Canadian Grand Prix 2011, Circuit Gilles Villeneuve - Race 7/19

[JRS]

Wow...

No further penalties from the Stewards for any incidents.

Nice to see the FIA consistancy continuing. Making it look more like Lewis having a point.

I'm torn over this.

On the one hand - I'm glad that no action is being taken as JB fully deserved that win. He was simply awesome tip-toeing around at speed on the narrow drying line, millimetre perfect all the way, and made the best use out of DRS by making the moves stick without hopping the chicane like Mark Webber did once or twice. He put huge pressure on Vettel, and Vettel cracked.

On the other hand - if the Button/Hamilton incident is no penalty, then how come the Hamilton/Maldonado incident at Monaco was? Emmo was the driver steward yesterday with McNish the DS at Monaco, so maybe his viewpoint swayed things. At the time I thought that Hamilton should have gone to the right rather than the left given that the gap to the left was always going to close, but I guess he wanted to be mostly ahead and on the inside line for T1. As it turned out, he was so much quicker off the final chicane that he could have blown by Button on the right and been on the normal line for T1 anyway. Hey ho. As for Button/Alonso - Alonso only has himself to blame for that one. Button couldn't just make his car disappear. That's twice I remember those two colliding like that now - Australia '10 at T1 on the opening lap, Alonso turned in expecting Button to simply vanish and got turned around.


***edit***

Hamilton is such a ****. Theres racing, and theres just being reckless.

To borrow from the prophet Ayrton for a moment - if a racing driver no longer goes for a gap, then he's no longer a racing driver. Yes, there are times when Hamilton would do well to recognise that discretion is the better part of valour. But what makes him fun to watch is that he does go for it, and does try overtaking moves that others wouldn't even have a hope of pulling off. Yes, sometimes he comes out of it second best. Yes, it basically invites the stewards to hand him a penalty occasionally. But when he gets it right, he's unbeatable.

 

[FrankJH]

Good to see Jenson kept his place after the race. A well deserved win and a brilliant drive. Shows how much race pace the McLaren has in the dry now.

If that move on Alonso had been Hamilton then I am sure it all would have ended very differently.

I wouldnt expect too much from the McLaren just yet - remember a lot of cars had mixed / dry setups (even if there is less of a difference than there used to be) which possibly made JB's task a little easier

At some points of the race he was making mincemeat out of nearly everyone - at others he was struggling for a few laps to get past mid-grid or worse cars (admittedly this was during more really wet laps from memory)

JB's skill in variable conditions and possibly tyre management also (although maybe the commenaty about inters only lasting 10 laps was off the mark Im not sure) won the race more than the outright race pace of the McLaren.

ie perfectly dry race I would still expect the RB and possibly the Ferrari to be ahead (and to have Massa outqualify both McLaren's )

On the other hand - if the Button/Hamilton incident is no penalty, then how come the Hamilton/Maldonado incident at Monaco was? .

Am I thinking of the wrong Monaco - wasnt it bone dry? Visibility wasnt an issue at all at the Principality two weeks ago (which is exactly why there was a non-issue with the Hamilton/Button tangle yesterday)

You cant really put the same thing that happened yesterday in a downpour.....well certainly no visibility, imagine the same with no rain and expect no penalty

Im sure if it had been bone dry Button (and possibly Alsonso) might have been penalised

 

[MooMoo444]

, sometimes he comes out of it second best. Yes, it basically invites the stewards to hand him a penalty occasionally. But when he gets it right, he's unbeatable.

Then that doesn't make a skilled driver, that just makes someone who gambles. It's possible to overtake without touching cars, look at other people who do it - aka, the other 23 drivers :|

 

[JRS]

Am I thinking of the wrong Monaco - wasnt it bone dry? Visibility wasnt an issue at all at the Principality two weeks ago (which is exactly why there was a non-issue with the Hamilton/Button tangle yesterday)

Fair point. So, what consitutes causing an avoidable collision then? And does the rulebook take into account weather and track conditions when determining if a collision was avoidable or not?

I mean, if you think about it - all collisions are avoidable. What made Button/Hamilton and Alonso/Button non-punishable yesterday and Maldonado/Hamilton punishable in Monaco? Is there a specific rule that sorts this out?

I'm thinking no.

 

[arknor]

I don't get how people can say DRS is unfair, if Car A gets overtaken by Car B, then Car A if he is actually good enough and wasn't just in the way of a quicker car, can just overtake Car B in the DRS zone on teh next lap. We've not really seen too much flip flopping like that so the quickest car will always be in front. IMO all it does is lessen the skill needed to overtake, but then without it we get no overtaking at all more or less.

lets switch DRS so its a flap that gives you 12KMH oh drag you press the button and it pops up on the car infront.
its the exact same effect as we have now but lets see what the reaction is from people if they did it this way .

schumacher was right on the back of webber at the finish aswell after catching him back up if there was 1 more lap he probably wouldnt have got his place back, anyway for me with the massively long DRS zone like at canada it takes all skill out of an overtake

 

[Cavallino]

Nvm.

 

[NathanE]

Did anyone else think SV was getting rather ragged the very corner before his incident? He put it high up on the kerbs near the wall. And Jenson took a much drier line. Then the very next corner SV took more liberties with the a wet part of the track and almost spun it. That'll teach him to be complacent

 

[MooMoo444]

Did anyone else think SV was getting rather ragged the very corner before his incident? He put it high up on the kerbs near the wall. And Jenson took a much drier line. Then the very next corner SV took more liberties with the a wet part of the track and almost spun it. That'll teach him to be complacent

Vettel's never been one for pressure - he's a thoroughbred time trial driver. When he quali's on pole, majority of the time he will sail away with it. Just pressure got to him here, he's never had any real experience of having to defend a position tbh.

If he wins this season, which he probably will, it's going to be from qualifying rather than racing ability.

 

[GravyMonster]

Yeah Vettel had completely eased off with about 5 laps to go. He'd settled to an easy rythm, expecting to manage a gap to Schumacher, or take it easy knowing Webber was behind and wouldn't challenge.

When Button got into 2nd place he had to put the boot in again, but becuase he'd been taking it easy he didn't have the tyre temp, or the confidence in the car/track condition and was very ragged on several occasions before he slid off at T6.

 

[JRS]

Did anyone else think SV was getting rather ragged the very corner before his incident? He put it high up on the kerbs near the wall. And Jenson took a much drier line. Then the very next corner SV took more liberties with the a wet part of the track and almost spun it. That'll teach him to be complacent

He was having to drive like a man posessed just to stay in front of JB. Goes some way to proving a point that many of us have raised before - put Seb under real pressure, and he will crack.

 

[utajoker]

great news button kept the win.

im sure hamilton would have got a penalty for the jb incident had he been able to continue.

 

[clv101]

Could not believe how easy it was for Schui to be over taken by Webber and Jenson.

Yeah, I'm not a fan of DRS. On to many occasions the overtaking driver has just sailed past and there's been nothing the defending driver could do. That's not the racing I want to see, I'd rather have fewer overtakes but for them to be 'genuine'.

 

[CaptainRAVE]

He was having to drive like a man posessed just to stay in front of JB. Goes some way to proving a point that many of us have raised before - put Seb under real pressure, and he will crack.

Vettel has a lot more to lose at this point, Button has absolutely nothing to lose.

Whatever Vettel says, he knows the championship is nearly his.

 

[clv101]

...(and those thinking MS deserved the win are just laughable imo - the only thing that saved him being that high were the conditions, his car was dog slow and didnt deserve a podium let alone a win)

Don't agree with that, MSC had at least two fastest laps during the race. I think he deserved a podium and most likely would have got it were it not for DRS.

 

[Dave M]

Button had a bit of a dirty race, not sure if someone at the team had a word or if he felt in his own head he could have done more at Monaco rather than play it safe.

I'd have expected button to back off and give up places when challenged by Hamilton and Alonso, but today he left his car in there and played them at their own game. Not his usual style at all but I liked watching it.

 

[CaptainRAVE]

Button had a bit of a dirty race, not sure if someone at the team had a word or if he felt in his own head he could have done more at Monaco rather than play it safe.

I'd have expected button to back off and give up places when challenged by Hamilton and Alonso, but today he left his car in there and played them at their own game. Not his usual style at all but I liked watching it.

Agreed, it was good to see Button getting more involved. It certainly paid off in the end.

 

[iamtheoneneo]

so once again Hamilton shows that hes rather immature when it comes to f1, which is fair enough hes still young but its funny how even those that would normally defend the *** for his consistantly stupid moves are backing away from what happened on sunday, I cant say i rate him as a good driver at all, world championship or not, being good means winning and overtaking without ramming yourself into everybody that gets in your way. Theres zero skill in that and the blame is entirely on him.

nice to see MSC up there at the top again , shame about the podium but he will get there this season im sure. His car is pretty slow though which is a shame.

Button winning was great to watch, really nice end to the race with the constant 1-5 shuffles.

 

[arknor]

MS deserved the win are just laughable imo - the only thing that saved him being that high were the conditions, his car was dog slow and didnt deserve a podium let alone a win)

lol what? wet conditions saved him?

his car didnt deserve a podium you are right it only got into a position of achieving one through driver skill so saying he didnt deserve it it just biased BS the kind of crap you sprouted in that other thread

 

[Participant]

seriously, what?

Why do people waste their time typing this kind of thing ^?

Sure it was funny in hindsight

It was funny at the time also. People like you bringing the melodrama from a completely unrelated incident 30 years ago is just a joke. For a start the race was under yellow flag therefore far less likely to cause an incident, and secondly the marshall was walking like a new born foal, which was funny in spit of your butthurt.

 

[DBT85]

Really interesting seeing the different viewpoints on Hamilton.