Another upcoming 14nm++++++ Desperate CPU from Intel

[jigger]

16 core AMD mainstream chip won't either
the point is, gaming and low threaded workloads are last forte of Intel. AMD need to make sure there is no excuses from Intel fan side with Zen2

AMD are beating the pants off Intel in every metric that matters and matching them in gaming.

 

[humbug]

This is AMD we are talking about. They will manage to cripple themselves somewhere, even though their CPU team is on the roll. I remember when Vega looked like a home run, there was no way it will be slower than 1080ti, just impossible, seeing all the improvements done on paper...
Intel is already where it doesn't want to be. AMD is pushing them from all angles. AMD jumping to 16 cores on mainstream will not have any benefits for AMD. Bragging right are already there with Threadripper. If AMD didn't have Threadripper, then yes, fire away with 16 core AM4 chip to claim top dog. Especially if software was halfway there to use them threads.

With CPU's AMD have done pretty well in the last couple of years, they promised 40% IPC gain over Excavator, what they actually achieved was 52%, they said Zen+ would be 10% faster than Zen, its actually 15%, 5% IPC + 10% clocks.

As for GPU's, granted AMD are not competing at the higher end, but they ain't doing bad in the mid range, see spoiler

Spoiler

 

[Jamin280672]

I don't see Ryzen 3000 hitting 16 cores, that eats too much into Threadripper territory. Level off at 12 cores for now, get the internal optimisations up for IPC and memory speed, get Threadripper 3 at a 16-core baseline and then go for 16-core Ryzen 4000.

Since there's still a lot of gum-flapping from AMD's detractors about "throw MOAR corez at it!!!" I'd rather see AMD get Ryzen 3000's actual cores equal or superior to Intels, and then boost the core count just to rub it in everybody's faces.

As a CCX is 4 cores or 8 cores, AMD will either stick to 8 core 16 thread CPU's or go 16 core 32 thread, we will still see 12 core 24 thread parts too etc, but you know......through binning and switching off faulty cores etc.

I wouldn't be surprised though if R7 3700's for instance are still just 8 core 16 thread CPU's just on 7nm with higher clocks and better IPC, for the very point you mentioned about threadripper.

However, another way to look at it is Threadripper is now 32 cores+ so they could make an R9 3900 for instace compatible with the AM4 socket containing 16 cores 32 threads, that's 2 chiplets and a smaller IO die as it only has to drive 2 chiplets, not 8 like Epyc, that would fit on an AM4 package easily.

If they can sell a 16 core 32 thread CPU for the AM4 platform for the same price as say the previous generation Threadripper 16 core 32 thread part, then its a win win for AMD, those things would sell like hot cakes, no need for an expensive X399 motherboard, obvious limitations could be things like less PCI-e lanes etc.

EDIT: Funny how this has turned into another AMD thread after the initial vid I posted was about Intel lol.

 

[DragonQ]

Broadwell and Skylake are 14nm. Kaby Lake and Skylake-X are 14nm+. Coffee Lake and Coffee Lake Refresh are 14nm++. Comet Lake, Cooper Lake, or Whiskey Lake, whatever they eventually call it, is presumably 14nm+++.

I think with Threadripper 2 going to 32c and EPYC 2 being 64c, it's perfectly reasonable for AM4 to get 12 or 16 cores this time around. I don't think 16c is viable yet due to early 7nm yields, power limits, and just the current market generally. It looks like we're still getting 4c CCXs but this time around there'll be two "chiplet" dies. Therefore, going 12c would allow them to still use partially defective EPYC 2 dies, would still beat anything Intel has to offer, and give them something in their back pocket for Ryzen 4 on 7nm+ in 2020 (probably the final AM4 generation).

 

[Journey]

I find it interesting that Intel given their current shortage of 14nm production capacity, see fit to introduce another new product based on it. Sounds to me like a marketing exercise in order to dampen the AMD 7nm launch, after all CES is only 6/7 weeks away and we all know AMD will steal the show, so Intel need to do something, right?

If AMD have anything up their sleeve for the current iteration on Zen+, it may well see the light of day at CES also possibly a 12-core 2800X BE CPU ( not sure if feasible), alongside the announcements of the upcoming Zen2 parts, with a sneak peak at the IPC/clock speed increases potentially. That would put this Intel 10c chip right on schedule to distract from AMD gaining some mental market share as it would appear like they are keeping up still.

 

[ChrisD.]

AMD are beating the pants off Intel in every metric that matters and matching them in gaming.

Really? Must have changed since I last read into it.

What do you mean by every metric that matters?

 

[muziqaz]

If AMD have anything up their sleeve for the current iteration on Zen+, it may well see the light of day at CES also possibly a 12-core 2800X BE CPU ( not sure if feasible), alongside the announcements of the upcoming Zen2 parts, with a sneak peak at the IPC/clock speed increases potentially. That would put this Intel 10c chip right on schedule to distract from AMD gaining some mental market share as it would appear like they are keeping up still.

Anything Zen+ based from now on wouldn't make any sense on Desktop, when they are readying Zen2 based Desktop chips for March, April, May.
Either way, I agree this is pure marketing move from intel. That's all they can do for foreseeable future.

 

[Fire_fly]

ummm, naming a CPU family after something that smashes into the ground as a giant fireball bringing fiery destruction to anything in the vicinity in a an extinction level event. I wonder if it will run a bit hot?

 

[LePhuronn]

ummm, naming a CPU family after something that smashes into the ground as a giant fireball bringing fiery destruction to anything in the vicinity in a an extinction level event. I wonder if it will run a bit hot?

Maybe it's a subtle self-deprecation by Intel given the challenges they'll face for a few years...

 

[muziqaz]

Comets don't crash into the ground, if they do, they are then called something else. They do break up most of the time though, especially closer to the sun. Sun being Zen2

 

[jigger]

Have Intel addressed the elephant is the room yet?That is the big question.

I would much rather Intel brought out a line of secure CPU's than another version of Skylake with yet more cores glued on.

 

[kitfit1]

Have Intel addressed the elephant is the room yet?That is the big question.

I would much rather Intel brought out a line of secure CPU's than another version of Skylake with yet more cores glued on.

It will be a few years before that happens. Even those few years are on the assumption that Intel knew all along about the the security issues and dealt with them in the design stage of any completely new architecture. It will need to be a completely new architecture as well, simply doing the same thing on a smaller node won't solve the security issues.

 

[jigger]

It will be a few years before that happens. Even those few years are on the assumption that Intel knew all along about the the security issues and dealt with them in the design stage of any completely new architecture. It will need to be a completely new architecture as well, simply doing the same thing on a smaller node won't solve the security issues.

I'm pretty sure Intel could addressed some of the hardware security flaws. Granted it might come with a performance penalty, but Intel have already lost the fight.

 

[muziqaz]

One of the reasons their new 48core cpu does not have HT. And they keep mumbling with their new releases that some of their security flaws have been addressed in hardware as well as software. Obviously they kinda elude the specifics on what was fixed in hardware (or maybe they did, but I just missed it), and ignore the fact that software patches give them huge performance penalties

 

[Distracted]

I'm pretty sure Intel could addressed some of the hardware security flaws. Granted it might come with a performance penalty, but Intel have already lost the fight.

They added in silicon fixes for 2 of the security flaws with the 9 series. I expect they can add more with the next. Whether they will or not is anyone's guess, but if a hardware fix has less performance impact compared to a software fix as they say, then it is in their interests to do so from a security and performance stance.

 

[HaroldSaxon]

AMD are beating the pants off Intel in every metric that matters and matching them in gaming.

Beating the pants off them? Sure. Beating them in every metric that matters? There are use cases where Intel is better. Matching them in gaming? It depends.

Here's hoping that the market remains competitive for years to come.

 

[Distracted]

Here's hoping that the market remains competitive for years to come.

 

[faceman123]

AND have smashed it. Literally paying half price in every category for AMD Vs intel. Zen2 will be deviating, saving huge sums of cash and going and makes up for the minor IPC loss, by allowing buyers to upgrade to a high tier of GPU.

9900k + 2070?
2700x + 2080?

It's a win for the consumer, hate the butt hurt fan boys ))

 

[Minstadave]

The dual ring bus brings up the possibility of a multi-die setup like Ryzen.

Would be funny given all the chaff Intel put out regarding AMD's pasted together solution (which was clearly more economically viable than Intel's monolithic alproach).

If it's not multi-die then this is going to run silly hot.

 

[Distracted]

The dual ring bus brings up the possibility of a multi-die setup like Ryzen.

Would be funny given all the chaff Intel put out regarding AMD's pasted together solution (which was clearly more economically viable than Intel's monolithic alproach).

If it's not multi-die then this is going to run silly hot.

I know they were bashing AMD but didn't intel buy some kind of interconnect tech to compete with infinity fabric?

Edit - nope, more to do with their SoC sector it seems.