Caporegime
Are you proud to be British?
- Thread starter Marmot
- Start date
Compared to many other countries, we have it good - But we should be an example for the world, and I can't say we are that right now. Our Politics have been a joke over the past few years, and since we've hit the Trump/Brexit era, things have changed for the worse.
Still proud to be British - We do it better than most
Still proud to be British - We do it better than most
Proud to be English(.) it is like winning the lottery of life.You said you were proud of effectively winning a lottery at life
Two seperate statements.
Compared to many other countries, we have it good - But we should be an example for the world, and I can't say we are that right now. Our Politics have been a joke over the past few years, and since we've hit the Trump/Brexit era, things have changed for the worse.
Still proud to be British - We do it better than most
you mean be proud of how we were? You mean back in our Empire days? Be quiet that sort of talk will get you shot round here.
Wanting a nation to create its own laws and govern itself by its own democratic institutions isn’t setting a good example to the rest of the world?
We could always stay in the EU superstate which will eventually have its own army, it’s own centrally dictated monetary policy and a system of free movement which is systematically destroying the individual cultures of each member nation (certainly in the west).
We could always stay in the EU superstate which will eventually have its own army, it’s own centrally dictated monetary policy and a system of free movement which is systematically destroying the individual cultures of each member nation (certainly in the west).
Soldato
Soldato
Now now, stop talking such sensible talk. We'll have none of that on this forum board. EU is LIFE! EU 4EVER, etc etc...
"The British" aren't anything tho are they. "The British" aren't smart, stupid, friendly, hostile, or anything else at all. "The British" are a spectrum like "The Germans" or whatever. Some of whom you might aspire to be like, some of whom you might pity, some of whom might make you extremely upset/angry.
It's nice (but not necessarily reasonable) when you find out something significant was invented by a Brit. But I think that's more because I value inventiveness and progress, and having lots of British inventions means other people in this country must do also, and we're providing a good supporting framework for these people to shine. But with all that said, I wouldn't for a moment think less of a German invention nor overlook it for being dirty and foreign
But other than that, we have successes and failures, things to admire and things to be repulsed by. Good that our corruption index is quite low, because corruption hurts everyone. We obviously do have lots of corruption in this country, so even that is relative.
There are obviously worse places to live. But I'm not sure that I take pride in something that essentially was a lottery/accident.
It's so hard to generalise anything, because when the scope is so broad as "this country", there are hardly any generalisations that hold true. I don't value nationalism. I do value many aspects of our society and hold these to be better than traits evident in other societies. To put it mildy, I wouldn't go live in Saudi Arabia.
It's nice (but not necessarily reasonable) when you find out something significant was invented by a Brit. But I think that's more because I value inventiveness and progress, and having lots of British inventions means other people in this country must do also, and we're providing a good supporting framework for these people to shine. But with all that said, I wouldn't for a moment think less of a German invention nor overlook it for being dirty and foreign
But other than that, we have successes and failures, things to admire and things to be repulsed by. Good that our corruption index is quite low, because corruption hurts everyone. We obviously do have lots of corruption in this country, so even that is relative.
There are obviously worse places to live. But I'm not sure that I take pride in something that essentially was a lottery/accident.
It's so hard to generalise anything, because when the scope is so broad as "this country", there are hardly any generalisations that hold true. I don't value nationalism. I do value many aspects of our society and hold these to be better than traits evident in other societies. To put it mildy, I wouldn't go live in Saudi Arabia.
Soldato
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I dont know about proud, grateful maybe?
The thing about britain is we love to revel in our past glories with rose tinted spectacles, talk about the empire as if it wasnt just the systematic and bloody subjugation of a bunch of comparitively underdeveloped nations (when i say underdeveloped i'm meaning purely in the technological sense before anyone reads more into that)
The simple fact is most of the western nations have it pretty good and are worth being grateful for if your lucky enough to be born there although i feel pride tends to skim over the bit where we're aware our fortune is founded upon the misfortune of others.
The thing about britain is we love to revel in our past glories with rose tinted spectacles, talk about the empire as if it wasnt just the systematic and bloody subjugation of a bunch of comparitively underdeveloped nations (when i say underdeveloped i'm meaning purely in the technological sense before anyone reads more into that)
The simple fact is most of the western nations have it pretty good and are worth being grateful for if your lucky enough to be born there although i feel pride tends to skim over the bit where we're aware our fortune is founded upon the misfortune of others.
We have civilization, law and order etc to those countries
No-one is talking about socialism. You were talking about wealth distribution equality.
And work undertaken by anyone in the UK has no bearing on wealth distribution when compared to tax regulations and capital funds. You've more chance of winning the lottery twice than working yourself up to being actually wealthy.
No, you and Caracus are both conflating problems and assuming that you would not be personally poor in scenario B.
If you're poor in either scenario, you're poor.
If you're poor, you are better off in scenario A where wealth is distributed more evenly. It's dumb to think otherwise.
Associate
Are food is pretty ****. As is are healthcare and rail network. So no.
Associate
Why are you arguing on this thread then ?
This statement was a bit uselessDid you ever live somewhere else to have somewhere to compare it to?
Like germany, france or US?
no it isn't - the scenario A was that everyone is poor, wealth isn't necessarily fixed - it can be created and destroyed - we've seen communism already during the Cold War - everyone was poor, the standard of living in West Germany was significantly better than that of East Germany.. but yes there were poor people living in West Germany too
I'm not sure why you're saying 'It's dumb to think otherwise' when reality has shown that 'otherwise' is indeed the case
as for assuming I'd not personally be poor in scenario B, we're kind of living in scenario B and I'm not personally poor... it seems like a reasonable enough assumption to me
You're adding other things into the mix each time. Stick to the scenarios. Saying that scenario A is like East Germany is completely missing the point.
In scenario A, everyone is poor.
In scenario B, some people are less poor, but that makes everyone else more poor relative to them.
So therefore if you are poor, scenario A is a better place to be.
Wealth is relative not absolute. It's not hard concept to understand.
And I'm glad you don't consider yourself poor, however, I'd bet that you are, in comparison to the wealthy in the UK. However, you relate to those around you and consider yourself well off.
Don
Why are you arguing on this thread then ?
Did you ever live somewhere else to have somewhere to compare it to?
Like germany, france or US?
No but I’ve travelled a fair deal. Across many states (South and North East) in the US, Canada, all of Western Europe and much of Eastern Europe, Turkey and so on.
I think we live in one of the fairest nations on the planet, and I am grateful for it and the opportunities that have been given to me.
Why is scenario A necessarily a better place to be? Especially if we're talking about relative poverty/wealth?
this was the scenario
the poorest in scenario B as as poor as scenario A, others are wealthier... (in reality those in scenario A would tend to be even poorer - thus East Germany etc..)
thus the poster's statement that only a fool would say country A is better... sure they've got less inequality but they're all just equally poor - you're falling into this trap:
I most certainly am not falling into that trap. This is abstract.
What you and the poster are saying is that scenario B is better because some people are more wealthy. As an absolute aggregate, when you compare A with B, that is undeniably true. But that only benefits those who are wealthy. The poor in scenario A are just as poor and the poor in scenario b are just as poor.
What I'm saying is that wealth is relative, so the reality of scenario B is that the poor in that scenario are worse off than those in scenario A who have no-one to be relatively less wealthy than.
Therefore if you are poor, scenario A is preferable.
I disagree, our traditional food is excellent, as is the NHS, I agree on the rail network.