*** AMD "Zen" thread (inc AM4/APU discussion) ***

[ToTheMax]

ryzen is a great cpu just not as fast as intel for gaming.no smoke and mirrors if you game mainly intel chips are still the best option.if you do other things i would think about ryzen. if you a professional or want the best wait for x299

What I don't understand though is why would anyone consider buying such hardware only to game at 1080p, I would think 1440p 120Hz / ultrawide / 4K is the target audience. Gaming scores at 1080p are pointless imo.

 

[Yaayuh!]

I was having a discussion about why SMT might cause issues on another forum,and it is mentioned in the Hardware.fr review:

http://www.hardware.fr/articles/956-22/retour-sous-systeme-memoire.html

What someone had to say about it:



So it seems the 4C/8T models might actually less affected and it seems AMD launching this before proper Windows patches has caused the problem.

Also looks like it's easily fixable with driver update and patches.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

AMD and launch drivers eh?

Can't say this helped my mid position on them on the market, but then again even NVIDIA took a negative 3.66% hit

TBF dude,it smashes the back doors of the FX9590 in,so its massive progress for AMD as a whole.

 

[Zhuni]

"At the identical voltage both the 1700x and 1800x are 20c hotter than the 65w 1700 at also the same voltage in my persosnal testing."

Am I missing something here? Why hotter?

Anyone?

 

[Troezar]

ryzen is a great cpu just not as fast as intel for gaming.no smoke and mirrors if you game mainly intel chips are still the best option.if you do other things i would think about ryzen. if you a professional or want the best wait for x299

If you game at low res, who pays £300-500 for a CPU and doesn't fork out for at least a 1440p monitor? Some of this is just disingenuous. Ryzen matches Intel at any sensible high end gaming resolution and is much cheaper. For the few percent difference you'd have to be mad, rich or both to buy Intel and you certainly would not notice the difference if you didn't know what was inside.

Stolen from elsewhere but the "Intel Damage Control Team" is out in full force on the Interwebs tonight.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Anyone?

The R7 1700 is probably a lower leakage part,whereas the higher tier ones probably are so can take more voltage.

 

[haszek]

Anyone?

I'd say bugs with reading info from temp sensors

 

[N19h7m4r3]

TBF dude,it smashes the back doors of the FX9590 in,so its massive progress for AMD as a whole.

Oh it certainly does. For the overall price it's also beating my x99 5820K system I bought shortly after those launched.

AMD just need to sort out the gaming performance (which they should have done before launch), and they'll be set with an amazing all round top of the line competitor.

 

[sidthesexist]

Anyone?

Steve at Gamers Nexus was reporting their 1800x as thermal throttling at times as well iirc?

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Oh it certainly does. For the overall price it's also beating my x99 5820K system I bought shortly after those launched.

AMD just need to sort out the gaming performance (which they should have done before launch), and they'll be set with an amazing all round top of the time competitor.

I really think AMD needs to get it out there that the reviews were not run with proper windows drivers - the thing is my mate saw it in the comments section of that review and mentioned it to me,otherwise how many people would know that AMD is still waiting on windows drivers or the support is now quite there??

 

[KingDazza]

If you game at low res, who pays £300-500 for a CPU and doesn't fork out for at least a 1440p monitor? Some of this is just disingenuous. Ryzen matches Intel at any sensible high end gaming resolution and is much cheaper. For the few percent difference you'd have to be mad, rich or both to buy Intel and you certainly would not notice the difference if you didn't know what was inside.

Stolen from elsewhere but the "Intel Damage Control Team" is out in full force on the Interwebs tonight.

Erm. That would be me. I admit it, I'm a 1080p gamer. There I've said it. I feel better now. 55" panel though mind, rather than an ickle monitor.

 

[KingDazza]

I really think AMD needs to get it out there that the reviews were not run with proper windows drivers - the thing is my mate saw it in the comments section of that review and mentioned it to me,otherwise how many people would know that AMD is still waiting on windows drivers or the support is now quite there??

Thing is, over time newer games will have cpu performance comparisons and a more matured Ryzen will start to show its full capabilities.

 

[Nelly]

The R7 1700 is probably a lower leakage part,whereas the higher tier ones probably are so can take more voltage.

Yeah it mentions in the review by Chew at xtremesystems.org about it.

The breadcrumb trail is there model list and TDP ratings. 65w 8c/16t (low leakage) 95w 8c/16t (high leakage).

To further confirm this a trait of low leakage is cooler chip. Higher leakage hotter chip.

At the identical voltage both the 1700x and 1800x are 20c hotter than the 65w 1700 at also the same voltage in my persosnal testing.

You guys may rememember TWKR that they sent out to ln2 overclockers? Failed TDP high leakage chips that ran HOT.

Another supporting factor is the LN2 results done inhouse by AMD. 1800x.

Lower leakage = better air water. Higher leakage = extreme cooling

Conclusion : Enthusiasts will most likely do best playing the silicon lottery in the 1700 flavor and or the lower tdp of the scale per core count if 6 4 or 2 is your flavor.

Use the $170 USD saved to get yourself some nice memory and some other stuff.

Awesome Sauce!

 

[Hotwired]

"At the identical voltage both the 1700x and 1800x are 20c hotter than the 65w 1700 at also the same voltage in my persosnal testing."

Am I missing something here? Why hotter?

What is Ryzen?

Ryzen is an intelligent chip that overclocks itself dyanamically by tdp. What that means for the mainstream is they don't need to do countless hours of testing, read forums, fumble around in a bios that they have no clue what settings actually do. Eventually they end up copying someone elses settings and crash because silicon is not equal.

What does that mean for Enthusiasts?

It means we need to see if AMD left any breadcrumbs or any performance on the board that we can squeeze out of the chip since we usually ignore and exceed TDP anyway.
Luckily that is the case. There is a breadcrumb trail and there are ways to get better performance.

The breadcrumb trail is there model list and TDP ratings. 65w 8c/16t (low leakage) 95w 8c/16t (high leakage).

To further confirm this a trait of low leakage is cooler chip. Higher leakage hotter chip.

At the identical voltage both the 1700x and 1800x are 20c hotter than the 65w 1700 at also the same voltage in my persosnal testing.

You guys may rememember TWKR that they sent out to ln2 overclockers? Failed TDP high leakage chips that ran HOT.

Another supporting factor is the LN2 results done inhouse by AMD. 1800x.

Lower leakage = better air water. Higher leakage = extreme cooling

Conclusion : Enthusiasts will most likely do best playing the silicon lottery in the 1700 flavor and or the lower tdp of the scale per core count if 6 4 or 2 is your flavor.

Use the $170 USD saved to get yourself some nice memory and some other stuff.

You need to read the whole section not chop a line out.

He reckons they've been binned to fit the wattage and 1700x and 1800x are higher leakage chips.

Goes on to say that the lower leakage chips are preferable for normal cooling types while the higher leakage ones are more suitable for liquid nitrogen benchmarking etc.

 

[harney]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04p_ryVM2ow&feature=em-lbcastemail

 

[Troezar]

Erm. That would be me. I admit it, I'm a 1080p gamer. There I've said it. I feel better now. 55" panel though mind, rather than an ickle monitor.

Lol do you feel better now? I think playing on a TV is a much bigger confession than 1080p!

 

[Zhuni]

You need to read the whole section not chop a line out.

He reckons they've been binned to fit the wattage and 1700x and 1800x are higher leakage chips.

Goes on to say that the lower leakage chips are preferable for normal cooling types while the higher leakage ones are more suitable for liquid nitrogen benchmarking etc.

Right so if I'm overclocking manually on air then 1700 is the only decent option?

I just chopped that line out as I don't understand the rest lol

And so if the 1700x is clocked at say 3.9 and the 1700 is clocked at 3.9 and they are both running the same volts then the 1700 will be 20c cooler?

 

[N19h7m4r3]

I really think AMD needs to get it out there that the reviews were not run with proper windows drivers - the thing is my mate saw it in the comments section of that review and mentioned it to me,otherwise how many people would know that AMD is still waiting on windows drivers or the support is now quite there??

I know! I looked at the comments and saw that as well. Even then though there's a massive variance between gaming performance for many reviewers.

So far Joker is the only one to just run the games with Afterburner overlay and let people look at the raw numbers themselves. I agree entirely though that AMD should have clarified about the Windows Drivers, and other micro code updates that still need to come.

Although if you ask me they should have waiting another month for the majority of those to be out and fixed before launching. It looks horrible for them, and hurt their market share price.
Down 7.12% is massive, and market even opened with a peak of $14.78, and just closed at $13.885.
That hurts them, and sends another bad message to short and medium term investors. It stung me, a little small fry. I can only imagine what it did to real players.

All of which could have been avoided by either informing reviewers about the missing updates, or just delaying the launch by another month. The latter might have boosted and kept them over $15, and then clenched it as the new minimum when Ryzen launched and did well not only on Workstation tasks but also gaming.

So close, and then fumbled right at the finishing line. Now they're stuck with this bruise, and what'll obviously be another "AMD sucks for gaming" circlejerk; while ignoring that the 1800X is still competing with the 5960X and 6900K at half the price.
Some reviewers even have the 1700@ 3.9Ghz on air cooler barely behind the 7700K @5Ghz.
Ryzen has amazing potential, and AMD just needs to sort out their launches.

 

[Hotwired]

Right so if I'm overclocking manually on air then 1700 is the only decent option?

I just chopped that line out as I don't understand the rest lol

In his opinion, yes.

To cap it off it's the cheapest so you save money to get better other parts.

 

[Tyrand]

I can't say I've experienced a CPU launch before but dang I'm just trying give companies my money and places are out of stock. Didn't get my order dispatched because Gigabyte sent barely any motherboards to OcUK? - ( Or is demand just that high? )

Still I'm pretty desperate - might get Saturday shipping with a different motherboard.