensive CPU

Does that also mean I lose my igpu and increase my tdp aswell paying for a more expensive board?


I'm sorry I can't help it. Kabylake x is a joke.

 

[humbug]

Must add, DLC RAID key PER RAID type. If you want raid 1 is one key. If you want raid 5 is different key. If somehow you want both, you have to pay double.
In addition, there aren't enough PCI-E lanes even on the top of the range CPU for any meaningful big workstation.

WTF are Intel thinking with this crap?

Who do they think they are? EA? Pay for the product but if you want to used all its features (Raid 1 and 5) you have to buy them extra. They really are an arrogant bunch aren't they?

 

[Rroff]

WTF are Intel thinking with this crap?

Who do they think they are? EA? Pay for the product but if you want to used all its features (Raid 1 and 5) you have to buy them extra. They really are an arrogant bunch aren't they?

The information seems a bit confusing - what you pay for gets a VROC RAID setup that does things beyond normal motherboard controller RAID but it doesn't seem clear on the information I can find how much of the standard motherboard RAID features are/aren't there including RAID5 or not or whether this setup completely replaced the normal Intel RAID controller.

I can kind of see the problems for Intel here as its basically entering enterprise level drive features but at the end of the day that isn't going to sit well with consumers whatever the explanation.

 

[humbug]

The information seems a bit confusing - what you pay for gets a VROC RAID setup that does things beyond normal motherboard controller RAID but it doesn't seem clear on the information I can find how much of the standard motherboard RAID features are/aren't there including RAID5 or not or whether this setup completely replaced the normal Intel RAID controller.

Then lets simplify it, if i get a 7820K do i get Raid 1 and 5 out of the box or not?

I suspect the answer is no, its not confusing at all. reviewers have already talked with board vendors and Intel and the answer is they cost extra because they don't want to sacrifice their professional markets.

 

[Perfect_Chaos]

Then lets simplify it, if i get a 7820K do i get Raid 1 and 5 out of the box or not?

The fact they put 28 lanes on such an expensive CPU (yes it is) in the first place, is BS enough.

 

[Rroff]

Then lets simplify it, if i get a 7820K do i get Raid 1 and 5 out of the box or not?

I suspect the answer is no, its not confusing at all.

It is confusing because there doesn't seem to be any information on what if any functionality will be supported on boards via Intel or Marvell, etc. controllers or if they will be entirely absent. Some but not all GB boards say: "The M2M_32G connector must work with an Intel® VROC Upgrade Key to support RAID configuration" but some just list all forms of RAID without mentioning if you need a VROC key or not.

 

[humbug]

The fact they put 28 lanes on such an expensive CPU (yes it is) in the first place, is BS enough.

Both Linus, Jay and others talked with Industry insiders about it, Intel are trying to protect their mega money professional markets.

On a side note. Initially the intent was to go as far as 12 cores, you know... that incremental upgrade from 10 cores, all the really big CPU's with 18 and 24 cores would be the Xeon line, like the existing $9,000 20 core.

Then Threadripper came along with 16 cores, AMD are going higher than Intel with their Xeon equivalents, upto 48 Cores, Naples has 32 so they just salvage 16 cores out of that for the high end consumer, AMD are also doing their high end line far cheaper than Intel, IMO the X299 12 core was meant to be the 10 core X99 replacement for $1.800, the 16 core Threadripper is half that, i don't think Intel were expecting AMD to introduce enthusiast level CPU's at all let alone with 16 cores and at those prices, certainly the 14, 16 and 18 core Intel chip's were shoehorned in after Threadripper announcements, what it means is Intel have to cannibalise their Exon line, so that they don't lose too much money from Exon users saving thousands by using X299 instead they are stripping out some of the expandability and features.

Edit, Intel, perhaps with good reason didn't think AMD could make CPU's as big as Intel and there-in not challenge their X299 and Xeon lines.
What has caught them off guard is the fact that AMD don't need to, they underestimated AMD's ability to innovate, so arrogant, again, as to think because they didn't invent it no one else can! Infinity Fabric; how AMD stick lots of small CPU's together to make one big one at 100% scaling.

 

[Panos]

Infinity Fabric; how AMD stick lots of small CPU's together to make one big one at 100% scaling.

I can understand the reason behind the idea that brought this innovation.
AMD had/has not the humongous big budget to produce 4-5 different designs-products per market. So, producing a single product with a ability to strap together as many as they can fit, for higher end parts, did make sense. And kudos to the engineers who thought about it.

Imho, I am intrigued applying that to their GPUs. Wrote many months back about Raj's announcement at CES 2017, saying exactly that. That their Vega GPUs in multi GPU environment, will be connected in such way that will work as a single entity, but the usual crowd confused it with Crossfire and was talked down.

 

[Freddie1980]

Then lets simplify it, if i get a 7820K do i get Raid 1 and 5 out of the box or not?

I suspect the answer is no, its not confusing at all. reviewers have already talked with board vendors and Intel and the answer is they cost extra because they don't want to sacrifice their professional markets.

Linus done a rant video the other day it looks like your going to need to buy a USB key to enable extra RAID functionality on those processors (worthwhile watching again as I'm 100% but he defiantly mentioned something about a needing a USD key to unlock/add extra features).

 

[faceman123]

essentially DLC for physical hardware - disgusting practices introduced by intel. another reason to boycott them. AMD maybe 5-10fps slower in gaming but the price to performance ratio more than compensate. even intel fan boys should be grateful for the release of threadripper ryzen

 

[Tom B]

Companies have been doing this for years. I flashed my Radeon 9800 to a 9800 Pro. It was the exact same hardware but the non-pro had lower voltages to prevent higher clocks. The X58 Asus P6T-SE I'm still running is the exact same board as the P6T, the only difference is that SLI is not supported by the BIOS so the board was cheaper as there was no licence to pay nvidia.

Is what intel are doing really any different? The only difference here is that they're admitting it and allowing a legal soft-mod after purchase rather than releasing the same hardware with different feature sets under different model numbers and forcing people to decide up front. Personally, I'd rather be able to buy the basic model and then optionally pay the licences for features if/when I need them.

(and before anyone jumps down my throat, I'm by no means an intel fanboy, I'm planning to get threadripper the second a matx board is available)

 

[humbug]

Companies have been doing this for years. I flashed my Radeon 9800 to a 9800 Pro. It was the exact same hardware but the non-pro had lower voltages to prevent higher clocks. The X58 Asus P9T-SE I'm still running is the exact same board as the P9T, the only difference is that SLI is not supported by the BIOS so the board was cheaper as there was no licence to pay nvidia.

Is what intel are doing really any different? The only difference here is that they're admitting it and allowing a legal soft-mod after purchase rather than releasing the same hardware with different feature sets under different model numbers and forcing people to decide up front. Personally, I'd rather be able to buy the basic model and then optionally pay the licences for features if/when I need them.

(and before anyone jumps down my throat, I'm by no means an intel fanboy, I'm planning to get threadripper the second a matx board is available)

Why do you plan on getting Threadripper instead of Intel?

 

[Tom B]

Why do you plan on getting Threadripper instead of Intel?

Because AMD will likely offer 90% performance at 50% the price. Although I do some gaming, mostly I'm a programmer and now that everything has moved to microservices, for the container/vm work I do, core count is more important than IPC.

 

[beany_bot]

essentially DLC for physical hardware - disgusting practices introduced by intel. another reason to boycott them. AMD maybe 5-10fps slower in gaming but the price to performance ratio more than compensate. even intel fan boys should be grateful for the release of threadripper ryzen

AMD aren't even slower in new games. All games moving forward are seeing AMD and Intel neck and neck. It's only older games where Intel wins. Do we buy for the past or the future?