bet365 boss pays herself £265 MILLION

Well if i dangled a gold bar in front of a hobo, what do you think will happen?

Of course they're responsible for their actions, but for some people, they're just too susceptible to being ******* impossibly stupid and need to be slapped by someone, if their family/friends (if they have any) can't achieve that, then someone should. Otherwise there's risk of criminal enterprise/actions if the desperation is there, which hurts everyone else. Better to deal with the causes than the incident.
 
dowie said:
What do you actually want to see happen @StriderX - are you taking the full on nanny state approach of wanting to outlaw bookies/gambling?
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I want at least acknowledgement (a big ol' campaign to demonise it like with Smoking) and help for these idiots, beyond that it's irrelevant. I also want to see the online environment when it comes to children and MTX stores heavily regulated.
 
ianh said:
Remember folks, in todays modern age NO-ONE is responsible for their own actions!!! I mean you're not a weak person without the will-power to be an adult or to seek help, it's all some nameless/faceless corporations fault for tricking you!!!!

The attitude towards success from some in this place is disgusting.
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This is such an incredibly weak argument, almost childlike in it's logic. It literally relinquishes all responsibility from the organisation and attributes complete blame to the victim for not being "adult" enough to know better.

...Like elderly people tricked into buying products they don't need; they're adults they should know better!

...Like people who worked with asbestos; they're adults they knew the risks!

... Like people who were conned into buying PPI; they're adults they can read the small print!

This is why we need strong, independent government and expert organisations to exert pressure on these predatory companies. Because those who aren't affected are generally apathetic.
 
String said:
This is such an incredibly weak argument, almost childlike in it's logic. It literally relinquishes all responsibility from the organisation and attributes complete blame to the victim for not being "adult" enough to know better.
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I blame my Dad 100%, absolutely nobody's fault but his and put us into financial chaos when I was a kid.
Even now at 83 he sits there with a laptop, tablet and teletext on the TV and it's virtually impossible to talk to him until he's rang his bets in which are around £20 a day (that I know of).
 
String said:
This is such an incredibly weak argument, almost childlike in it's logic. It literally relinquishes all responsibility from the organisation and attributes complete blame to the victim for not being "adult" enough to know better.
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There is no victim unless force was involved. They are only a victim of there own failure.

The only victims under a government are taxpayers who are paying for the "experts".

Being a "victim" doesn't make anyone an expert either.
 
chrcoluk said:
[speculation about UK and USA fruit machines]
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Your premises are incorrect and thus your conclusion is incorrect even though it follows logically from your premises.

Fruit machines are all set to pay on average a defined percentage of the money staked on them. That percentage can vary, but in the UK it is a requirement that the percentage is displayed on the game and there are various minimum percentages for various licensing classifications of fruit machine game.

I can't speak with certainty about fruit machines in the USA, but I can say these things with certainty about fruit machines in the UK:

Both the methods you refer to are used in the UK and a combination of both is also used. Some machines are utterly random on every spin and every gamble. Some machines are random on every spin but vary the odds on gambles. Some machines are only partially random and will vary the chances of winning depending on previous wins on both spins and gambles. Some machines will do that on spins but are wholly random on gambles. You can even have all of those behaviours on the same machine because many machines have different games on them and the method can vary from game to game. What's also true in the UK is that it's legally required to state on the game whether or not it's completely random.

Both of the payout structures you refer to are also used in the UK. Some games are programmed to tend to pay larger numbers of smaller wins. Some games are programmed to tend to pay smaller numbers of bigger wins. A few even allow the player to choose between the two payout structures to varying degrees.

What I can also say is that neither method is better or worse. Whichever method is used, the total payout will be less than the total staked. That's how gambling works.
 
String said:
@chrcoluk it's all rigged and designed to get people addicted, that's the point. If you strip it back to basics, a punter could get really good at his chosen field and keep winning e.g. he may get to really know his football.

2 things will ensure he is doomed to failure:

1. The odds he is given by the Bookmaker.
2. If he keeps winning, he will be barred from placing any more bets.

But hey, as long as the gaming companies keep making massive profits then anyone who points the finger is just jealous. Apparently.
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Yeah I have heard about people getting banned from bookies after they have a good run. Thats unacceptable.

Another issue I have is that you dont need to verify your ID/age to start betting, but if you win then its that moment they want the ID check, supposedly they have to by law, but the intention behind the law would be to prevent under age betting not to prevent under age wins after gambling.
 
Angilion said:
Your premises are incorrect and thus your conclusion is incorrect even though it follows logically from your premises.

Fruit machines are all set to pay on average a defined percentage of the money staked on them. That percentage can vary, but in the UK it is a requirement that the percentage is displayed on the game and there are various minimum percentages for various licensing classifications of fruit machine game.

I can't speak with certainty about fruit machines in the USA, but I can say these things with certainty about fruit machines in the UK:

Both the methods you refer to are used in the UK and a combination of both is also used. Some machines are utterly random on every spin and every gamble. Some machines are random on every spin but vary the odds on gambles. Some machines are only partially random and will vary the chances of winning depending on previous wins on both spins and gambles. Some machines will do that on spins but are wholly random on gambles. You can even have all of those behaviours on the same machine because many machines have different games on them and the method can vary from game to game. What's also true in the UK is that it's legally required to state on the game whether or not it's completely random.

Both of the payout structures you refer to are also used in the UK. Some games are programmed to tend to pay larger numbers of smaller wins. Some games are programmed to tend to pay smaller numbers of bigger wins. A few even allow the player to choose between the two payout structures to varying degrees.

What I can also say is that neither method is better or worse. Whichever method is used, the total payout will be less than the total staked. That's how gambling works.
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My info comes from a manufacturer, not to mention if you research it you get the same conclusion.

Someone even made an emulator and ran the firmware taken from a fruit machine on it, he was able to save state, repeat the same spins, and same high/low gamble, but on the losing gamble the loss was forced, so after loading the save state and seeing the exact same numbers appear on the high/low, he got to the losing point, and betted the other way and it rolls a different losing number, he could repeat this 100s of times, same exact events, but on the feature it decided to not allow the player past a certain point, this is called a pseudo gamble and it is not speculation on UK machines.
 
chrcoluk said:
Yeah I have heard about people getting banned from bookies after they have a good run. Thats unacceptable.
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It's shocking to think that they'll refuse your custom if you manage to actually regularly win against them, which is the only reason a punter gives them money in the first place.

What is truly disgusting, is their behaviour towards a punter who regularly loses against them. I shudder to think how much money this clearly ill individual lost if a million pound payment to his victims could be justified by Ladbrokes. These are not simply the actions of a company capitalising on a market demand. They make people ill and they keep them there, sucking every last penny regardless of where it comes from.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2018/dec/17/ladbrokes-wooed-problem-gambler-then-paid-victims-1m
 
OP, you simply need to be better. What's stopping you designing, creating and running a betting website and earning similar money? Nothing.

Now, the only concession for discussion is, is it morally right to pray on the vulnerable and those with gambling addictions and ever mounting debts, but this is GD, and you weren't clever enough to raise the question in the OP.
 
String said:
This is such an incredibly weak argument, almost childlike in it's logic.
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I'm an adult, I KNOW that I gambling isn't for me so I don't do it but I wouldn't want to see something perfectly legal banned because of the "won't someone think of the children" attitude shown by a very vocal few. Being an adult means making a decision whether or not to do something risky and removing that ability to choose, to make an adult decision, from the 47 million over 18 year olds because less than 1% can't act like an adult isn't something I want to see happen.
 
ianh said:
I'm an adult, I KNOW that I gambling isn't for me so I don't do it but I wouldn't want to see something perfectly legal banned because of the "won't someone think of the children" attitude shown by a very vocal few. Being an adult means making a decision whether or not to do something risky and removing that ability to choose, to make an adult decision, from the 47 million over 18 year olds because less than 1% can't act like an adult isn't something I want to see happen.
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Then you'd agree that the shopfronts need to be covered up to hide it, and advertising gambling banned then like with smoking?

It's not banning it after all.
 
StriderX said:
Then you'd agree that the shopfronts need to be covered up to hide it, and advertising gambling banned then like with smoking?

It's not banning it after all.
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Would I? Have you actually tried to find out my opinion on smoking advertising before telling me I must agree with it?

Maybe I wasn't clear enough - I'm a fan of choice, and anything which removes choice from something which is legal is, in my opinion, not what I agree with. So in your "you must agree" example, while I'm not a smoker myself I disagree with all the efforts to hide it, efforts which have done nothing to actually stop smoking or stop kids smoking at all but cost extra money whilst making a few "won't someone think of the children" folks feel better about "doing something". In fact Vaping has done more to stop "smoking" than every single missing TV/print advert, hidden carton in a shop or blanked packaging ever has which is proof enough that trying to "hide" something which is absolutely perfectly legal is nothing but a waste of time, money and effort.

However, thats just my opinion and those change nothing.
 
ianh said:
I'm an adult, I KNOW that I gambling isn't for me so I don't do it but I wouldn't want to see something perfectly legal banned because of the "won't someone think of the children" attitude shown by a very vocal few. Being an adult means making a decision whether or not to do something risky and removing that ability to choose, to make an adult decision, from the 47 million over 18 year olds because less than 1% can't act like an adult isn't something I want to see happen.
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Did you read the article I linked to in my previous post - you think the industry just stands back and waits for window shoppers to float in? And whilst I would love to see the industry banned, it's clear that no one is realistically expecting that.

As for "I wouldn't want to see something perfectly legal banned because of the "won't someone think of the children" attitude shown by a very vocal few." - they've actually started banning themselves in an unprecedented admission of underhand tactics.
 
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String said:
This is such an incredibly weak argument, almost childlike in it's logic. It literally relinquishes all responsibility from the organisation and attributes complete blame to the victim for not being "adult" enough to know better.

...Like elderly people tricked into buying products they don't need; they're adults they should know better!

...Like people who worked with asbestos; they're adults they knew the risks!

... Like people who were conned into buying PPI; they're adults they can read the small print!

This is why we need strong, independent government and expert organisations to exert pressure on these predatory companies. Because those who aren't affected are generally apathetic.
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String said:
Did you read the article I linked to in my previous post
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You didn't post one in your previous post, sorry.

String said:
you think the industry just stands back and waits for window shoppers to float in? And whilst I would love to see the industry banned, it's clear that no one is realistically expecting that.
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Nope, they aggressively advertise and try to entice people like any/every company who wants to grow and succeed does and if people make the choice to use these companies, knowing the risk they hold, then those people should be adult enough to live with any consequences or benefits from their choice. If that ability to make a "choice" over using something which is legal is removed from adults because a tiny minority can't cope, then we've stopped being treated like adults and instead we are being treated like kids because being an adult is all about making choices and then living with the outcomes from them.
 
So you are claiming there is no manufactured fruit machines in the UK that have psuedo gambles?

Think before you answer, because if you say there is never been such machines made I will be calling you a liar or misinformed.

I am not saying every machine is like that, its the one's you see in places like the local fish and chip shop or pubs, but in UK casinos they more likely to be of the american type.

Do you honestly think there is no invincibility mode as an example? there is even youtube clips showing it in action.
 
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