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**ATI RADEON 7800 SERIES NOW AVAILABLE!!**
- Thread starter Gibbo
- Start date
With the current price-to-performance ratio, surely it's the case that AMD's hands were tied on what they need to charge. It will be agony for them watching customers holding off to see how Nvidia's cards perform/prices, loosing AMD their first-to-market advantage at a time when they could really use a break.
Instead of the 7850, people can buy a much better performing 560 TI 448 OC card for £200 from Overclockers UK, today, with the 570 prices looking fairly good, too. The 7870, if overclocked, hits a lot of sweet spots, for me, as I am a big fan of quiet but the price means it's not even on my shortlist. I concede that it is important for competitive pricing that Nvidia's competitor survive, but during a recession I don't have a large chunk of additional change to give to charity.
Instead of the 7850, people can buy a much better performing 560 TI 448 OC card for £200 from Overclockers UK, today, with the 570 prices looking fairly good, too. The 7870, if overclocked, hits a lot of sweet spots, for me, as I am a big fan of quiet but the price means it's not even on my shortlist. I concede that it is important for competitive pricing that Nvidia's competitor survive, but during a recession I don't have a large chunk of additional change to give to charity.
Soldato
+1 and the 7970 is hugely more expensive.
and therefor by the above logic the 7870 should be compared with the 6870 which can currently be had for £130 but cost ???? at launch, around £200, maybe £180. Anand shows a very healthy lead for the 7870 over the 6870 but I dont think justifies the price hike. Traditionally we got these performance improvements for free when going from one gen to another, so why is this year different.
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Soldato
I wouldn't say their hands are tied Detosx, and I do think the cards are very expensive. For example on launch they tried charging around £220 for a 5830 and because of that it got some bad press. Within a month XFX were knocking out a cheap one for around £190 with AVP, card was OK at that price.
5830 was about their only stumbling block in the 5000 series I think. Basically all of the others had a place, price and purpose and the 5830 didn't quite shout loudly enough to justify its place in the market.
Basically AMD have priced their cards from the top down. The 7970 is what it is because of the 3gb 580. So when you then release cards under it you need to price them in a certain fashion or risk out pricing your other products.
What I mean is, it's highly likely that a pair of 7850s will beat a 7970 if you like a bit of Crossfire. Price the 7850 too cheaply and no one will buy the 7970, and same goes for the 7870.
AMD have always been a company to make a mistake like that. For example, two 4770s were faster than a 4870 and cheaper to boot. Two 5770s (remember I'm talking about paper results here) were faster than a 5870 and far cheaper, and so on.
Yes but you need to remember they got their prices from the existing market place. Where Nvidia were charging £430 for a 3gb 580.
The 5870? they were pricing it against the 285. Which at the time cost around £300. This time though Nvidia sort of got to go first, and as usual they wanted far more for their high end cards. So AMD have simply followed suit.
5830 was about their only stumbling block in the 5000 series I think. Basically all of the others had a place, price and purpose and the 5830 didn't quite shout loudly enough to justify its place in the market.
Basically AMD have priced their cards from the top down. The 7970 is what it is because of the 3gb 580. So when you then release cards under it you need to price them in a certain fashion or risk out pricing your other products.
What I mean is, it's highly likely that a pair of 7850s will beat a 7970 if you like a bit of Crossfire. Price the 7850 too cheaply and no one will buy the 7970, and same goes for the 7870.
AMD have always been a company to make a mistake like that. For example, two 4770s were faster than a 4870 and cheaper to boot. Two 5770s (remember I'm talking about paper results here) were faster than a 5870 and far cheaper, and so on.
+1 and the 7970 is hugely more expensive.
Yes but you need to remember they got their prices from the existing market place. Where Nvidia were charging £430 for a 3gb 580.
The 5870? they were pricing it against the 285. Which at the time cost around £300. This time though Nvidia sort of got to go first, and as usual they wanted far more for their high end cards. So AMD have simply followed suit.
So - from my previous thread; http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18384738 I was told to wait for the announcement of the new cards.
What would the best course of action be?
What would the best course of action be?
Was so hoping the 7850 was the card I had been waiting for, a performance boost over my 5850 for a reasonable price, seems I was wrong...
Looks like a nice little card but the price is all wrong, was reading the review on Anandtech and saw the image below AMD have pumped out...
No AMD, it is not, not until you take about £50 off the price.
Looks like a nice little card but the price is all wrong, was reading the review on Anandtech and saw the image below AMD have pumped out...
No AMD, it is not, not until you take about £50 off the price.
Soldato
Thing is a 7950 costs around what a 5870 did back then. So 5870 owners should be following the logical path.
The 7950 isn't bad value at all IMO.
The 7950 isn't bad value at all IMO.
I am tempted to wait for 20nm, or avoid PC gaming altogether. The whole 28nm range is just too expensive and offers nothing better than cards launched 2 years ago for price vs performance value.
Associate
- Joined
- 16 Sep 2011
- Posts
- 431
Flat out completely wrong. I can see AMD's renaming of the model line has worked a treat on you.
Price and performance, not model number, dictate what people buy and how good the card actually is. If they named the 7970 a 7670 and kept the price the same with no intention of releasing any 7800s or 7900s, would you say that the 7970 was an awesome mid-range card? Just as the 6800s were not the replacement for the 5800s, the same goes for the 7800s and the 6900s. You need to stop blindly taking on board information.
Associate
- Joined
- 16 Sep 2011
- Posts
- 431
No, stop getting this wrong please. The x9xx series was reintroduced so AMD could charge more. The 7950 is not the logical path upgrade you describe in any shape or form. It is not the high end chip, nor is it a similar price when the 5870s were launched, it's at least £40-50 more for only 32% more performance. For the two years of progression it's supposed to represent it is a complete failure.
While I have just purchased 2 7950's, I do think the new range is overpriced for performance, but mostly because they seem to be under clocked.
Having just had 6950 Toxic Xfire and went to single 7950 briefly, the performance when overclocked is really impressive, and I don't feel ripped off.
The problem with relying on OCing for your performance is it's not guaranteed.
If my 2nd 7950 does not clock as high as high as the first on stock volts (1050), then I will be disappointed with it. If it clocks the same then I will be happy with the price.
Though I did get my 7950's at a really good price compared to most.
If the 7870 were just over £200 and 7850 a bit further under £200, I think they would be brilliant cards.
Having just had 6950 Toxic Xfire and went to single 7950 briefly, the performance when overclocked is really impressive, and I don't feel ripped off.
The problem with relying on OCing for your performance is it's not guaranteed.
If my 2nd 7950 does not clock as high as high as the first on stock volts (1050), then I will be disappointed with it. If it clocks the same then I will be happy with the price.
Though I did get my 7950's at a really good price compared to most.
If the 7870 were just over £200 and 7850 a bit further under £200, I think they would be brilliant cards.
Caporegime
Disgusting really the performance for the price.
i agree with you,but look how cool the newer card is at idle/load and on metro2033 it uses full 60w less
if i can sell my old card it wont cost that much for a brand new improved one,it only needs a single 6pin plug where my 5870 needs two,so it will be less strain on my psu ect,its just a case of waiting a while and see if prices drop or if any deals pop up
Soldato
Not sure if I've just missed the sarcasm.
But you'd pay a reasonable sum to save a tiny bit of power?
What PSU do you have that is straining under the 5870?
Edit: I just don't understand the price/performance thing that's going on in the mid-range now.
If you are a person who doesn't like to spend more than £200 on GPUs, then you're out of options really.
You can't buy any more performance now than you could 1 and a half years ago...
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Soldato
But they didn't call the 7970 a 7670, did they?
Naming and numbers aside the 7970 is the fastest Radeon released in the 28nm range so far. Just as the number aside the 5870 was the fastest 45nm card released in that range.
So nothing has "worked a treat" because I am capable of knowing what card is the fastest, regardless of any numbers.
As it stands I see it like this. I will ignore anything less than the 7770.
7770-7850-7870-7950-7970
And, I saw the 5000 series like this, ignoring the lower end cards below the 5770.
5770-5830-5850-5870
So basically they have added an extra card in this time. Thus, as I said, I see the 7870 as the logical 5830, simply as it fits into that area of the range of cards. Then I said it was too expensive, which it is.
I also didn't say the 6850 and 6870 were the replacements for the 5850 and 5870 so I'm not sure where you came up with that. What I said was ignoring the numbers the 7870 takes the position in the range that the 5830 shared. Why you were comparing the 7870 (which is third down in the line) to the 6970 (which was top of the line) was what I was confused over. Well, not confused, it was just a bad analogy.
Associate
- Joined
- 16 Sep 2011
- Posts
- 431
No, you're making up **** to make it fit your incorrect model.
I'll say one more time, even though you tried to back flip the argument (seriously, why are you mentioning the 5830? it's no relevant at all):
Price and performance are all that matters. Model numbers are irrelevant. The 7970 is £420, how does it replace the 6970 which is £280? No, the 7870 does that. End of story.
You pick one card, then say "how does that affect others" but it has to because they are a model range. Either you're trolling or can't see the wood for the trees.
Soldato
Oh god not another one who refuses to see any other logic than his own and then starts the insults.
Never mind. It seems you are incapable of understanding what I said to you so fair play.