Black Panther: Wakanda Forever

rp2000 said:
Latest clip/trailer:
As someone else mentioned initial reactions seem very positive.
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I don't think any mainstream reviewer will dare to give this a negative review, even if it deserves it, for fear of being called a racist etc, based on how the press reacted to the first film, which is awful for freedom of expression when people are scared to tell the truth, irrespective of whether the film is 10/10 or 1/10 or, most likely, somewhere in the middle.

As I mentioned earlier, as a fan of Boseman, thats the part I'm most interested in seeing, how they cover the transition of his legacy into a new BP character and, due to the low Phase 4 writing quality, thats the bit where I'm really worried it'll be done poorly.
 
ianh said:
I don't think any mainstream reviewer will dare to give this a negative review, even if it deserves it, for fear of being called a racist etc, based on how the press reacted to the first film, which is awful for freedom of expression when people are scared to tell the truth, irrespective of whether the film is 10/10 or 1/10 or, most likely, somewhere in the middle.

As I mentioned earlier, as a fan of Boseman, thats the part I'm most interested in seeing, how they cover the transition of his legacy into a new BP character and, due to the low Phase 4 writing quality, thats the bit where I'm really worried it'll be done poorly.
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Agreed, I think Chadwick Boseman and Michael B Jordan made the first movie. To replace those leads is nigh on impossible for me. That is who the audience links BP with and the presence will just not be there.

P4 has been shockingly bad, and I think they'll continue this trend here.
 
ianh said:
I don't think any mainstream reviewer will dare to give this a negative review, even if it deserves it, for fear of being called a racist etc, based on how the press reacted to the first film, which is awful for freedom of expression when people are scared to tell the truth, irrespective of whether the film is 10/10 or 1/10 or, most likely, somewhere in the middle.
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If you think mainstream reviewers give movies good scores because they have a diverse cast, why didn't Black Adam get rave reviews?
 
JamesH85 said:
Agreed, I think Chadwick Boseman and Michael B Jordan made the first movie. To replace those leads is nigh on impossible for me. That is who the audience links BP with and the presence will just not be there.

P4 has been shockingly bad, and I think they'll continue this trend here.
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Chadwick didn't do much for me. MBJ was brilliant and so was Andy Serkis.

VincentHanna said:
If you think mainstream reviewers give movies good scores because they have a diverse cast, why didn't Black Adam get rave reviews?
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I mean, the Rock isn't really considered "black" by most people and its cast isn't anything out of the usual. Black panther was a 95% black cast and people made out like it was the best film ever. It was decent. A good marvel film. Nothing amazing but because of the all black cast people fell over themselves to praise everything about it.
 
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ianh said:
I don't think any mainstream reviewer will dare to give this a negative review, even if it deserves it, for fear of being called a racist etc, based on how the press reacted to the first film, which is awful for freedom of expression when people are scared to tell the truth, irrespective of whether the film is 10/10 or 1/10 or, most likely, somewhere in the middle.

As I mentioned earlier, as a fan of Boseman, thats the part I'm most interested in seeing, how they cover the transition of his legacy into a new BP character and, due to the low Phase 4 writing quality, thats the bit where I'm really worried it'll be done poorly.
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Woman King didn't get rave reviews, (meta critic shows 77%) so I don't think your theory stands. I'm sure there are other examples, but that came to mind as there was a thread on this forum recently. I must confess, in my post I was referring to audience early reactions. But maybe most of them are probably press or invited people so maybe I should take them with a pinch of salt!

If you are so confident, I bet you can name the publications that will allegedly give this a 10/10 and then we can wait and see :)


On the other hand, on this forum I can guess the names of the mainstream users who will give it a negative review, and I doubt a single person in this forum will give it a 10/10. :D They will twist themselves in knots to try to think of reasons why it's bad. But mostly it will boil down to LOL women and LOL blacks.


rp2000
 
rp2000 said:
On the other hand, on this forum I can guess the names of the mainstream users who will give it a negative review, and I doubt a single person in this forum will give it a 10/10. :D They will twist themselves in knots to try to think of reasons why it's bad. But mostly it will boil down to LOL women and LOL blacks.
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There will definitely be some 10/10s from this forum because some people have an utterly bizarre scoring scale. I've read so many reviews on here that go something like "decent film, good pacing but final third isn't great, 8.5/10". Or "Not bad, nothing special, 7/10".
 
fez said:
There will definitely be some 10/10s from this forum because some people have an utterly bizarre scoring scale. I've read so many reviews on here that go something like "decent film, good pacing but final third isn't great, 8.5/10". Or "Not bad, nothing special, 7/10".
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In fairness I'm newer to this subforum, but I don't see many 10/10 scores in the threads I browse. If anything its the opposite these days. "Watched first 30 mins and didn't like it 4/10" :D or "Marvel peaked at Endgame so everything new is woke and deserves less than 5/10".

I would give the original Black Panther an 8/10, which for me means good enough to watch multiple times! I would rarely go for a 9 for Marvel film, but a few of them do hit that mark, for me.



rp2000
 
rp2000 said:
In fairness I'm newer to this subforum, but I don't see many 10/10 scores in the threads I browse. If anything its the opposite these days. "Watched first 30 mins and didn't like it 4/10" :D or "Marvel peaked at Endgame so everything new is woke and deserves less than 5/10".

I would give the original Black Panther an 8/10, which for me means good enough to watch multiple times! I would rarely go for a 9 for Marvel film, but a few of them do hit that mark, for me.
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To be fair, there are very few 10/10 scores, its usually just scores that are completely at odds with the actual review they give. Theres the occasional 10/10 but its usually reserved for classics like Alien etc.
 
Shamikebab said:
Only Marvel film that will always be a 10/10 for me is Winter Soldier, that film is always the greatest.
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Meh. It's one of the best Marvel movies, but I think both Infinity War and Endgame equal or surpass it, as do at least the last 2 spider-man films and maybe even Thor Ragnorak and Civil War. Having said that I would only give a 9/10, for the MCU stuff. It's just not been around long enough to stand the test of time and be a real classic, yet.

Maybe we should create a generic marvel thread at some point to discuss the merits of the franchise! (I would create one, but I suspect it will get trashed by non fans :D )


rp2000
 
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rp2000 said:
10/10 good? what are the others 2-3?


rp2000
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9/10, pretty much a perfect action film alongside Die Hard/Predator/Aliens and the like. Dark Knight/Batman Begins being the other 2 - although I actually prefer Begins over TDK :D Blade gets pretty close mind you.
 
VincentHanna said:
If you think mainstream reviewers give movies good scores because they have a diverse cast, why didn't Black Adam get rave reviews?
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rp2000 said:
Woman King didn't get rave reviews, (meta critic shows 77%) so I don't think your theory stands.
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Thats my mistake, I didn't make myself very clear there and I should have made this more clear - I wasn't talking about the reviews of other POC led films, I was specifically talking about Black Panther 1 & 2 - where because of the overwhelmingly positive reviews BP1 got (96% positive on RT etc) as the "first big mainstream Black superhero" film (which is completely wrong but was the all the press talked about at the time) it means that, in today's political/racial climate and certainly post Boseman's untimely death, a lot of reviewers for BP2 may feel unable to give BP2 an "honest" review for fear of potential backlash, irrespective of whether the film deserves such high numbers or not - so my post specifically about BP 2 only, not other POC films, sorry for any misunderstanding there.

rp2000 said:
If you are so confident, I bet you can name the publications that will allegedly give this a 10/10 and then we can wait and see :)
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I wouldn't say "confident", more "its my best guess" so if I had to guess, I would say, irrespective of how good the film actually is (and it may actually deserve a 9/10-10/10 score), that The Guardian will probably give it a 9/10 alongside Metro & The Independent and, for the US MSM I'd guess that The Hollywood Reporter, Rolling Stone & The Verge for example will give it very high marks irrespective of its actual quality. Thats not an exhaustive list and I've tried to stay relatively neutral with my picks (no far left review websites etc) but my issue over this specific film is that it could genuinely be deserving of 9/10 reviews, or it could be 1/10 garbage, but without critics feeling able to give an honest review and risk a backlash then the reviews will be useless.
 
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ianh said:
Thats my mistake, I didn't make myself very clear there and I should have made this more clear - I wasn't talking about the reviews of other POC led films, I was specifically talking about Black Panther 1 & 2 - where because of the overwhelmingly positive reviews BP1 got (96% positive on RT etc) as the "first big mainstream Black superhero" film (which is completely wrong but was the all the press talked about at the time) it means that, in today's political/racial climate and certainly post Boseman's untimely death, a lot of reviewers for BP2 may feel unable to give BP2 an "honest" review for fear of potential backlash, irrespective of whether the film deserves such high numbers or not - so my post specifically about BP 2 only, not other POC films, sorry for any misunderstanding there.



I wouldn't say "confident", more "its my best guess" so if I had to guess, I would say, irrespective of how good the film actually is (and it may actually deserve a 9/10-10/10 score), that The Guardian will probably give it a 9/10 alongside Metro & The Independent and, for the US MSM I'd guess that The Hollywood Reporter, Rolling Stone & The Verge for example will give it very high marks irrespective of its actual quality. Thats not an exhaustive list and I've tried to stay relatively neutral with my picks (no far left review websites etc) but my issue over this specific film is that it could genuinely be deserving of 9/10 reviews, or it could be 1/10 garbage, but without critics feeling able to give an honest review and risk a backlash then the reviews will be useless.
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Very honest and thought out response.

Possibly BP1 was rated a bit higher than it should have been by some media. I don't even know why I asked you to name them as I don't even read most newspapers and magazines, but I appreciate the thought in the reply. I hope you're wrong about theverge as it's one of my fave sites (albeit for tech not social and culture stuff).

Off course you are right somewhat that modern politics and events will influence the critic scores. It's not right, but it is reality. It's almost like revie sites are pointless now as critic reviews can be biased and audience reviews are easy to manipulate.

I liked BP1 and will be very surprised if BP2 is better, but I live in hope!


rp2000
 
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Bit surprised they did this but Namor is pronounced "Name-Or" not "Nam-mor". Baffelling how the Namor actor can't get his own name right even with the accent.
 
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The original black panther got 10/10 for being the first black superhero, as long as we are forgetting blade and all the others.
It's a cultural nexus point built around a ***** film.
Marvel hit jackpot paydirt. Their lead actor dying must have made their accountents burst into real tears.
 
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I don't recall Black Panther proclaming itself as the first black superhero movie.

The first superhero movie written by, directed by and starring a (mostly) black cast was it's selling point.
 
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