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Many European immigrants are actually over-skilled for the jobs they initially take on.
BoE confirms what we knew already: migration driving down wages
- Thread starter scorza
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Many European immigrants are actually over-skilled for the jobs they initially take on.
Soldato
the reason you're being ignored is because deep down people know that you're right! it's the attitude that stops others getting jobs! how can you not find a job in a country that you're born in yet a person with no english, new to the country, no family or friends manages to survive in say, London where prices for everything are mental!
Isn't the Governor of the Bank of England supposed to be apolitical? Bit worrying that he seems to be back-tracking on what he said yesterday and now actively cheerleading for the pro-migration crowd?
![[TW]Fox](/data/man-of-honor/2009.png){kind=avatar}
Because we all believe that everyone is entitled to live alone, in a place of their own, with nobody else, through unskilled work and when the wages for such work don't cover the cost of living alone in your own private house or flat we blame the system rather than ask if that's a reasonable expectation to have in the first place.
Whereas everyone else - ie Poles etc - recognise that compromises might need to be made and thus happily house share. 10 in a house sounds fairly extreme but whats wrong with the idea of a few friends in a house share? Or living with a partner? Significantly slashes your living costs.
Traditionally in the UK a household has been more than one person. Where has this massive growth in single person households come from?
Deleted member 66701
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Deleted member 66701
Because that's the way the world's organised, duh.
ROFL
Damn my fat fingers and small Android keyboard!
Really.....? .....As I'm pretty sure I've seen you give your opinion on the matters of other countries daily for the last few years
In fact, that looks nearly sig worthy to me
Caporegime
Do you leave your front door open and your valuables on display?
The fact is employers want to maximise their profits. If they can do this by screwing over employees without the taxman or anyone else finding out they will. illegal immigrants can't exactly run to the authorities to report problems can they?
Others who are legal may be afraid that if they speak up it'll cost them and others the jobs they depend upon.
Man of Honour
That was my thought. Ever notice that people love the low inflation and low (real terms) prices, and not wonder where they come from? Low wage costs are a vital part of capitalism, and any company which wishes to survive will find the cheapest labour it can commensurate with actually being able to do the job. If you keep wage costs down, you can sell cheaper.
First lesson of life: everything has a price.
Zeroth lesson of life: People are easy.
None of that changes the argument though; we live in a society where the price of labour is set by a free-ish market - the important thing is that there are laws such as minimum wage, HASAWA that protect all workers but especially those at the lower end of the market. I'm sure that we could reduce the cost (not price) of building a house if child labourers were used like they in certain parts of the world, however that *****s (stimulates) my conscience and I'm sure it does for most forum members. So we have this constant question about what protections do the most vulnerable workers need? All I want is some controls about the numbers of immigrants coming into the country.
HS2 is always in the news and part of its story is the astronomical cost. I wonder if we could reduce the cost by doing what the US did in the 18th and 19th century - get Chinese labourers in to build the railways. Is everyone OK with that? I wouldn't say so personally.
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Caporegime
Fair enough.
Working cash in hand for below minimum wage.
This day and age this is rare, but yeah, not unknown.
Pot washing, labouring, car washing, restaurants/takeaways
No reputable firm could employ you without paperwork, you cant get your foot in the door to Adecco without paperwork.
You would have every legal right in the world to expose not being paid minimum wage but as you say of course you might not speak up for fear of losing the job.
I suspect a lot of people get their wires crossed when it comes to EU migrants and non EU. They are the ones with most of the illegal black market jobs. The curry houses, the kebab shops, the car washes.
All businesses run by "foreign types" that can use their positions to gain the economic upper hand on there old country folk.
Anyway EU citizens ain't illegal immigrants They have the same rights as you or me to work in the EU. - I agree with your point 99% on the illegal side of the story.
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Caporegime
Indeed ! Its deffo part of the "problem"
I cant remember details or when it was exactly but one of the proposed, nasty Tory benefit cuts was for longterm unemployed folk aged <24/34 to live in shared housing? Something along those lines? The backlash was huge if i recall?
I might be completely wrong
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European immigrants are more skilled than UK Citizens on average so that isn't really the issue at all.
This ^^^
Does not entail the following:
Why not simply just protect the vulnerable workers? Immigrants have nothing to do with this.
The 2 concepts are completely unrelated. Because Cats are furry we should control immigrants? What, you just don't make any sense!
Soldato
Because people never had to do that UNTIL mass immigration happened.
This is the argument that goes over people's heads.
It has drastically aided in reducing the quality of life for current British citizens. Even ones who had moved here many years prior.
You can't take it out on the immigrants, they are just people like the rest of us. It's the policy makers that have caused this problem.
If we could readily move to Canada tomorrow and be better off, I bet Brits would ship off in droves.
So in 1970 say, you could work 9-5 in a supermarket and support yourself living alone in your own flat etc etc quite easily? In 1970 were households of just one person commonplace?
You can, provided you are skilled.
[TW]Fox;28039798 said:
Not sure but I'm certain that you didn't get 3 bed-semis converted into dormitories for 10+ workers.
[TW]Fox;28039798 said:
Why not unskilled as well? I mean, if it's so good for us why isn't it good for other countries like Canada? Not aiming this question at you specifically
Why stop there? Why not add some emotive hyperbole?
There we go
It's not good for us - actually, if you wish to move to the UK and are a non EU citizen the answer is pretty much 'go away unless you are either fabulously wealthy or have family here'. But we'll gloss over that and bang on about 'open door policy' instead because...
...we are part of the EU, which allows freedom of movement of labour.
Therefore really this isn't about immigration it's about the EU. The EU is effectively supposed to be a federation of member of states - which is why it allows freedom of movement at its core. Just like in other federal systems like the USA, you can move from California to New York if you want.
If you don't like that then the problem isn't our immigration policy - which is actually very tight - it's our membership of the EU. You could even be more specific, it's about the expansion of the EU in 2004. Annoyingly we don't have a time machine but it sounds to me like the EU concept worked fine until it was expanded to include member States which were radically different in terms of standard of living.
[TW]Fox;28039906 said:Why stop there? Why not add some emotive hyperbole?
There we go
Well that was the example used by someone else that you originally responded too. Credit to you for giving a sensible answer to the second point though - I agree FWIW.