AMD VEGA confirmed for 2017 H1

Griffildur · 8 Jan 2017 at 19:17

LoadsaMoney said:
AMD Confirms Vega 10 Was Used In DOOM 4K Vulkan Demo, Would Outperform GTX 1080 In OpenGL Too

http://wccftech.com/amd-confirms-vega-10-doom-4k60fps-vulkan-demo-outperform-gtx-1080-opengl/

ok, so reading the title and knowing the kind of stuff they post and also knowing they never post anything true, we can then assume that it's going to be behind in OpenGL. Gotta love analytical skills!

Jono8 · 8 Jan 2017 at 19:18

akarypid said:
Sadly they do... A big chunk of 'buyers' are 10 year olds that drive their parents crazy over getting a PC with an Nvidia card because that's the best one (whether that's true or not). In this demographic 'coolness' is the main factor and right now Nvidia is cool whereas AMD is lame.

The only way to flip this over is for AMD to consistently start beating Nvidia year-on-year for a long (5 years?) time. Then you will get a generation of 10-15-year olds that grew up knowing AMD=good / Nvidia=bad in that sort of brainwashed young-teenager mentality where it's not a matter of reasoning based on logic, but more a matter of being part of the 'cool group'. That whole mindshare thing is a nice way of stating this.

Not competing in the top end and not having a halo/flagship product is a sure fire way of continuing this trend though!

If AMD want to truly compete in the discreet GPU market they need a powerful and competitive chip in the top segment and they know that (hence Vega).

It is like when car manufacturers make a bonkers supercar that they know they won't sell many of at all. It creates good publicity and a halo product to admire, thus increasing how well the brand is perceived.

Griffildur · 8 Jan 2017 at 19:21

akarypid said:
Sadly they do... A big chunk of 'buyers' are 10 year olds that drive their parents crazy over getting a PC with an Nvidia card because that's the best one (whether that's true or not). In this demographic 'coolness' is the main factor and right now Nvidia is cool whereas AMD is lame.

The only way to flip this over is for AMD to consistently start beating Nvidia year-on-year for a long (5 years?) time. Then you will get a generation of 10-15-year olds that grew up knowing AMD=good / Nvidia=bad in that sort of brainwashed young-teenager mentality where it's not a matter of reasoning based on logic, but more a matter of being part of the 'cool group'. That whole mindshare thing is a nice way of stating this.

I'm guessing you got your information on wccftech ...

akarypid · 8 Jan 2017 at 19:23

Jono8 said:
Not competing in the top end and not having a halo/flagship product is a sure fire way of continuing this trend though!

If AMD want to truly compete in the discreet GPU market they need a powerful and competitive chip in the top segment and they know that (hence Vega).

It is like when car manufacturers make a bonkers supercar that they know they won't sell many of at all. It creates good publicity and a halo product to admire, thus increasing how the brand is perceived.

Exactly. Which is why they need to come out on top in the top-end.

A lot of these kids read about the 980ti, the 1080, the Titan and drool over them. Then reality kicks in as negotiations with mummy and daddy steer them down to the 960/970s of the world (or 1050/1060s of today) and they make do with what they can get. Which is definitely not the best bang for their buck, but at least it's the 'cool brand'.

Rroff · 8 Jan 2017 at 19:25

akarypid said:
Exactly. Which is why they need to come out on top in the top-end.

A lot of these kids read about the 980ti, the 1080, the Titan and drool over them. Then reality kicks in as negotiations with mummy and daddy steer them down to the 960/970s of the world (or 1050/1060s of today) and they make do with what they can get. Which is definitely not the best bang for their buck, but at least it's the 'cool brand'.

Its something a lot of people seem to under-estimate in terms of marketing - you don't necessarily need to have a super high end halo product - but a flagship product that is broadly competitive at the top end makes a massive sub-conscious brand impression and helps to shift lower down products by association.

Nexus18 · 8 Jan 2017 at 19:27

Nvidia are just like apple

flopper · 8 Jan 2017 at 19:31

Vega is the card everyone wants to own soon.

Klo · 8 Jan 2017 at 19:45

LoadsaMoney said:
If its hardly any faster than the Fury, if it all, nope.

Well then it wouldn't be the best card AMD have ever released would it? Unless they charge £150 for it or something, in which case it would be great.

vapor matt · 8 Jan 2017 at 19:45

flopper said:
Vega is the card everyone wants to own soon.

AMD marketing rep lol if it does anything like the hype, they will sell loads of them.

And as for mid range cards. well every year you need a new mid range card, as high end becomes next years mid range.

akarypid · 8 Jan 2017 at 19:49

flopper said:
Vega is the card everyone wants to own soon.

Vega 10 is the card that will get the kids waiting on Volta so that 'order is restored and cool Nvidia is back on top'. It will be out of mummy and daddy's price range. When Vega 11 arrives later in the year, I doubt it will grab market share among this demographic.

Now, if AMD manage to counter Volta as well with 7nm Vega, then kids will take notice as a new level of 'cool' will start being formed in the minds of 10-12 year olds... Mummy and daddy better throuw out that lame 1060 their older brother got and get them an RX680 (or whatever small node-shrinked Vega is called).

Gregster · 8 Jan 2017 at 20:01

akarypid said:
Sadly they do... A big chunk of 'buyers' are 10 year olds that drive their parents crazy over getting a PC with an Nvidia card because that's the best one (whether that's true or not). In this demographic 'coolness' is the main factor and right now Nvidia is cool whereas AMD is lame.

The only way to flip this over is for AMD to consistently start beating Nvidia year-on-year for a long (5 years?) time. Then you will get a generation of 10-15-year olds that grew up knowing AMD=good / Nvidia=bad in that sort of brainwashed young-teenager mentality where it's not a matter of reasoning based on logic, but more a matter of being part of the 'cool group'. That whole mindshare thing is a nice way of stating this.

Where on earth did you get that info from? I have built several gaming PCs from £500 to a £1000 for friends (mainly friends kids) and at no time at all has it been stated that NVidia is a must have GPU, not once!

Gregster · 8 Jan 2017 at 20:03

humbug said:
A lot of people who want GTX 1080 beaters are actually Nvidia buyers and the only reason they want GTX 1080 beating AMD cards is so Nvidia release the GTX 1080TI and drop the price of the GTX 1080.

So much salt in this thread!

beany_bot · 8 Jan 2017 at 20:06

humbug said:
Exactly... GPU over £350 are a fraction of the market, like single digit percentage points and 80% of those are Nvidia so there is no point really in AMD investing in mega expensive GPU's, they don't get that investment back.

Thats not strictly true. There is something very powerful about having the "top" card. Even if it were sold at a loss. It cements your brand in peoples minds. A bit like car enthusiasts will drool over the new Audi R8 but likely go on to buy an Audi A3. But the R8 shows them the brand is decent.

The TXP makes Nvidia much more money than from just the sales of that card alone. 100%

DarrenM343 · 8 Jan 2017 at 20:11

Reading a financial article earlier and seem to think both ZEN and Vega are launching in a matter of days? So much mis-information around

DarrenM343 · 8 Jan 2017 at 20:15

flopper said:
Vega is the card everyone wants to own soon.

Do they get a free fanboi badge?

akarypid · 8 Jan 2017 at 20:15

Gregster said:
Where on earth did you get that info from? I have built several gaming PCs from £500 to a £1000 for friends (mainly friends kids) and at no time at all has it been stated that NVidia is a must have GPU, not once!

That's because they trust **you**. It's one thing to get friends to reach out to you or me (supposedly because we are more knowledgable) to make a PC and another to order an Alienware desktop.

Also, it's not info, it's my personal opinion.

old gamer · 8 Jan 2017 at 20:15

Gregster said:
Where on earth did you get that info from? I have built several gaming PCs from £500 to a £1000 for friends (mainly friends kids) and at no time at all has it been stated that NVidia is a must have GPU, not once!

I would agree with that, most people I've met new to pc gaming don't even know the difference between nvidia and amd

Gregster · 8 Jan 2017 at 20:19

old gamer said:
I would agree with that, most people I've met new to pc gaming don't even know the difference between nvidia and amd

Yer, I ask if there is any requirements and they give me a list of games they want to play and a budget. GPU's have never been mentioned.

LoadsaMoney · 8 Jan 2017 at 20:29

If they are only around the 1070/80 performance, then their dead in the water, as that wont get them market share back will it, as Nvidia own the market, and their owners wont want to switch will they, which is what AMD need a card for.

D.P. · 8 Jan 2017 at 20:39

Jono8 said:
Not competing in the top end and not having a halo/flagship product is a sure fire way of continuing this trend though!

If AMD want to truly compete in the discreet GPU market they need a powerful and competitive chip in the top segment and they know that (hence Vega).

It is like when car manufacturers make a bonkers supercar that they know they won't sell many of at all. It creates good publicity and a halo product to admire, thus increasing how well the brand is perceived.

Exactly, halo product a are about marketing and prestige. Exactly where AMD fall.down. When an uninformed buyer hears that the Nvidia Titan Pascal is the fastest GPUnin the world, or the 1080 is the only choice for realistic priced high end gaming but they only have a budget for a 1060 or RX480, guess what product they will buy?

Furthermore, sales percentage is not a very relevant metric. High end cards have far higher profit margins. Nvidia make money hand over fist with the Titans. That allows them to.push smaller margins at the lower end.

There is also rarely such a big R&D cost in producing a high end GPU. All architectures are designed to be highly scalable, GPUs being massively parallel makes most aspects relatively trivial.