Australian Grand Prix 2011, Albert Park Circuit - Race 1/19

Mr Jack said:
And maybe one day the FIA will actually do something about Red Bull's flexing wings.
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I don;t think they can. It has to flex for more than 5mm. I assuming this is each piece. so if they are getting say 2mm flex out of 3 different structures it is still legal and it passes the scrutineering. Which means it's extremely hard to prove. I think it's up to the others to work out how they are doing it and copy.

I don't know why, I'm a lot less annoyed by RBR and vettle this year. In fact I'm really not bothered at all, unlike last year. Probably just the heat of the battle.
 
AmTechFox said:
That overtake by Button was interesting to see. Is its *kers* use limited? (kinda a novice...)

Vettel ran an almost perfect race, just glad Hamilton stayed up there too, I'll take it having seen the great start Vettel had.

Bring on the next race!
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Yes the kers is limited, you're only allowed around 7 seconds of it per lap i think.
 
A few questions:

1) Why hasnt Vettel been penalised for track limitations when he overtook Button? There was another similar overtake from someone else too. Seems an opportunity for McL to gift Hamilton the win so I cant see why they havent objected yet...
2) What were the findings regards Hamiltons barge board? Its been many years since anyones been disqualified for a thin barge board and I actually dont think hell get penalised...
3) Its obvious DRS doesnt work as expected, has there been any reaction from the FIA regards 'improving' it? I still dont get why its limited to one straight when Aus has a couple of long straights with slow corners that are overtaking spots...

I cant see anyone touching Vettel in a RB and if Webber keeps underperforming relatively then this is the beginning of another era of 1 car dominance. I discount both McL and Ferrari as they both have shown time and again they cant strategise their way out of a paper bag on a race day...

ps3ud0 :cool:
 
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ps3ud0 said:
A few questions:

1) Why hasnt Vettel been penalised for track limitations when he overtook Button? There was another similar overtake from someone else too. Seems an opportunity for McL to gift Hamilton the win so I cant see why they havent objected yet...
2) What were the findings regards Hamiltons barge board? Its been many years since anyones been disqualified for a thin barge board and I actually dont think hell get penalised...
3) Its obvious DRS doesnt work as expected, has there been any reaction from the FIA regards 'improving' it? I still dont get why its limited to one straight when Aus has a couple of long straights with slow corners that are overtaking spots...

I cant see anyone touching Vettel in a RB and if Webber keeps underperforming relatively then this is the beginning of another era of 1 car dominance. I discount both McL and Ferrari as they both have shown time and again they cant strategise their way out of a paper bag on a race day...

ps3ud0 :cool:
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As for point one, havn't seen the replay but im pretty sure 2 of his wheels were still within the yellow/white lines.
 
AcidHell2 said:
fia is useless.
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The problem is that when it suits them the FIA becoming the governing body rather than actively seeking out adherence to rules that they themselves set. Quite happy to turn a blind eye until a petition is raised...

F1 has so many comparisons to football when it comes to refereeing...
Aman said:
As for point one, havn't seen the replay but im pretty sure 2 of his wheels were still within the yellow/white lines.
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Have to admit that corner with the slightly raised kerb confuses me as I presume its not a proper kerb to stop carrs being launched but its no deterrent when it comes to defining the track itself - its just a nicely coloured bump :p

ps3ud0 :cool:
 
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Aman said:
As for point one, havn't seen the replay but im pretty sure 2 of his wheels were still within the yellow/white lines.
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nope, all 4 clearly out as was another car.

One argument for vettle but not the other is he was past or more like 3/4 past before he went outside the line. But then if he didn;t go outside the line he wouldn't of been able to carry the speed.

ps3ud0 said:
Quite happy to turn a blind eye until a petition is raised...
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So true
 
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AcidHell2 said:
I don;t think they can. It has to flex for more than 5mm. I assuming this is each piece. so if they are getting say 2mm flex out of 3 different structures it is still legal and it passes the scrutineering. Which means it's extremely hard to prove. I think it's up to the others to work out how they are doing it and copy.
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Section 3.15 says:

3.15 Aerodynamic influence :
With the exception of the driver adjustable bodywork described in Article 3.18 (in addition to minimal parts
solely associated with its actuation) and the ducts described in Article 11.4, any specific part of the car
influencing its aerodynamic performance :
- must comply with the rules relating to bodywork.
- must be rigidly secured to the entirely sprung part of the car (rigidly secured means not having any degree of freedom).
- must remain immobile in relation to the sprung part of the car.
Any device or construction that is designed to bridge the gap between the sprung part of the car and the ground is prohibited under all circumstances.
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I think Red Bull's wing unambiguously breaks that, and did so consistently last season as well. Where it gets more complicated is section 3.17 which describes all the tests which it needs to pass. Newey's cleverly developed a system which passes those tests, but violates 3.15. The FIA won't take photographic evidence, so it's relying on its tests. The only hope is that they use 3.17.8* to introduce a test to specifically target Red Bull's solution.



* 3.17.8 says "In order to ensure that the requirements of Article 3.15 are respected, the FIA reserves the right to introduce further load/deflection tests on any part of the bodywork which appears to be (or is suspected of), moving whilst the car is in motion."
 
That's all well and good but you can;t stop flex, which is why there is a maximum permitted flex and a test.
Problem is cars are tested as individual parts. Weights are applied separately and don't replicate aero effects.

Like here, 5mm allowed
98318172.jpg


* 3.17.8 says "In order to ensure that the requirements of Article 3.15 are respected, the FIA reserves the right to introduce further load/deflection tests on any part of the bodywork which appears to be (or is suspected of), moving whilst the car is in motion."
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which they have done and it's still past, photos can't really be used as evidence. only way they can simulate aero down force is to carry a wind tunnel with them and that's not going to happen.
 
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Well I'm glad I didn't lose any beauty sleep for that. I've never been much a fan of Albert Park and nothing happened this time to change that.

The only real highlights for me were Petrov's podium (good lad), Ruben's "Ramming Speed" Barrichello, Schuey's oh so worthwhile comeback continuing apace and Sauber's performance, at least until they got disqualified. :( But at least the McLaren's might give the Bull's a challenge this season.

However, the commentary was good, but the rest was just a by the numbers GP.
 
Flibster said:
Buemi is also under investigation for leaving the confines of the circuit during an overtake.

FIA were asked to investigate by Force India
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Ahh Buemi - thought it was a STR, but it begs the question, why hasnt McL asked the FIA too?

McL on a race weekend have really started to annoy me in recent years, they just always seem to be naive, underprepared or not flexible/quick/strong enough to make decisions that could make a good weekend into a great one. How often have we seen them make schoolboy errors which I honestly think has lost them at least one championship in the last few years...

Got to ask for sake of discussion, noting my viewpoint above, why do people think McL have a real chance to mess with RB other than maybe having a quick car - hell I think Webbers more likely to spoil Vettels defence than McL as a team will...

EDIT: I do concede that RB havent had to make such make or break decisions in a race weekend due to the virtue of having the fastest car by quite a margin...

ps3ud0 :cool:
 
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AcidHell2 said:
That's all well and good but you can;t stop flex, which is why there is a maximum permitted flex and a test.
Problem is cars are tested as individual parts. Weights are applied separately and don't replicate aero effects.

Like here, 5mm allowed
98318172.jpg



which they have done and it's still past, photos can't really be used as evidence. only way they can simulate aero down force is to carry a wind tunnel with them and that's not going to happen.
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Surely Hamiltons car was not legal then. His floor moved inches never mind millimetres.
 
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