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*** AMD "Zen" thread (inc AM4/APU discussion) ***

The dilemma I have is the majority of games I like to play happen to be Nvidia tie-ins or Gameworks titles.

But on the flip side, I want to go AMD to complement my Ryzen CPU and get better DX12 and Vulkan support. Two areas where Nvidia is weakest.

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Ideally we would fast forward to Volta and I could get an Nvidia card built from the ground up for the DX12 era. Something the 1000 series I feel isn't.

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It doesn't make much sense why Nvidia would be open sourcing Gameworks as this is one of the feathers in their cap. It must mean that indeed Gameworks is something more and more Devs are choosing not to use.

But that's still a wait and see thing because up untill recently allot of Devs have been using Gameworks.
 
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opethdisciple said:
The dilemma I have is the majority of games I like to play happen to be Nvidia tie-ins or Gameworks titles.

But on the flip side, I want to go AMD to complement my Ryzen CPU and get better DX12 and Vulkan support. Two areas where Nvidia is weakest.

---

Ideally we would fast forward to Volta and I could get an Nvidia card built from the ground up for the DX12 era. Something the 1000 series I feel isn't.
Click to expand...

On the Bright side the two most used Gameworks features are opensource now. PhysX and HBAO+

Hell even at the moment in some games HBAO+ runs better on AMD than NVIDIA, and that's before it went open source.

As for AMD GPU with Ryzen, it really seems to be the way to go. They seems to have optimised the hell out of their drivers to work with Ryzen, where is on NVIDIA there's performance regression in some cases.

It'll be very interesting to see if reviewers are going to bother putting Vega on an AMD testbench when it launches.
 
N19h7m4r3 said:
Man, I've used NVIDIA for a looong time and honestly Gameworks isn't bad..it's how it's implemented; and if the developers decide to Pay Up for Source code.

The issue is, the eye candy doesn't nearly justify the performance hit. I loved Hairworks for the Witcher 3, I think it's fundamental in creating an amazing world.

The issue is, that it needed SLI 980/Tis or a Titan X to run with all the goodies turned on.
Then look at PhysX when it runs off the CPU, like in Project Cars. Obliterates performance on anything except the latest and greatest from NVIDIA, never mind poor AMD.

It also doesn't help that the majority of games it's usually included with a Buggy disasters. Hello Ubisoft, and WB Batman Arkham Knight. :/

I truly hope now that it's becoming more Open Source developers and AMD will use the Source Code to optimise and tailor the solution to their needs and performance requirements.

Just look at what was done in Rise of the Tomb Raider with "Pure Hair"; it was TressFX source code that was modified and tailored. The end result? a 4FPS drop in performance between OFF, and Max.
Trying that with Hairworks in the Witcher 3 would slice your FPS in half.
Click to expand...
I started playing Borderlands 2 recently and the PhysX setting is ridiculous. On High, combat sections dip to 11-12 FPS (!!) whilst the rest of the game is sitting happily at 80-120 FPS. Since changing it to Low it never dips below 60 FPS. PhysX clearly isn't using a separate thread either since I have plenty free during gameplay.
 
harney said:
i know right just wish we could have 3400 3600 mem settings rather than pushing the blc bus clock i can not push my bus clocks as it would freak out the legacy pci sound cards



That is what i like to hear :)
Click to expand...

I'm hoping for this too. Maybe with future updates.
 
teppic said:
What's a typical stable bus clock if you don't have any extra cards (other than graphics)?
Click to expand...

Completely dependant on board, cpu and memory. I'm currently testing out some bclk adjustments but not having much luck despite having a very good board and very good ram :/
 
N19h7m4r3 said:
On the Bright side the two most used Gameworks features are opensource now. PhysX and HBAO+

Hell even at the moment in some games HBAO+ runs better on AMD than NVIDIA, and that's before it went open source.

As for AMD GPU with Ryzen, it really seems to be the way to go. They seems to have optimised the hell out of their drivers to work with Ryzen, where is on NVIDIA there's performance regression in some cases.

It'll be very interesting to see if reviewers are going to bother putting Vega on an AMD testbench when it launches.
Click to expand...

Agree this is where AMD are stronger being able to do both strong cpu's & gpu's under one roof ....Nvidia on the other hand not the case apart from tegra
AMD have the upper hand here more so with being in the current consoles too ...

I myself is going Vega ...its certainly going to be an interesting summer for AMD
 
teppic said:
What's a typical stable bus clock if you don't have any extra cards (other than graphics)?
Click to expand...

Depends on how the cards clocks are effected ....most sound cards are a no no above there spec

you end up with audio jitters or worse bsod restarts
 
harney said:
Agree this is where AMD are stronger being able to do both strong cpu's & gpu's under one roof ....Nvidia on the other hand not the case apart from tegra
AMD have the upper hand here more so with being in the current consoles too ...

I myself is going Vega ...its certainly going to be an interesting summer for AMD
Click to expand...

I agree. But then this needs to be reflected in performance. I imagine Nvidia won't say a thing about their drivers not working great with Ryzen and just silently improve things so as to not affect sales.
 
DragonQ said:
I started playing Borderlands 2 recently and the PhysX setting is ridiculous. On High, combat sections dip to 11-12 FPS (!!) whilst the rest of the game is sitting happily at 80-120 FPS. Since changing it to Low it never dips below 60 FPS. PhysX clearly isn't using a separate thread either since I have plenty free during gameplay.
Click to expand...

If you have an AMD/ATI card it uses the CPU for PhysX and performance plummets - I saw the same when using a HD5850 to run it. From what I remember it actually only hogs one thread too.
 
harney said:
i know right just wish we could have 3400 3600 mem settings rather than pushing the blc bus clock i can not push my bus clocks as it would freak out the legacy pci sound cards



That is what i like to hear :)
Click to expand...
What is going on in that picture.... cinebench ghz doesn't match with cpu-z ghz. (3.89 vs 4.2ghz) and at least the memory is showing as 19xx mhz? Maybe you mentioned it, but what on earth is going on with that picture?
 
Scougar said:
What is going on in that picture.... cinebench ghz doesn't match with cpu-z ghz. (3.89 vs 4.2ghz) and at least the memory is showing as 19xx mhz? Maybe you mentioned it, but what on earth is going on with that picture?
Click to expand...

I have experienced cinebench weirdness myself. Sometimes it shows stock clocks sometimes it gets stuck on the last overclock speed you had. All part of the fun :)
 
gavinh87 said:
I have experienced cinebench weirdness myself. Sometimes it shows stock clocks sometimes it gets stuck on the last overclock speed you had. All part of the fun :)
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Yeah, but look at that RAM... 3800Mhz (1900Mhz). ???

Oh nvm... I saw this was a result from somewhere else, and was a result of BUS speed changes.
 
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My 1700 comes on Saturday.
Woops.

I've got two 1700 builds to do then.

Was going to get 16GB 3200MHZ RAM and the Crosshair as I was getting it on finance, but opted to just get 2666MHZ RAM with the Asus Prime.
25 pound a month for 24 months, so can't complain.
 
Very very interesting video on Ryzen being Smoother.

In the GTA V canned benchmark Ryzen does a little worse than 7700K in FPS, but Intel has severe frame stalls. Some as severe as 250ms.

Ryzen doesn't do it as badly, which results in better playability, as despite lower performance it doesn't hitch as badly.

 
N19h7m4r3 said:
Very very interesting video on Ryzen being Smoother.

In the GTA V canned benchmark Ryzen does a little worse than 7700K in FPS, but Intel has severe frame stalls. Some as severe as 250ms.

Ryzen doesn't do it as badly, which results in better playability, as despite lower performance it doesn't hitch as badly.

Click to expand...

Great stuff thx for the link
was waiting on this one for the numbers to be crunched :)
 
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