Man of Honour
Oh come on, that is the same thing and you know it. If he went for a gap that didn't exist, knowing Hamilton would be there, then he turned into Hamilton.
Belgian Grand Prix 2014, Spa-Francorchamps - Race 12/19
- Thread starter Shimmy
- Start date
Oh come on, that is the same thing and you know it. If he went for a gap that didn't exist, knowing Hamilton would be there, then he turned into Hamilton.
Soldato
aaaaand.....
Here we go again !
Here we go again !
Soldato
http://www1.skysports.com/f1/report...ed-by-critical-moments-in-hungary-and-bahrain
Most well written article on the subject I've read, from Mark Hughes....
In short it (and all Hamilton fans should read this) it reads;
Lap 52 of the Bahrain Grand Prix in April: Nico Rosberg was trying to pass Lewis Hamilton around the outside of Turn Four. What happened in the following moment was at the root of their clash in Spa last weekend.
Context is everything and what Rosberg did on lap two at Spa last weekend was not judged as such. He declined to surrender a place that, conventionally, he had already failed to make work – once into the corner his front wheels were never any further forward than level with the front of Hamilton’s sidepod. But he’s not obliged by any regulation to surrender at this point. He’s perfectly entitled to attempt to bully the guy ahead out of the way by leaving the nose of his car there. To suggest it was a deliberate attempt at puncturing Hamilton’s tyre is ludicrous - as Sky F1’s Martin Brundle later pointed out: “The chances of puncturing the other guy’s tyre if you hit him from behind: about 30%. The chances of damaging your own front wing: 100%,” – but to effectively place the decision of contact in Hamilton’s hands is not necessarily dangerous; it’s just racing. Hard and resolute, ruthless even. But not necessarily dangerous and therefore not necessarily worthy of a penalty.
Most well written article on the subject I've read, from Mark Hughes....
In short it (and all Hamilton fans should read this) it reads;
Lap 52 of the Bahrain Grand Prix in April: Nico Rosberg was trying to pass Lewis Hamilton around the outside of Turn Four. What happened in the following moment was at the root of their clash in Spa last weekend.
Context is everything and what Rosberg did on lap two at Spa last weekend was not judged as such. He declined to surrender a place that, conventionally, he had already failed to make work – once into the corner his front wheels were never any further forward than level with the front of Hamilton’s sidepod. But he’s not obliged by any regulation to surrender at this point. He’s perfectly entitled to attempt to bully the guy ahead out of the way by leaving the nose of his car there. To suggest it was a deliberate attempt at puncturing Hamilton’s tyre is ludicrous - as Sky F1’s Martin Brundle later pointed out: “The chances of puncturing the other guy’s tyre if you hit him from behind: about 30%. The chances of damaging your own front wing: 100%,” – but to effectively place the decision of contact in Hamilton’s hands is not necessarily dangerous; it’s just racing. Hard and resolute, ruthless even. But not necessarily dangerous and therefore not necessarily worthy of a penalty.
Soldato
Absolutely correct, plus the fact that Hamiton would have seen where Rosberg was and also could have avoided the coming together....
Soldato
Is Whitmarsh free to join another team, or is he on "gardening leave" until the end of the season?
As he was booted out and before the season I would guess he's free to move. Quite why anyone would want Mr Conservative outside of the lowest of team though?
Soldato
Soldato
Soldato
I agree in principle, and don't see why Rosberg should have backed out in general (a move around the outside is one to be respected, and no respect is gained from pushing someone on the outside off (Magnussen)), but realistically when the gap to Hamilton was stretching and Rosberg was only level with the rear wheels of Rosberg's fronts then clearly discretion would have been the better part of valour and he should have conceded. Over the previous lap he was much stronger without any obvious mistakes from Hamilton, so had that continued for another lap he would have had other opportunities, and aided by DRS too.
I can fully understand why Rosberg was angry after Bahrain as a couple of Hamilton's moves were inches from taking them both out in a similar way, and Rosberg had to dive off track a few times to avoid that, but to have it lingering on this long shows a lack of strength. If he's just manufactured that as a defense mechanism after the incident at Spa, or it's been brought up in team meetings since then that's OK, but if he's had that in his head ever since, it's a key weakness.
I don't for a minute think Rosberg meant to hit Hamilton. He wanted to make him think twice but misjudged the situation and clipped him, which has probably had the opposite effect (Hamilton knows Rosberg won't dare do it again, as either Mercedes will remove him from his seat, or the FIA will - Rosberg has no scope for mistakes in battles with Hamilton from now on). Rosberg didn't turn in on him (he was on the dirty line, the car was on the edge and he was correcting the car - you'll see it all the time in head-to-head combat, but it looks poor on a slow-mo in this ultra-scrutinised era).
There wasn't anything malicious about it, but was undoubtedly very clumsy. His manner in the aftermath sealed it though. Apologise unreservedly, accept full responsibility and hope others move on with you. Dig your heals in and you're making a rod for your own back irrespective of what others thought initially. I'm not sure he deserved to be castigated this much, but overnight he's become a global villain, and it's probably a good thing these aren't back-to-back races.... but if they're wheel-to-wheel again in Monza their reactions will be fascinating.
Last edited:
Moaning about what? I have barely participated in the F1 threads this year. You do seem to get your knickers in a twist any time anyone mentions Hamilton in anything but a glowing light.
I guess I don't understand that, I have never been in love with another man before.
It will be Defcon 5 and you know it, the conspiracy idiots will say they kept him out on purpose at Spa.
Last edited:
Soldato
Brace yourself for being added to an ignore list. That's the usual response when reason comes into disagreements with him.
Soldato
Oh do come on , Brundle is bonkers or misquoted,
Its about the team stupid. Merc lost a 1, 2. Because of the petulance of a highly privileged multi millionaire.
Also what about the fans and the global TV audience , most of whom have far less cash than Mr Rosberg and have paid to watch a race.
His comments after the race about the fans and press were bordering desperation, insulting your fan base is no way to behave.
Its about the team stupid. Merc lost a 1, 2. Because of the petulance of a highly privileged multi millionaire.
Also what about the fans and the global TV audience , most of whom have far less cash than Mr Rosberg and have paid to watch a race.
His comments after the race about the fans and press were bordering desperation, insulting your fan base is no way to behave.
Soldato
Do you want to watch a DRS pass?
I don't, I want to watch a battle. Drivers earning their corn, and sometimes in battles people get hurt.
I won't pretend I wasn't disappointed not to see a battle unfold, but I don't pay to see that, I pay to see an F1 race between whoever is racing whoever. If two drivers are removed from that then there are still 20 other drivers. Unless you're a glory-hunter, motorsport (and indeed sport in general) is never about those in the top guys alone - there are fights throughout the field (Chilton's and Erikson's battles over the last few laps being a good example). It might not be the ratings-grabber or what Bernie wants, but genuine racing fans just want a good race, and we got an excellent one even after lap 2.
I doubt any driver is even slightly interested in the constructors title either. No-one starts as a kid in karting hoping they can bring McLaren the constructors championship, and while if the drivers championship is all-but-decided that tact might suddenly change, they're in it for themselves first. The manufacturers and some sponsors will favour the constructors championship, but any driver worth their salt wants the drivers title first and foremost.
Soldato
I was at the race and this was sad to see.
In my opinion Rosberg was happy to damage either or both cars to use the excuse that he was the faster car and team orders should apply. He was bitter from the last race and the point he wanted to prove was that he can get along side Lewis and between the pair of them they can cause damage.
Nico is a slower drive imo, Lewis is very quick if he tyres can hang on. However they dont always do that and Nico is driving very well and not making mistakes.
Nico wanted a crash as now team orders will come out. They favor Nico....
I only hope Lewis sorts out quali and can mentally stay positive as hes dwelling already.
In my opinion Rosberg was happy to damage either or both cars to use the excuse that he was the faster car and team orders should apply. He was bitter from the last race and the point he wanted to prove was that he can get along side Lewis and between the pair of them they can cause damage.
Nico is a slower drive imo, Lewis is very quick if he tyres can hang on. However they dont always do that and Nico is driving very well and not making mistakes.
Nico wanted a crash as now team orders will come out. They favor Nico....
I only hope Lewis sorts out quali and can mentally stay positive as hes dwelling already.
Soldato
Yes he is, he knows it, Lewis knows, hell, everyone knows it (except smr), which is why he is having to resort to dirty tactics.
Whatever happened to 'sportmanship', afterall, this is a sport, is it not?
Soldato
Tell Prost, Senna and Schumacher about sportsmanship.
In the past Hamilton has done exactly the same as what Rosberg did. Does that justify it or does that mean Hamilton has merely resorted to dirty tactics too?
In the past Hamilton has done exactly the same as what Rosberg did. Does that justify it or does that mean Hamilton has merely resorted to dirty tactics too?
I don't think it was a dirty tactic, he just felt the need to assert himself as Lewis is mega aggressive but for the most part fair wheel to wheel and he made himself look an utter fool. Instead of just holding his hands up and admitting it as Lewis did in singapore in 2011 for a very similar incident he kept on digging.
I think this might affect him, the negative press and boo's etc. It might end up playing into Lewis hands.
As for Sportsmanship I can't think of too many in F1 that reach the top and are sportsmen. I think there is just this image with F1 that nice guys finish last, sadly.