AMD VEGA confirmed for 2017 H1

[AllBodies]

AMD continue to puzzle me - hitting the seasonal market running especially with some of the big game releases coming up would make for strong trading for them.

For big Vega, the delays could be HBM2 related. But since GDDR5X would be more than fine for small Vega, possibly even with a 256-bit interface, I don't see what the hold up is with that.

Wild conjecture, but the delays could be somehow related to the Xbox Scorpio? Since its GPU will be Vega based.

 

[TNA]

When I see H1 I just automatically set my expectations to Q2, even maybe late Q2. But I guess it could be coming out Q1 and they are just giving them selves extra breathing room.

Really hoping Vega is much more than Polaris, doubling 470 will not paint the correct picture. In my opinion it will be a big improvement over Polaris which was never designed with high end in mind.

 

[AllBodies]

If not then its not a very expensive card, and that suits me just fine.

In fact a Fury X with double the VRAM, 1400 MHz clock, and the ~15% IPC gain from Polaris doesn't sound half bad.

All the same though, let's hope they do better than that.

 

[Armadillo]

Yea means first half of the year. like Q1 first quarter etc

Yes that is what it means.

AMD haven't been more specific than sometime in the first 6 months of 2017.

I'd put money on May/June 2017. AMD are *always* late (was initially Q1).

Damn, that's a long time to wait . So the 1070 is pretty much my only worthwhile upgrade (290 at the moment), for the foreseeable future. Hope overclockers get some deals around Christmas then, current price makes me sad .

 

[JediFragger]

Damn, that's a long time to wait . So the 1070 is pretty much my only worthwhile upgrade (290 at the moment), for the foreseeable future. Hope overclockers get some deals around Christmas then, current price makes me sad .

I'd personally get the cheapest 1070 you can now while the game deal is on, get an easy-ish £25 for that.

 

[humbug]

In fact a Fury X with double the VRAM, 1400 MHz clock, and the ~15% IPC gain from Polaris doesn't sound half bad.

All the same though, let's hope they do better than that.

Polaris is Tonga shrunk, which is a lot better for Tessellation, Delta Compression and all that.... than Hawaii.

It still lacks the DX11 Pre-Emption and Tiled Shading of Maxwell and Pascal (same GPU shrunk)

What it does have is Asynchronous Shading, but that's when the dev implements it on PC for DX12 or Vulkan, i say that because i cannot believe Tomb Raider is not using Asynchronous Shading on the Console, it certainly isn't on the PC.

DX12 and Vulkan is no issue for AMD, they do better than Nvidia where used properly.

DX11 is what AMD need to work at, the truth of that is if they don't get parity Pre-Emption and Tiled Shading its a dud.

The fact that they are making it suggests they have sorted it, one thing is for certain, Vega is not Polaris, it would have been far cheaper just to upscale Polaris, and it would have been done long ago.

 

[D.P.]

Sorry, might have been asked before as it's a big thread. But H1 is just sometime in the first half of 2017?

When a company says something like H1 it actually means the end of H1, expect a June launch. If they actually had something like march in mind they would say Q1.

 

[formby]

End 'o' June I reckon.

 

[Rezident]

Get a Nvidia card.

The 1080 looks really good actually, apart from in deus ex which would have been perfect, but some of the benches for it are amazing, especially in some of my older games. Very impressive performance overall, that looks great. OK now I’ll just check the price . . . aahh! *falls to floor clutching chest* help me, please, somebody call an ambulance . . . my heart.

 

[AllBodies]

Polaris is Tonga shrunk, which is a lot better for Tessellation, Delta Compression and all that.... than Hawaii.

It still lacks the DX11 Pre-Emption and Tiled Shading of Maxwell and Pascal (same GPU shrunk)

What it does have is Asynchronous Shading, but that's when the dev implements it on PC for DX12 or Vulkan, i say that because i cannot believe Tomb Raider is not using Asynchronous Shading on the Console, it certainly isn't on the PC.

DX12 and Vulkan is no issue for AMD, they do better than Nvidia where used properly.

DX11 is what AMD need to work at, the truth of that is if they don't get parity Pre-Emption and Tiled Shading its a dud.

The fact that they are making it suggests they have sorted it, one thing is for certain, Vega is not Polaris, it would have been far cheaper just to upscale Polaris, and it would have been done long ago.

Yeah tile based rendering in particular seems to give Nvidia quite a boost. Maxwell vs Kepler was pretty ridiculous considering it was the same node too.

Hope AMD had the foresight to add this when they started designing Vega years ago.

 

[LoadsaMoney]

H1s around June for AMD.

 

[Final8y]

Here we are again you are putting words in my mouth. Where did I say they will be gaining market share by competing at the high end first? You keep doing this over and over. Lol. AMD have already addressed the low end market with Polaris have they not? So what is it you are saying?

You did not even answer my question and went of on a tangent about unrelated stuff once again.


Yes this is about what I want. What else would it be about? I posted what my prediction and expectation is, not to give AMD advice on how to run the company. If AMD do what you are saying they will not get a penny out of me. I am not paying £1k for a graphics card, sorry. I want technology to move forward. What is it that you want? You don't seem to like the idea of AMD making improvements in price for performance which is what they have been very good at until recently, hence why for a very long time I only ever purchased AMD cards. Click my GPU History link in my sig and see.

I don't get it. What exactly do you think AMD need to do that NV cannot beat them either on price or by selling more? Go on enlighten us... I will get Matt to bring your ideas to the attention of Lisa Su

TXP performance is high end and competing with it first or last makes no difference in regards in how much market share it will gain AMD, that amount of cards AMD sell at the price bracket is insignificant so gaining market share should not even be mentioned in regards to it.

Price to performance only mattered to people who only care about price to performance and nothing else and in the enthusiasts bracket that is not the case.

For example the average person who is willing to drop a more than average amount on a car is not going buy a Car with Skoda on the grill even if it was slightly faster than all the other cars in that price range, they just don't have the brand image to get many people to buy it and yes a one off was made which was really a Audi R8 remodeled.

The higher you go up the price bracket the more the brand image matters.

AMD has to sort out its.
Brand image and Marketing which is light years behind Intel and NV, many don't want to drop large sums on a lesser image brand.

Get rid of the Driver stigma which is still perpetuated with no matter how bad NV drivers may be to an individual, the individual said "Im going AMD" and the reply was "don't go AMD there drivers are even worse".

Then you have PhySX, G Sync, Shadowplay ect... many swear blind all theses are worth paying more for then AMD equivalents even if the GPU they have bought is bad in price to performance to the nearest AMD card.
The Rx 470 vs titan 6gb thread, the power of Brand image and status right there when it comes to the Titan recomadtions https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18750268.

When AMD gets that all sorted then they can make worthwhile in inroads at the higher end price bracket.

Getting people to changed brand when they have been loyal to another for many years is can be extremely difficult unless the other brand screws up big.

Get the new people who have yet to become loyal and thats starts at the cheaper end but that still requires good marketing at the very least because even an inferior product with the right marketing can out sell the other as people dont do enough independent research and the superior marketing is all they know hence why when i was getting ready to build my first PC all the enthusiasts i personally knew told me to get a P4 and a NV card but i did my research online first, AMD had the better performance and ATi had the better image quality at the time in desktop and gaming after reading a lot of reviews.

So AMD cards in the £450 and up will hardly make a dent when it comes to market share until they tackle what i have mentioned or unless they have something really special and the biggest thing that is helping AMD at the moment is Dx12 and Vulcan and arguably the Console connection and the drivers stigma is starting to subside slowly.

 

[TNA]

TXP performance is high end and competing with it first or last makes no difference in regards in how much market share it will gain AMD, that amount of cards AMD sell at the price bracket is insignificant so gaining market share should not even be mentioned in regards to it.

Price to performance only mattered to people who only care about price to performance and nothing else and in the enthusiasts bracket that is not the case.

For example the average person who is willing to drop a more than average amount on a car is not going buy a Car with Skoda on the grill even if it was slightly faster than all the other cars in that price range, they just don't have the brand image to get many people to buy it and yes a one off was made which was really a Audi R8 remodeled.

The higher you go up the price bracket the more the brand image matters.

AMD has to sort out its.
Brand image and Marketing which is light years behind Intel and NV, many don't want to drop large sums on a lesser image brand.

Get rid of the Driver stigma which is still perpetuated with no matter how bad NV drivers may be to an individual, the individual said "Im going AMD" and the reply was "don't go AMD there drivers are even worse".

Then you have PhySX, G Sync, Shadowplay ect... many swear blind all theses are worth paying more for then AMD equivalents even if the GPU they have bought is bad in price to performance to the nearest AMD card.
The Rx 470 vs titan 6gb thread, the power of Brand image and status right there when it comes to the Titan recomadtions https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18750268.

When AMD gets that all sorted then they can make worthwhile in inroads at the higher end price bracket.

Getting people to changed brand when they have been loyal to another for many years is can be extremely difficult unless the other brand screws up big.

Get the new people who have yet to become loyal and thats starts at the cheaper end but that still requires good marketing at the very least because even an inferior product with the right marketing can out sell the other as people dont do enough independent research and the superior marketing is all they know hence why when i was getting ready to build my first PC all the enthusiasts i personally knew told me to get a P4 and a NV card but i did my research online first, AMD had the better performance and ATi had the better image quality at the time in desktop and gaming after reading a lot of reviews.

So AMD cards in the £450 and up will hardly make a dent when it comes to market share until they tackle what i have mentioned or unless they have something really special and the biggest thing that is helping AMD at the moment is Dx12 and Vulcan and arguably the Console connection and the drivers stigma is starting to subside slowly.

Right, AMDMatt will pass that up Lisa Su and AMD will have things back on track in no time

On a serious note, I do think you are underestimating how much of an benefit doing well at the high end has. But putting that aside for a moment, you still have not understood what I am saying. You are looking at TXP and it's performance as it is today. My point is that by the time Vega comes out that tier of performance will be coming down. Just think how 1070 now is offering roughly what the Titan X was offering last year. But does the 1070 cost £1000? This is why I expect Vega to bring TXP performance to a 1070/80 price range by summer 2017. Hope you can understand that now, as I don't know how else to explain it

 

[beany_bot]

I just want a high end GPU for less than £700. Is that too much to ask?

 

[Davedree]

When I see H1 I just automatically set my expectations to Q2, even maybe late Q2. But I guess it could be coming out Q1 and they are just giving them selves extra breathing room.

Really hoping Vega is much more than Polaris, doubling 470 will not paint the correct picture. In my opinion it will be a big improvement over Polaris which was never designed with high end in mind.

I hope so too but I said the same about Fiji.
It doesn't make sense to make a little chip on one architecture on a new process to experiement with transistors and yield rates, then a completely different architecture on the same process.

In other words Tonga was never intended to be high end just like Polaris 10 isn't, however Tonga was a prototype of transistor density before they scaled it up by x2, hence 1792/2048 = Fiji 3584/4096.
Either way if Vega is just big Polaris scaled up x2 then we'll know roughly what we are getting when it arrives LATE to the party. If it's a tweaked Gcn that we haven't seen yet then brilliant.

 

[h4rm0ny]

TXP performance is high end and competing with it first or last makes no difference in regards in how much market share it will gain AMD, that amount of cards AMD sell at the price bracket is insignificant so gaining market share should not even be mentioned in regards to it.

Price to performance only mattered to people who only care about price to performance and nothing else and in the enthusiasts bracket that is not the case.

For example the average person who is willing to drop a more than average amount on a car is not going buy a Car with Skoda on the grill even if it was slightly faster than all the other cars in that price range, they just don't have the brand image to get many people to buy it and yes a one off was made which was really a Audi R8 remodeled.

The higher you go up the price bracket the more the brand image matters.

AMD has to sort out its.
Brand image and Marketing which is light years behind Intel and NV, many don't want to drop large sums on a lesser image brand.

Get rid of the Driver stigma which is still perpetuated with no matter how bad NV drivers may be to an individual, the individual said "Im going AMD" and the reply was "don't go AMD there drivers are even worse".

Then you have PhySX, G Sync, Shadowplay ect... many swear blind all theses are worth paying more for then AMD equivalents even if the GPU they have bought is bad in price to performance to the nearest AMD card.
The Rx 470 vs titan 6gb thread, the power of Brand image and status right there when it comes to the Titan recomadtions https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18750268.

When AMD gets that all sorted then they can make worthwhile in inroads at the higher end price bracket.

Getting people to changed brand when they have been loyal to another for many years is can be extremely difficult unless the other brand screws up big.

Get the new people who have yet to become loyal and thats starts at the cheaper end but that still requires good marketing at the very least because even an inferior product with the right marketing can out sell the other as people dont do enough independent research and the superior marketing is all they know hence why when i was getting ready to build my first PC all the enthusiasts i personally knew told me to get a P4 and a NV card but i did my research online first, AMD had the better performance and ATi had the better image quality at the time in desktop and gaming after reading a lot of reviews.

So AMD cards in the £450 and up will hardly make a dent when it comes to market share until they tackle what i have mentioned or unless they have something really special and the biggest thing that is helping AMD at the moment is Dx12 and Vulcan and arguably the Console connection and the drivers stigma is starting to subside slowly.

I'm very happy to be the sort of person who cares more about performance than what people think of my graphics card.

 

[Rezident]

I just want a high end GPU for less than £700. Is that too much to ask?

Me too, but apparently that is too much to ask. Nvidia’s prices are disgusting, makes me hate them and never want to support them again if there is any alternative. Unfortunately, there is no alternative! Makes me angry enough to turn some graphics settings down! Which I did, and was shocked to see that surprisingly, games still look absolutely amazing once they’re immersive enough. Hmm, something to think about.

 

[meldarthx]

I hope so too but I said the same about Fiji.
It doesn't make sense to make a little chip on one architecture on a new process to experiement with transistors and yield rates, then a completely different architecture on the same process.

In other words Tonga was never intended to be high end just like Polaris 10 isn't, however Tonga was a prototype of transistor density before they scaled it up by x2, hence 1792/2048 = Fiji 3584/4096.
Either way if Vega is just big Polaris scaled up x2 then we'll know roughly what we are getting when it arrives LATE to the party. If it's a tweaked Gcn that we haven't seen yet then brilliant.

Vega isn't Polaris - honestly from looking at Polaris and looking around - less I think its a shrunk tonga too. It has tonga parts but looks more like it was born out of making PS4 Pro graphics - way it scales etc - along with the fact it looked to be pipecleaner for 14nm.

Lots of rumors still have rumor of small vega coming in possibly next month; but again still rumor - few other water cooler rumors vega coming sooner than we've been lead to believe etc........we'll just wait and see

 

[humbug]

Vega isn't Polaris - honestly from looking at Polaris and looking around - less I think its a shrunk tonga too. It has tonga parts but looks more like it was born out of making PS4 Pro graphics - way it scales etc - along with the fact it looked to be pipecleaner for 14nm.

Lots of rumors still have rumor of small vega coming in possibly next month; but again still rumor - few other water cooler rumors vega coming sooner than we've been lead to believe etc........we'll just wait and see

Well, for now there is still a group of GTX 970/80 - R9 390/X owners waiting on AMD.

 

[Rroff]

Me too, but apparently that is too much to ask. Nvidia’s prices are disgusting, makes me hate them and never want to support them again if there is any alternative. Unfortunately, there is no alternative! Makes me angry enough to turn some graphics settings down! Which I did, and was shocked to see that surprisingly, games still look absolutely amazing once they’re immersive enough. Hmm, something to think about.

It isn't so much the prices which disgust me but that they've also got away with pulling all the GPUs down a tier or even more in some cases - I expected 16nm GPUs to not be cheap as its pretty costly development wise but still no reason except greed why they couldn't have produced the pathetic excuse for a Pascal Titan as the actual x80 card at around £500-600 with the rest trickling down from there.