disciplinary for unauthorised absence

mattyfez said:
As I was alluding to in my point above I'd also argue that as a precident of verbal/writing it in the dairy confirmation has been set, that the argument that you didn't get a form signed is null and void, even if forms or some other witten/electionic confirmation are technically company policy as they should be.
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If their HR team has any sense, the issue won't be the form it will be the op filling in the diary themself. There appears no precedent for that and all the validation the op has for it is a disputed set of facts. The forms themselves should be irrelevant if the company want to cause issues.
 
bainbridge said:
I assume you've had other instances of authorised leave in your four years there. Where are the completed holiday requests for those?

If you've followed the usual procedure then they can't possibly justify disciplining you, unless there has been a recent change in procedure or something?
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this...

frankly I'd raise a grievance about the AM over this... (presumably it is he who caused this whole fuss in the first place)

and get your CV out there while you're at it, no point sticking around at a company like that anyway
 
Pudney said:
If their HR team has any sense, the issue won't be the form it will be the op filling in the diary themself. There appears no precedent for that and all the validation the op has for it is a disputed set of facts. The forms themselves should be irrelevant if the company want to cause issues.
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A fair point.. however if the manager verbally approved it (ok that's one word against the other)...

Then it was in the Rota/diary and not questioned.. There's too many question marks over the managers conduct to make anything stick.

Seems an archaic system..open to issues just like this..if neglecting the use of forms at least have a spreadsheet that only the manager can edit, if it's not on the spreadsheet it's not authorised.
 
it is pretty backwards whatever it is... filling in paper forms for something every employee will be requesting several times a year... in 2016... why not just have some holiday booking tool on a company intranet site... like any other normal company in the 21st century that makes use of those magical boxes we call computers. Generate a notification to the manager and he can then look at and click to approve or reject the request... everything audited and only takes a few seconds for both parties...
 
Some good advice here.

Look you did the right thing, you spoke with the companies assistant manager, you followed their instructions.

You were on holiday so you don't answer your phone if you are with family/etc.

State that you are disappointed that the AM has not supported you and clearly gave you the wrong advice instructions now claiming to have no recollection of your discussion. However, this is their reputation - not yours.

On reflection you recognise that you will need to follow the company guidelines so not to end up in the same position in the future.

If your personal tools/kit is going missing put it in writing as a separate matter. Take pictures of your kit and keep a record.
 
Pho said:
Assuming they do give you a warning then it sounds like time to start looking for a new job. Surely they should see that it was a genuine mistake given you wrote it in the book and didn't just skive off and pretend you were in.

Another mistake could turn into a formal warnings which is going to be far worse for your next employment.
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Nope. They cannot say anything about it. Absolutely nothing, or they face hearing for defamation to prove what they said is true. And that costs money and time.

They will just fill up the reference form, of holidays, when you start working and when you left and how many days you were sick. That's all.
 
The Running Man said:
As a manager i always answer my phone to work calls on.holiday - unless I'm in dubrovnik or something on the beach sans phone. But I'd call back?
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then you truly are a slave to it, and also have a belief in your own self importance, what makes you think the company you work for cannot survive for two weeks while you are not there?

my only exception to this rule is people who run their own business, even then I would expect them to hand over the reigns for a week or two, or if its a small business, shut it down for a fortnight, advising customers of this.
 
dowie said:
it is pretty backwards whatever it is... filling in paper forms for something every employee will be requesting several times a year... in 2016... why not just have some holiday booking tool on a company intranet site... like any other normal company in the 21st century that makes use of those magical boxes we call computers. Generate a notification to the manager and he can then look at and click to approve or reject the request... everything audited and only takes a few seconds for both parties...
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It's a common tactic among poor employers. If you make the process arduous enough, it dissuades employees from undertaking that process. I'd bet good money that in his company there are employees not using all of their annual leave entitlement each year.
 
Panos said:
Nope. They cannot say anything about it. Absolutely nothing, or they face hearing for defamation to prove what they said is true. And that costs money and time.

They will just fill up the reference form, of holidays, when you start working and when you left and how many days you were sick. That's all.
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Oh, I stand corrected. I thought another mistake could lead to a formal warning which they could mention (the formal warning) to new employees?
 
Panos said:
Nope. They cannot say anything about it. Absolutely nothing, or they face hearing for defamation to prove what they said is true. And that costs money and time.
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Not strictly true.

They are allowed to state provable facts.

If it's a fact that the OP has had a formal warning for conduct, then there is nothing wrong with them stating that the OP has had a formal warning for conduct.

Depending on the new company, that may be enough to put them off, regardless of the reasons behind that warning.
 
amigafan2003 said:
It's a common tactic among poor employers. If you make the process arduous enough, it dissuades employees from undertaking that process. I'd bet good money that in his company there are employees not using all of their annual leave entitlement each year.
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That is poor, we used to get e-mail updates reminding us to book leave if we had several days left and the end of the year approaching. We were only allowed to roll a few days into the next year with prior approval... or sometimes more where say a project has made taking leave difficult.
 
Haggisman said:
Not strictly true.

They are allowed to state provable facts.

If it's a fact that the OP has had a formal warning for conduct, then there is nothing wrong with them stating that the OP has had a formal warning for conduct.

Depending on the new company, that may be enough to put them off, regardless of the reasons behind that warning.
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Always good to negotiate your exit if you're unfortunate enough to be leaving on bad terms... negotiating a good reference is quite easily done in most cases in return for leaving with no fuss.
 
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