Brazilian Grand Prix 2010, Interlagos Circuit - Race 18/19

ZG002 said:
Kind of on this note

Which of the top teams do people think will have a fast car beginning of next season? as typically fighting tooth and nail till the end of the season slows development for next season doesn't it? or does that only happen with big reg changes?
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I think Red Bull and Ferrari will build on this years successful cars - and wonder how well/if they will integrate KERS.

Mercedes will have been developing their challenger for a while, and have the best KERS to build on, even if they don't fully have experience of implementing it. McLaren though will probably have a fundementally different design to the mp4-25 next year yet have not concentrated their efforts fully on next year, so may be at a disadvantage depending on whether their concept is fully formed 'out of the box'. Also wonder if the rumours of them using a different KERS unit to Mercedes GP pans out.

Renault may be a dark horse, depending how much of a budget has been put up - it wouldn't surprise me if they were fighting for wins, or equally if they were battling Force India and Williams in the mid-field. They switched development focus a while back.

Most of the big changes should be at the back of the field, with the new teams approaching mid-field pace. Lotus have been developing next years car since Silverstone, and HRT will have a completely different car - who knows when (or if?) they started work on the new design.

Have to think the adjustable rear wing could make the whole sport a bit of a joke though, if for 'sporting' reasons it becomes a push to pass button whilst leaders are handcuffed by the rules not to respond. If the regulations allowed unrestricted use in place of the f-duct it would be fine, but as an 'incentive' for overtaking it may well prove a joke.
 
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If we had the repeat top three coming to the end of Abu Dhabi, I don't see why Vettel wouldn't move over. Sure, his ego would hate it, but I think he'd realise that it would be pointless to stay in front, since it wouldn't win him anything.
 
Panzerbjorn said:
I wonder why McLaren haven't been able to keep pace in the later half of the season, Button especially. They can blame the 'flexi-wing' all they want but it doesn't really excuse their lack of progress...

Genuinely interested. It doesn't seem like their investment in the F-duct really paid off. Even on the circuits where they were supposed to have a massive advantage the Red Bulls haven't really suffered that much.
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Its not really a lack of progression though, they are where they started, the problem with improvements is, all teams bring them, so you gain 0.1 second every race, but so do most other teams.

Red Bull, honestly they have the "Brawn" of this year, if they weren't taking each other out and making entirely stupid mistakes they'd have walked this months ago.

The only difference for McClaren this year is they were consistantly the 3rd best car(2nd best at points, but not for long), and have a shot into the last race, thats pretty impressive. Last year they weren't close to the 3rd best car till the second half of the season where Hamilton did rather the same, performed repeatedly above the relative speed of his car to rivals, but ultimately due to that lack of being one of the top two cars, and the absymal first half of the season there was never a chance at even being close to the title.

I mean, how many races have Red Bulls qualified 1-2 and finished 1-2, remember in a LOT of races they speed out at insane pace to 20-30seconds ahead, then they CRUISE to the end of a race. I think half the races this year they could really have shown their insane pace by pushing a lot harder than they in the end had to. They've been saving engines by cruise for 3/4's of MANY races this year thats how easy they've had it.

Everyone will have some bad lucky so a coupel DNF's or poor qualifying happens, personally I think Webber/Vettel overall have done pretty poorly to require a 1-2 to stop Alonso winning, Alonso shouldn't be anywhere near winning the title.

I mean think about all the safety cars aswell, how many 20-40second leads have Red Bull got then had wiped out by a safety car, too many to remember, Alonso/McClaren only seem kind of close due to points and not having many races with 3rd place finishing 40-60seconds behind which, at several races without safety cars would have happened. The car is just ridiculous, honestly if Red bull had Hamilton or Alonso, or Vettel and someone like Kovo in the second seat, the lead driver would be 100 points ahead by now. Its only because they have a close 1-2 and silly mistakes their lead really hasn't shown up as is should have.
 
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hiroofheroes said:
I think Red Bull and Ferrari will build on this years successful cars - and wonder how well/if they will integrate KERS.

Mercedes will have been developing their challenger for a while, and have the best KERS to build on, even if they don't fully have experience of implementing it. McLaren though will probably have a fundementally different design to the mp4-25 next year yet have not concentrated their efforts fully on next year, so may be at a disadvantage depending on whether their concept is fully formed 'out of the box'. Also wonder if the rumours of them using a different KERS unit to Mercedes GP pans out.

Renault may be a dark horse, depending how much of a budget has been put up - it wouldn't surprise me if they were fighting for wins, or equally if they were battling Force India and Williams in the mid-field. They switched development focus a while back.

Most of the big changes should be at the back of the field, with the new teams approaching mid-field pace. Lotus have been developing next years car since Silverstone, and HRT will have a completely different car - who knows when (or if?) they started work on the new design.

Have to think the adjustable rear wing could make the whole sport a bit of a joke though, if for 'sporting' reasons it becomes a push to pass button whilst leaders are handcuffed by the rules not to respond. If the regulations allowed unrestricted use in place of the f-duct it would be fine, but as an 'incentive' for overtaking it may well prove a joke.
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I think Mercedes and Schumi could be a surprise package next year, with Schumi involved in concept/idea's for how the car should work and using his influence on the team I think they'll have a car that behaves FAR closer to how he wants next season and they've been improving steadily. Schumi also seems to be improving himself from race to race.
 
Even if Mark is 5th in AD next week he will beat Lewis by 1 point (even if Lewis wins) - 16 points ahead now and 10 points for 5th

With the state of the McLaren at the moment I cant see Lewis doing better than 4th next weekend anyway (and in the championship without retirements)

Really impressed that JB managed to keep his championship challange going as long as his more settled - and theoreticaly "better" team mate (does anyone really believe all three other drivers will be slower than LH for this NOT to be the case)

Even with the (personal) disaster that was Korea, if it wasnt for Vettel's stupidity at Spa JB would be within 5 points of LH (or about 1 point in old money lol) - no one thought that possible at the beginning of the season after 18 races.

Will Lewis continue to crash out of races due to pushing too hard, going for too small a hole while overtaking.......more than likely as thats how he is, and I cant see him changing - whether this method works effectively as much as it used to, thats for him to decide but imo it doesnt

deko said:
If we assume that Hamilton would have finished in the position he crashed out of in the 2 races, in Monza he would have finished 4th, in Singapore 5th. Obviously anything could have happened, if in Monza he had gotten past Massa, he could have breezed past Button, maybe even Alonso.
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Fundamentally different wings in Monza, so there is no reason at all to suggest LH would breeze past JB (who had the f-duct working and led the race for the most part) or Alonso


If SV and MW are 1 &2 next weekend (in the race) and Alonso has an issue of some kind, Im betting on a "tactical" coming together on the track (front wing endplate of SV's car getting lodged in MW's tyre for example on a tight corner) for SV to win the title..... RB will only allow MW to win the title if SV is well down/retired
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Weebull said:
If we had the repeat top three coming to the end of Abu Dhabi, I don't see why Vettel wouldn't move over. Sure, his ego would hate it, but I think he'd realise that it would be pointless to stay in front, since it wouldn't win him anything.
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I think he would move over. However, I can see Webber pushing too hard and making a mistake in quali.
 
I guess Vettel will yield if he is asked by the team, but only because it's the team that pays him, he will not do it gladly though.

I kinda hope RB lose out now that they failed to give Webber the win, but that means Alonso propably wins the WC, I hate Lose/Lose situations :(
 
Dutch Guy said:
I guess Vettel will yield if he is asked by the team, but only because it's the team that pays him, he will not do it gladly though.

I kinda hope RB lose out now that they failed to give Webber the win, but that means Alonso propably wins the WC, I hate Lose/Lose situations :(
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Even though Horner has been/will be a complete arse, I still would prefer Vettel or Webber win the WDC.
 
Alonso's engine has to blow spectacularly surely?

Is this the 5th race it will do in AD - along with any quali/practice time its done?

At very worst it must be down on power for the next race?

I presume SV and MW are both on their last engine too but its just a lot fresher than Alonso's (two race distances fresher at least?)
 
I thought Alonso's engine was on its third race in Brazil? Not sure whether he has another engine that has only done two as well or not.
 
It must be at the end of its life now. Actually, they all must be? Given that the "end of life" engine in practice gave way, it surprises me they are still able to have it turned up so far. Surely they need to turn the power down now or risk a non finish? I still see a Red Bull driver taking this.
 
My predicition is that RB will come down tot he wire. MW is reckless at the best of times and will not yield given half the chance. Therefore, the RBs will take each other out, Alonso will win and Hamilton will grab 2nd
 
Actually quite enjoyed the race - but did anyone else think (apologies if it's already been mentioned!) that Vettel droppped a long way behind the safety car just before it came into the pits and he led the field past Junção and up the hill?

Not 100% on the rules these days but it seemed more than 10 car lengths to me. The safety car was completely out of shot as the cars came round and pulled up the hill.

gt
 
At those odds, its defo worth a punt on Hamilton! It is unlikely, but not impossible that Webber,Vettel and Alonso do not finish!
 
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