Disabled couple snooped on and accused of fraud by the DWP

[Jono8]

The problem is the amount of people with "bad backs" or "mental health problems" but are really just to lazy to work.

Or maybe, the people in power and those that hoard all the wealth, have created a society that breeds massive mental health problems/a massive amount of demoralisation.


It's very easy to just blame the people on benefits. The sad reality is that the rich and greedy have created a society that isn't worth working or even living for, for a large amount of people.

 

[Werewolf]

The problem is the amount of people with "bad backs" or "mental health problems" but are really just to lazy to work.

If you've ever actually tried to claim for disability, or helped someone claim for it you'd know that "bad back" and other old stereotypes don't get far, it's just the same old nonsense.

One of my friends was doing a PIP claim for a condition that she'd had and had waited ~4 years for a diagnosis for that amongst other things caused a "bad back" and repeated IIRC rib fractures*, she got nowhere until she finally got a diagnosis with a specific name, suddenly once there was a definitive test result and name to the condition she went from "fit and healthy" in the eyes of DWP to "oh you are actually ill", if anything when she got the diagnosis her condition improved a bit as there is a treatment that can reduce some of the issues (but has it's own drawbacks in terms of side effects).

The "bad back" stereotype seems to have come from some very successful PR by the thatcher era government in regards to ex miners and industrial workers who were laid off and often had work related issues, and medical professionals who knew exactly what damage that sort of manual labour did and how many of their patients would try and push through till they could retire/move into a less intensive role.
In the last 40 years the assessments for "are you fit to work" have gone further and further away from medical professionals who actually knew the people being assessed (at one point it was your GP who could initially sign you off for several months), and more and more towards people who don't actually know your history, are not medically trained/trained in the same way (physio's and general nurses vs GP/consultants) and running primarily through checklists with incentives from the private companies that the government has poured money into to find you "fit". A huge percentage of the "declared fit by DWP" will be found to be unfit if they make it through to a Tribunal where the decision is made purely on medical and legal grounds by an actual doctor and a lawyer or Judge and not based on the DWP's current policy on how best to kill off the disabled with minimal fuss in the press (I'm only half joking, the "hostile" policies by the last 14 years of tory government has contributed to the death of/actively killed a lot of disabled people, especially those who didn't have the support network to fight back).


*It's a neurological issue (I can't remember the name) that causes sporadic uncontrolled muscle spasms, apparently it used to be known by a variety of names (and still for specific variants) but can affect virtually any voluntary muscle group, in her case it was muscles along the back and around the ribs, causing her arm to lock up, a couple of specific ribs to keep getting fractured etc.

 

[Richard - London]

Or maybe, the people in power and those that hoard all the wealth, have created a society that breeds massive mental health problems/a massive amount of demoralisation.


It's very easy to just blame the people on benefits. The sad reality is that the rich and greedy have created a society that isn't worth working or even living for, for a large amount of people.

Thats just an excuse, there have always been poor and disabled people, but they always did what they needed to do to survive, today its a lifestyle choice for many, being paid for by the middle class.

 

[Jono8]

Thats just an excuse, there have always been poor and disabled people, but they always did what they needed to do to survive, today its a lifestyle choice for many, being paid for by the middle class.

It's not an excuse. Its completely true. Wealth inequality is the biggest cause of most of the problems we face today. This being one of them.

 

[ltron]

6.3 million people claim disability benefits in the UK, so nearly 1 in 10 people. It is crazy and in no way sustainable.

This along with people that don't work, or low-paid workers claiming money for kids they cannot afford is the reason working and middle-class people are paying so much tax.

You can work while being on certain disability benefits, PIP is not means tested for example and many on Universal Credit are working while being paid slave wages.

 

[Pawnless Endgame]

The DWP are scum. They outsource their work to Capita (equally scum) and halved my DLA when it got moved over to PIP. It went to tribunal and I won by a landslide. In fact, my case was so strong that the DLA didn't even bring a representative to court because they knew they were going to lose, yet they dragged it out over a 3-year period hoping that I'd back down.

 

[Werewolf]

Thats just an excuse, there have always been poor and disabled people, but they always did what they needed to do to survive, today its a lifestyle choice for many, being paid for by the middle class.

"they did what they needed to survive", yes often at best in poverty, more often they didn't survive.

Has it occurred to you that one of the reasons we have more disabled people now might be because they're actually surviving? (we're certainly living longer on average)
You have a heart attack now and you're far more likely to survive than just 50 years ago, but often be limited.
You are much more likely to survive a stroke now than even 25 years ago, but unless you're lucky you're likely to end up with some disability.
You had something like CF 50 years ago and you were likely to be dead by the time you hit 20 or 30, born just 10-15 years later* and you are much more likely to be alive in your 50's but potentially needing more help from the state.
Even something as "mundane" as a bad fall or car accident you're likely to survive injuries today that 50 years ago would have killed you, thanks to a combination of better training and equipment for the paramedics, better equipment and training for the fire service (to pull you out of the wreck), better training and equipment at the hospital, and if it's really bad the availability of the air ambulances to get you very quickly to dedicated specialist centres for things like spinal and brain injuries.

Then there are the countless other illnesses and injuries that just a few decades ago, let alone 100 years ago would have likely led to death in a relatively short time, but now we are likely to survive, although not necessarily in a condition to do any 9-5 job, and often with limitations on mobility etc.


*I have a friend the same age as me, IIRC he wasn't expecting to hit 25 when he was in his teens, fortunately medication/treatment for CF advanced faster than his condition, and he's able to lead a reasonably normal life albeit with a bunch of vital drugs that are expensive.

 

[Ayahuasca]

Thats just an excuse, there have always been poor and disabled people, but they always did what they needed to do to survive, today its a lifestyle choice for many, being paid for by the middle class.

You're oversimplifying an incredibly complex issue.

There are very few people who claim significant, long-term benefits from just having a bad back or diagnosing themselves with mental health problems.

My own mother has a degenerative disease (SCA) and it took her two full physical examinations before they would pay out, even though it's a progressive neurodegenerative disease with no treatment, by the time the main symptoms are noticeable you absolutely cannot work. She actually worked up until a few years before she was diagnosed, just thinking she had a bad case of vertigo. Why they even need to assess someone who's been diagnosed with this is anyone's guess, let alone two assessments.

 

[Uther]

Thats just an excuse, there have always been poor and disabled people, but they always did what they needed to do to survive, today its a lifestyle choice for many, being paid for by the middle class.

It's embarrassing, and actually quite abhorrent that attitudes such as this still exist in 2024.

 

[mid_gen]

6.3 million people claim disability benefits in the UK, so nearly 1 in 10 people. It is crazy and in no way sustainable.

Shock horror, when people have to wait literally years to get treatment for disabling illnesses, orthopedics etc, you end up with a lot of people unable to work.

Almost like cutting public services to the bone is a false economy.

 

[dave28]

Funny how they chase some and not others. One of my uncles was was on sick for decades but had saved up tens of thousands in multiple British Banks while still claiming in full and getting a nice disability car also.

When he died it all came to light and his wife who claims she had no knowledge of it had to face their wrath.

 

[robfosters]

Thats just an excuse, there have always been poor and disabled people, but they always did what they needed to do to survive, today its a lifestyle choice for many, being paid for by the middle class.



what a disgusting thing to say. Tell me what is a disabled person supposed to do to earn enough to live in this modern and expensive world.

You honestly sound like you’re advocating Victorian workhouses or something. I’m flabbergasted by your complete lack of empathy for the less fortunate

 

[Voltar]

So why are there so many benefit claimants?

The usual cycle of tax the “rich”, blame the tories, blame labour, blame thatcher is never ending without actually trying to work out why there are such high numbers.

Sadly though as ever it is the genuinely needy who will suffer whilst politics and tabloids kick around the political football that is benefits. Being disabled is no joke nor is it a doss.

The fact it was fair game for C5 to make an entertainment series called benefit street and we have shows like can’t pay we will take it away should tell you all you need to know.

 

[Werewolf]

Shock horror, when people have to wait literally years to get treatment for disabling illnesses, orthopedics etc, you end up with a lot of people unable to work.

Almost like cutting public services to the bone is a false economy.

Yup

There are disabilities that can be dealt with pretty quickly and get people back to work reasonably reliably IF the support is there, for example joint issues can be utterly crippling until sorted, but once fixed you might be able to work again, but it requires the facilities to get them fixed, preferably before the problem gets worse or transfers to other parts of the body (the way you subconsciously adjust posture etc and work around joint issue can mean you put much more stress on other parts of the body).

Even just the delays in actually diagnosing issues means that you will have people who are "sick and disabled", who could be back to work if they knew what was wrong with them and were getting treatment, but the longer they are untreated the worse things get.

 

[Ali195]

The DWP are scum. They outsource their work to Capita (equally scum) and halved my DLA when it got moved over to PIP. It went to tribunal and I won by a landslide. In fact, my case was so strong that the DLA didn't even bring a representative to court because they knew they were going to lose, yet they dragged it out over a 3-year period hoping that I'd back down.

Ah Capita. How I remember them from the 2000’s. They have this incredible power to slowly destroy a firm by taking every possible action but the one that will improve customer outcome and provide them with an income. It can NEVER be both.

I’d never heard of or seen 12 week rotas, annualised hours or split shift (come in, work 4 hours, go home, come back again remaining 4 hours) until they came about. All the serious people quickly jumped ship leaving the dregs. Absolutely dire firm.

 

[n111ck]

Well when you even have Labour saying stuff like this you know there's a problem.. lol..

Labour: Young people will be expected to take up work and training

Liz Kendall says there's "no option of a life on benefits" for young people if Labour wins the election.

www.bbc.co.uk

The system is in the state it is because too many people are claiming benefits they dont need or are not entitled too - which makes the claims process more honerous which ultimately affects the genuine claimants. So if you want to blame anyone blame the fraudsters.

Also the benefits aren't paid for my some magic government money they are paid for with workers taxes so the government and civil service have a responsibility to all tax payers to ensure that money is spent fairly and correctly.

 

[robfosters]

Liz Kendall has always been a closet Tory, she’s just feeling emboldened enough to show it even more now

 

[potatolord]

ONS figures on economic activity and long-term sickness as a component of that are here:

Rising ill-health and economic inactivity because of long-term sickness, UK - Office for National Statistics

Experimental statistics estimating the different health conditions of the working-age population and those economically inactive because of long-term sickness.

www.ons.gov.uk

Tables 1 and 4 are interesting, showing a significant, and recent, growth in long-term health conditions. My gut feeling is that is a system problem exacerbated by different standards being applied to claims during covid.

The figures are for ages 16-64.

 

[wesimmo]

Thats just an excuse, there have always been poor and disabled people, but they always did what they needed to do to survive, today its a lifestyle choice for many, being paid for by the middle class.

And what do disenfranchised poor people do to survive? Petty crime and working the grey economy to a far greater degree.

Give people few realistic choices, exclusively bad ones, and they'll make choices that are bad, not bad choices.

 

[Resident]

Thats just an excuse, there have always been poor and disabled people, but they always did what they needed to do to survive, today its a lifestyle choice for many, being paid for by the middle class.



what a disgusting thing to say. Tell me what is a disabled person supposed to do to earn enough to live in this modern and expensive world.

You honestly sound like you’re advocating Victorian workhouses or something. I’m flabbergasted by your complete lack of empathy for the less fortunate

I'm disabled according to the law, diagnosed with myalgic encephalomyelitis.

I get there are some people who's disability precludes them from working but there are also a lot of people who get their disability diagnosis and then use it to sit on their backsides despite being capable of work. In those cases, yes those people should be assessed on what they can do and find a suitable job with benefits to top-up their earnings rather than the taxpayer footing the bill entirely.

There used to be a scheme called Remploy in the UK (now only operates in Scotland) that was dedicated to getting disabled people back into work but ceased a few years ago.