Chinese Grand Prix 2011, Shanghai International Circuit - Race 3/19

What the hell do you want from a race if that was boring?! :confused:

I want racing and passing thats not ridiculous. Hamilton put in a few great moves and a few like Rossberg overtake that were just given.

99% of the overtakes in this race and the past two were, old tyres vs new, simple a massively faster car, theres no competition its like going in the fast lane with a Ferrari vs a lorry on the inside lane, its not overtaking, its just, passing, with no effort.

Basically 95% + of the overtaking was more like Vettel vs a HRT, than Vettel vs a Vettel clone, fighting it out with great driving.

Thats a shame, for every great move out there, there was 10 overtakes that had no skill, no effort, no defence, no question it was going to happen. Thats not "racing" its not fun, its just a fast car passing a slow car.

Hamilton, as I've said many times, is someone so capable that he provides Vettel vs Vettel type overtakes. Taking Button with great driving vs matching car, but most other drivers didn't do that. Webber once on the soft tyres at the end, it wasn't a contest, he wasn't driving fantastically, it was just him in a 3-4 seconds faster a lap car that had no rival at all.

I said, its better than NOTHING happening, but its not a patch on REAL racing. As someone else put it, better than nothing but it felt forced, and fake and frankly retarded.

Give them Kers and DRS, but give them tyres that mean if you push, using kers and DRS to pass people essentially comprimises your strategy/race/tyres so its better to NOT pass and just pray for a good pitstop.....wooooo. THe thick and fast overtaking, and the real gaining on others around you, like Hamilton on Massa, then Vettel, ONLY happened because of different tyre strategy, and it didn't happen in ANY of the other stints, and Webber only destroyed the field in the final 15 laps because of the type of tyre he was on.

What do you guys think will happen when everyone decides, opps, different strategys cost us badly, and everyone works out hards on low fuel are rubbish because softs last just as well on low fuel/weight in the final stint.

Within 3-4 races everyone in every race will do the same strategy(looks like 3 or 4 stops depending on the race) and everyone will be running hards in the middle stint with softs at the end. When everyones strategy matches, what did we get in the first 3 stints, nothing, at all, except Webber who again was an outlyer, fast car, different tyre, bad quali, not a "normal" situation.

Basically first 3 stints, nothing, 4th stint, completely different and racing induced by different tyres, the passing wasn't difficult, or quality, or brave, or particularly exciting, did you see Vettel and Rossberg essentially let Hamilton through? Great times by Hamilton, great driver, but anyone in that car on those tyres would have done Vettel.

Then what about qualifying, again people will get bored, will Ferrari waste 58 sets of softs in qualifying because they suck at it? Or accept a 11-15th start, and finish on the podium due to their race pace, at some point people will give up being OTT on qualifying, save tyres for the race, match strategys pit on the same laps, it will be like the warm up lap with only mistakes causing overtaking.

3/4's of a race, everyone conserving tyres, no real great movement, all the overtaking essentially done by pit stop strategy, couple laps earlier or later, or too late. Then of easymode overtaking, sorry but go watch a race from the mid 80's to the mid 90's, this was an epic fail in terms of "racing" in comparison.
 
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It only works when you have the massive tyre advantage and lets face it, it's a bit of a lottery how they work out in the race. Lewis didn't set the car up for that to happen, the race just came to him tyre wise.

They don't have enough info on the tyres to plan this out yet.

As I said the trouble is if you can't get passed straight away, the tyres get trashed. Alonso battled hard with MS for 5 or 6 laps which killed his tyres.

It's created a very very exciting race but there is going to be a lot of luck involved this year in how your set up works as the weight comes off/downforce and tyre wear.

As seen in the last race it worked for JB and in this race it worked for LH.

It will make the season exciting and unpredictable but as Webber said on the forum, it's more strategy now than racing and following a plan. I'm not sure yet how forced and fake it all feels.
 

would you prefer to go back to overtaking in the pit stops?

this is the best its been for a while.

the tire difference was due to people doing different strategies which is what people wanted. drivers doing mixed amounts of stops and it still be good racing. not 1 strategy that is easily the best so no one does anything else.

we had vetel trying to be constant but slightly slower making the tires last a lot longer and then we had hamilton being agressive and having to drive much faster to make up for an extra stop.

button also did 3 stops but didn't make his tires last like hamilton did (suprising as he is much better)(apparently).

webber did 3 and was extremely agressive to make up the diference from startin 18th and he made them last but did his hards stint first.

so many different approaches.

atleast we got overtaking and an entertaining race.
 
how can it be forced and fake?

the two important things for me are

1) A front running car can overtake a midfield car if the front runner makes a stop.

2) The drivers and teams have to use their brains a lot more when working out strategy.

Both of these cause better racing imo.

Hammi did the work yesterday, so hats off to him.
 
I tried to google it i typed it (curves and kurves?) can someone tell me what the curves system is and what it does?
 
You means the KERS system?

It stores up energy under breaking, giving the driver 7ish seconds worth of extra power to use whenever they want each lap. It's worth about 80bhp.
 
But Hamilton was clearly faster than Button in both of the second last and last stints, so it can't be entirely explained by fresher rubber.
 
Only caught the second half of the race when I got up this morning and it's the first one I've seen so far this season. Must say, cracking stuff even without the lack of crashes. Were the other two as good as this? Seems the changes they've made this season are making it a lot more exciting as there was stuff happening all throughout the field.
 
Only caught the second half of the race when I got up this morning and it's the first one I've seen so far this season. Must say, cracking stuff even without the lack of crashes. Were the other two as good as this? Seems the changes they've made this season are making it a lot more exciting as there was stuff happening all throughout the field.

tsk. tsk.



The other two races werent that great to be honest.
 
It's quite hard to compare this season to last.

Last season there was no KERS or DRS and not much overtaking. RBR cars were better than the rest of the pack but driver error and/or mechanical failure made things quite balanced between all of the leading teams.

So far this season there hasn't been any DNFs with the top drivers but the KERS issues with Webber, the DRS issues with Alonso and the tyre issues with McLaren have meant that while RBR still has the better car it's still quite balanced apart from Vettle who has a comfortable lead.

So while there have been less accidents/crashes/full mechanical failures this season there has been more overtaking, making both seasons quite exciting.

The only thing is that this season some people are saying the overtaking feels 'fake' because of the DRS rules.

It's probably too early in the season to judge yet but so far I think it's just as good as last year but for difference reasons.
 
It only works when you have the massive tyre advantage and lets face it, it's a bit of a lottery how they work out in the race. Lewis didn't set the car up for that to happen, the race just came to him tyre wise.

They don't have enough info on the tyres to plan this out yet.

As I said the trouble is if you can't get passed straight away, the tyres get trashed. Alonso battled hard with MS for 5 or 6 laps which killed his tyres.

It's created a very very exciting race but there is going to be a lot of luck involved this year in how your set up works as the weight comes off/downforce and tyre wear.

As seen in the last race it worked for JB and in this race it worked for LH.

It will make the season exciting and unpredictable but as Webber said on the forum, it's more strategy now than racing and following a plan. I'm not sure yet how forced and fake it all feels.

I understand your point

It IS racing, just a different kind of racing than what we had previously

Currently, its not the kind of racing we've seen 20 years ago where things were a much more level playing field and the drivers talent was the defining factor in determining victory.

However i'm not sure we can ever go back to that. Technology has evolved in such a way that the only way to get back back would be to make F1 a one make series.

F1 changed the old format, to try and get back the old F1, and ended up creating something altogether different. I'm not entirely sure anybody else's ideas wouldn't do the same.

If its a choice between this and a 1 make F1, i'll take F1 as it is currently thanks.
 
Will be interesting to see what happens from here. I think Webber's comment, although in jest, was quite telling - don't bother with quali, just keep all the sets for the race. We may now see more of a push towards this, especially on tracks where DRS can give you a huge boost.
 
It's worth bearing in mind that Australia was the first race with the new regulations, and the last two tracks were tilke designed. Now we're back in Europe at the traditional tracks for the core of the season it could be all change.
 
Props to Di Resta and Rosberg, both had epic drives

I agree, both did well, and Webber seemed to fly in from the back too, after a not very promising start.

& the only 'accident' (apart from Button's pit stop), was the Alguersuari wheel coming off, where as last year, THIS occured :p
 
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Di Resta seems like the perfect driver for the smaller teams. He has started three races and finished all three. Last season a lot of the minnow drivers were getting DNF's which is pretty terrible when the sponsor bonuses probably preclude to the drivers finishing the races. Can only hope he continues doing this well.
 
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