Caporegime
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And here come the arguments of speculation and semantics 

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Presuming Mantle gets integrated into DX12, which you are but we've seen no proof of at all, would suggest AMD being happy to relinquish control and if a DX12 SDK was publicly released and it included Mantle, then you'd be proven wrong, not right.
Sorry I made a thread about this ages ago which is six pages long:
http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18583194
The article in the OP was from two weeks ago and outside the sensationalism wccftech is know for at times,is based on the same information.
It on purpose ignores the bit about AMD contributing to GDC too.
Both the threads are about GDC.
Can the threads be merged,mods?? Why does this warrant another thread,when its using the same event??
Mine was started on the 26th of February. This was started on the 7th of March.
title of my thread said:DirectX and OpenGL will start offering low-level access in order to reduce draw overhead
One thing I noticed: all the Nvidia GDC talks are about DX 11. The talks about DX 12 are all MS or AMD. Given that AMD must have had advanced knowledge of anything in the XBone as they built the CPU/GPU, I'm totally speculating a couple of things:
1. Mantle is getting fast tracked into DX as a thin API. No extra hardware features, but better tools and closer-to-the metal API. Maybe MS and AMD have worked on it together a lot longer than we know about it. MS gets more performance and better tools on XB and PC, AMD does all the work and gets a competitive advantage over Nvidia. MS don't care about Nvidia as they have no relevance to the console market. It isn't the first time MS have unilaterally changed DX (the killing of the hardware sound stack).
2. DX 12 is a superset of DX 11. The XBone APU contains secret sauce for DX 12 that is about to be revealed along with a new, thinner API. Having designed and built the XBone APU, AMD have also built that same hardware into their Hawaii chips, and will announce that they have DX 12 hardware already out there.
One thing I noticed: all the Nvidia GDC talks are about DX 11. The talks about DX 12 are all MS or AMD. Given that AMD must have had advanced knowledge of anything in the XBone as they built the CPU/GPU, I'm totally speculating a couple of things:
1. Mantle is getting fast tracked into DX as a thin API. No extra hardware features, but better tools and closer-to-the metal API. Maybe MS and AMD have worked on it together a lot longer than we know about it. MS gets more performance and better tools on XB and PC, AMD does all the work and gets a competitive advantage over Nvidia. MS don't care about Nvidia as they have no relevance to the console market. It isn't the first time MS have unilaterally changed DX (the killing of the hardware sound stack).
2. DX 12 is a superset of DX 11. The XBone APU contains secret sauce for DX 12 that is about to be revealed along with a new, thinner API. Having designed and built the XBone APU, AMD have also built that same hardware into their Hawaii chips, and will announce that they have DX 12 hardware already out there.
IMO what your saying has merit, AMD know how to get the most out of their own architecture, I think MS tried with their own API differing from DX only to find its not good enough to compete with the PS4's stronger hardware.
I think AMD went to MS and proposed Mantle or perhaps a more advanced version of Mantle to MS provided they also make it available on the PC, AKA DX12.
AMD may have proposed this much earlier in the XB1 development stage, its quite possible that Mantle was originally developed with the XB1 / PS4 in mind and both refused given that they are in competition with the PC.
AMD's reaction was to release it as an API that competes with DX, MS realised they don't have an API which allows them to compete with the PS4, on top of that find their Desktop API monopoly under threat and felt pressured to reconsider AMD's offer.
Quite a clever Coup if thats about how it panned out. who holds all the cards now, eh?![]()
Yeah, but you know it might just be AMD crowing about TrueAudio being fed into DX 12. AMD are the masters at hyping things up and then not delivering what was expected. Snatching defeat from the jaws of victory seems to be a bit of a speciality with them.
Mantle in DX means it has to work in Nvidia doesn't it? Or they just won't bother.
From what I understand with DirectX development, don't they basically all get together to put into it what they can etc? So they all MS/AMD/Nvidia etc have a say?
IMO what your saying has merit, AMD know how to get the most out of their own architecture, I think MS tried with their own API differing from DX only to find its not good enough to compete with the PS4's stronger hardware.
I think AMD went to MS and proposed Mantle or perhaps a more advanced version of Mantle to MS provided they also make it available on the PC, AKA DX12.
AMD may have proposed this much earlier in the XB1 development stage, its quite possible that Mantle was originally developed with the XB1 / PS4 in mind and both refused given that they are in competition with the PC.
AMD's reaction was to release it as an API that competes with DX, MS realised they don't have an API which allows them to compete with the PS4, on top of that find their Desktop API monopoly under threat and felt pressured to reconsider AMD's offer.
Quite a clever Coup if thats about how it panned out. who holds all the cards now, eh?![]()
Mantle in DX means it has to work in Nvidia doesn't it? Or they just won't bother.
Mantle in DX means it has to work in Nvidia doesn't it? Or they just won't bother.
From what I understand with DirectX development, don't they basically all get together to put into it what they can etc? So they all MS/AMD/Nvidia etc have a say?
Mantle in DX means it has to work in Nvidia doesn't it? Or they just won't bother.
From what I understand with DirectX development, don't they basically all get together to put into it what they can etc? So they all MS/AMD/Nvidia etc have a say?
Mantle can work on other gpu's.
![]()
Follow AMDs lead on what exactly? GCN?
Oh my lord - it's bad enough it's derailed into a Mantle thread. Nevermind the fact Kepler is super old and still dominates leader boards the world round. Begrudgingly wouldn't come close lol.
Mantle in DX means it has to work in Nvidia doesn't it? Or they just won't bother.
From what I understand with DirectX development, don't they basically all get together to put into it what they can etc? So they all MS/AMD/Nvidia etc have a say?