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*** AMD "Zen" thread (inc AM4/APU discussion) ***

TheBiznes said:
@TaKeN Anadatech

AMD is back, let's not get it twisted, AMD is back and matching INTEL and there's no other way to look at it. Sure you can nit pick here and there, but grand scheme of things, put up an INTEL CPU at 3.4GHz and compare it to 1800X and AMD will win. I can prove this, I have seen this and you all will this coming week.

AMD has extremely good memory bandwidth efficiency, better than INTEL's even in dual channel mode. So I wouldn't say the IMC is weaker per se, yes it's over 1GHZ lower than what INTEL can manage on air cooling (4266MHZ DDR4 vs 3200MHz max on AMD), but weaker is to undersell what AMD has managed here.
So in dual channel mode @ 3200MHZ, CL15 you can get up to 50GB/s memory writes in AIDA 64 which is damn near theoretical limit and that's at CL15.
AMD IMC always runs a command rate of 1T/1N. You can't change it at all and you also can't use really use the tight timings that we can right now on INTEL platforms. Those 12-12-12-26 B-die timings are not going to happen, but no matter, you'll still whip most 7700K systems that aren't tuned to death.

Overclocking this platform is crazy complicated and unrewarding. The clock speeds are low and if you have dreams of a 4.5GHz 24/7 setup, best forget it. In fact most of us will run 3.8 to maybe 4GHz on all cores if we're lucky for 24/7. 1.4V at 4GHz = 90'C load temp with air cooler, so be mindful of that. We need new coolers for the most part because the CPU height is not the same as previous CPUs amongst other changes.

For Haswell-E 5960X to match or beat 1800X (3.6~ 3.7GHzGHz) you'll need about 4.5GHz in the multithreaded programs as Ryzen is ridiculously fast at this beating 6950X sometimes.

And perhaps this follow up

What he means is that a lot of voltage is required for next to no tangible gains. XFR is not guaranteed, it is thermal limited and it needs high end cooling to even push XFR frequency. It is like overclocking a Thuban all over
Click to expand...

Not keen on any of this news at all. 1.4v and 90c for 4.0 default turbo clock on all cores on an 1800x? It sounds like Intel will still have a big advantage in less threaded apps. If coffee lake clocks well and the 6 cores are reasonably priced against zen, could get interesting. Given those temps and voltages, it makes you wonder if the 1700x really is a lesser chip as it sounds like 4.0 is very near the limit already unless under water.

There's a lot of people wanting more cores and threads for gaming now given we're slowly starting to see more benefit, bf1 being a good example. However, for games that only require 4 cores, Kaby at 4.8 say will have the advantage. Lots of people wanting zen would sacrifice the lower clocks for more cores and threads but at 3.8-4.0 top end, I'm not sure that kind of defecit is worth it currently. Perhaps the 6c will clock better with lower temps. If that's the case and it can get to 4.3, a lot of gamers will opt for the 1600x I'd guess.
 
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five8five said:
The leaked prices start to make sense.

AMD will still sell loads as lots of people don't overclock their CPUs or GPUs including a surprising number on this forum!
Click to expand...
I don't bother overclocking anymore as the only difference I saw was benchmarking and found that boring after a while
 
Im stilling thinking the XFR editions are the ones to buy for enthusiasts as most of us will be using decent cooling so can eek out the extra performance, but dont be surprised if they cant be pushed really high. I still like the look of the 1800X, although the 6/12t might be the more sensible option if it allows a bit higher OC with XFR. Needless to say though i think a hefty air cooler or a top end AIO is warranted on the XFR chips to get that extra bit of oomph.
 
It does not bother me if ryzen does not overclock that well,i just want a good upgrade from my 8 year old i7 920.
And it looks like Amd will provide that for a fair price.
 
karik666 said:
It does not bother me if ryzen does not overclock that well,i just want a good upgrade from my 8 year old i7 920.
And it looks like Amd will provide that for a fair price.
Click to expand...

I think that will be the primary focus for most people to be honest. If I can get an 1700X and get it to say maybe 4.1-4.2GHz with XFR and a decent AIO and maybe a little overclocking/tweaking, that will seemingly still absolutely smash anything I could get from Intel with similar pricing for anything that properly utilises multicore, and will be stones throw in ST (~10%).

If some do overclock well, it'll be a nice bonus, but really, that's what it'll be, a nice bonus.

Obviously will hold final judgment until reviews are with us, but still, it's that close now I think the leaks we're seeing are going to be about on the mark, and realistically the figures are looking half decent.

I would push for an 1800X in hopes of potentially better silicon but think may be a little too princely a sum for me.
 
Silent_Scone said:
Works, because the truth hurts. It's in the site name :p. It's not just with these things, either. It's just how most Brits are dialed in. Boring.
Click to expand...

lol so you think everyone who posts here is an ardent overclocker just because the shops name is called overclockers haha :D

I'm afraid the word "boring" is subjective. I find benchmarking boring, I'd much rather be doing something productive with my PC than sit twiddling my thumbs waiting for an arbitrary "score" from some program
 
AMD Ryzen CPUs pictured

AMD-Ryzen-CPUs-2.jpg


https://videocardz.com/66149/amd-ryzen-cpus-pictured
 
ljt said:
lol so you think everyone who posts here is an ardent overclocker just because the shops name is called overclockers haha :D

I'm afraid the word "boring" is subjective. I find benchmarking boring, I'd much rather be doing something productive with my PC than sit twiddling my thumbs waiting for an arbitrary "score" from some program
Click to expand...

Don't recall anyone talking about benchmarking? We're talking about overclocking. Overclocking to me is getting the most out of ones system that can be used practically.
 
Silent_Scone said:
Don't recall anyone talking about benchmarking? We're talking about overclocking. Overclocking to me is getting the most out of ones system that can be used practically.
Click to expand...

It was in reference to your reply to old gamers post about finding benchmarking boring
 
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