DLSS 5 preview

[Tinek]

I think you're conflating numerical precision with output quality.

No.

Four bits represent fewer values than eight but that doesn’t prove every model suffers a noticeable quality loss or that smaller models always suffer more.

It does. Especially that nvfp4 is a very specific format, quite a bit different than for example Q4 or Q8 or even FP8 quantization. Not a place to go into maths here. It has some advantages but it definitely is not "FP8 like quality but half the size and twice the performance" that Nvidia advertised it as - plenty of caveats with it and only very specific cases make it even close to that statement. And I'm sure Nvidia had spent months+ on tweaking it and testing both fp8 and nvfp4 quant and then released just fp8 one whilst claiming this is Blackwell only optimised. That tells me they run into issues but doesn't tell me what issues exactly.

I agree that NVFP4 in 1–2 months is speculation too. I don’t need a better guess to point out that neither explanation has been established.

The best part is that modders are already way way ahead of Nvidia with their releases, there's a new one almost every day. And the optimisations moders did she much smarter - like putting DLSS5 before upscaling, in the pipeline, which means performance is much better with very similar results.

 

[Ayahuasca]

No.

It does. Especially that nvfp4 is a very specific format, quite a bit different than for example Q4 or Q8 or even FP8 quantization. Not a place to go into maths here. It has some advantages but it definitely is not "FP8 like quality but half the size and twice the performance" that Nvidia advertised it as - plenty of caveats with it and only very specific cases make it even close to that statement. And I'm sure Nvidia had spent months+ on tweaking it and testing both fp8 and nvfp4 quant and then released just fp8 one whilst claiming this is Blackwell only optimised. That tells me they run into issues but doesn't tell me what issues exactly.

The best part is that modders are already way way ahead of Nvidia with their releases, there's a new one almost every day. And the optimisations moders did she much smarter - like putting DLSS5 before upscaling, in the pipeline, which means performance is much better with very similar results.

That doesn’t tell me what issues exactly is the point. Quality could be a reason, but you’re assuming they tested NVFP4 extensively and rejected it. Calling it just maths doesn’t establish that.

I’m not defending a guaranteed half-size, double-performance result either. Moving DLSS before upscaling reduces the resolution it processes but that’s a separate optimisation and tells us nothing about its tolerance for NVFP4.

 

[Tinek]

This stuff really does highlight how many people out there truly need to be put into a psychiatric hospital for very lengthy stays.

Or maybe slow down for a moment and think why people react so strongly to someone telling them their favourite art (as that's what games were supposed to be - artistic expression used for entertainment) isn't good enough and AI can make it better? Do you also plan to go to a museum and tell them the art there sucks and your filter can make it better? Amazing how self-centered people can be with "I'm right, everyone else is clearly insane".

 

[VincentHanna]

Or maybe slow down for a moment and think why people react so strongly to someone telling them their favourite art (as that's what games were supposed to be - artistic expression used for entertainment) isn't good enough and AI can make it better? Do you also plan to go to a museum and tell them the art there sucks and your filter can make it better? Amazing how self-centered people can be with "I'm right, everyone else is clearly insane".

That's clearly not what he did...

 

[Tinek]

That doesn’t tell me what issues exactly is the point. Quality could be a reason, but you’re assuming they tested NVFP4 extensively and rejected it. Calling it just maths doesn’t establish that.

That's correct. From experience (hence educated guess) small models suffer greatly with nvfp4 even comparing to simple Q4 (also 4 bits but maths is different), being often 20-30% worse in the output on every test I run them through myself, sometimes dropping below 3bit quality even. And my nvfp4 quants are tuned for every tensor group and usually beat most of other models out there quality wise (from my own tests). That's my experience.

I’m not defending a guaranteed half-size, double-performance result either. Moving DLSS before upscaling reduces the resolution it processes but that’s a separate optimisation and tells us nothing about its tolerance for NVFP4.

Oh that was just by the way, a thing I found fascinating that modders are already within just days further in optimizing and compatibility with... Everything, than multi billion company after months of work on it.

 

[Tinek]

That's clearly not what he did...

Yes, he clearly didn't say people should be put in asylum, nor is that so visible all over the internet now with regards to DLSS5 Vs other camp? We must be reading different post. Earlier in same topic people who don't like DLSS5 on their art were called psychopaths etc.

 

[VincentHanna]

He said that based on people sending him direct messages threatening him for posting an inane video, that they should be in an asylum.

Without seeing his Reddit post it would be hard to say for sure, but I can imagine - Plenty of nutters on the internet.

 

[Tinek]

He said that based on people sending him direct messages threatening him for posting an inane video, that they should be in an asylum.

And I said "think why people react so strongly to someone telling them (...)" - you know what emotional reaction is? That. Do I agree with it? No. Do I understand it - yes. People react like this since the dawn of our written history, none of this means they need to be locked up in asylum, it means "don't stick it in hornet's nest and expect not to be stung".

Without seeing his Reddit post it would be hard to say for sure, but I can imagine - Plenty of nutters on the internet.

FF14 is one of the kindest communities out there, usually super helpful and polite... till you tell them things like AI can make their fav art better. As witnessed.

 

[VincentHanna]

Did he tell them, or did he just post a video?

 

[Hotwired]

They do a lot of dressing up and roleplay. Hopping in with no foot in the community to say HOW ABOUT A NICE AI FILTER OVER IT ALL won't go down well.

 

[Dicehunter]

Or maybe slow down for a moment and think why people react so strongly to someone telling them their favourite art (as that's what games were supposed to be - artistic expression used for entertainment) isn't good enough and AI can make it better? Do you also plan to go to a museum and tell them the art there sucks and your filter can make it better? Amazing how self-centered people can be with "I'm right, everyone else is clearly insane".

Either this has hit a weirdly personal nerve for you or you simply don't understand it.

I posted a video saying and I quote "I think this looks kinda cool the way it picks out details" that is it, I did not tell anyone that it is better, I did not tell anyone they must agree with me, I did not tell anyone their art is not good enough, For some reason you have made up an entire narrative in your head.

Yes, he clearly didn't say people should be put in asylum, nor is that so visible all over the internet now with regards to DLSS5 Vs other camp? We must be reading different post. Earlier in same topic people who don't like DLSS5 on their art were called psychopaths etc.

No, This is just pure lies now on your part, You're literally making crap up, I never said if someone doesn't like DLSS5 they are psychos and need to be put into asylums, I said people were having mental health break downs threatening people with harm and death over a graphical option which is psychotic behaviour, That is something that warrants psychiatric intervention.

FF14 is one of the kindest communities out there, usually super helpful and polite... till you tell them things like AI can make their fav art better. As witnessed.

FF14 has a very passive aggressive community, I know as I experienced it over multiple years, Many others have experienced this too, And again I never said it made it better, I said I liked the way it picked out details, Nothing more was said, Stop adding things on that never happened, That is very dishonest behaviour and all of this was completely uncalled for on your part.

Did he tell them, or did he just post a video?

I posted a video saying "I think this looks kinda cool the way it picks out details"... that's it nothing else was said, But apparently that somehow in the twilight zone lala land translates into me demanding everyone must agree with me

 

[heatonpkmassive]

translates into me demanding everyone must agree with me

Agreed.

 

[cadmunkey]

Been watching quite a few Youtube videos over the last few days showcasing DLSS5 and there's been some great examples, and also some complete monstrosities Going to be very interesting to see where we go from here.

 

[Rroff]

Some people doing some interesting stuff with GTA5 with it - one guy has managed to get it working without the flicker, texture warping/pop-in issues, wavy faces, etc. and well balanced realism profile - but even with a 5090 it has frame rate issues which make it a bit nauseating and probably unplayable outside of showing it off.

 

[gamerTM21]

Been watching quite a few Youtube videos over the last few days showcasing DLSS5 and there's been some great examples, and also some complete monstrosities Going to be very interesting to see where we go from here.

Love the potential of remastering older games.

But got frustrated with it today and may wait for easier methods to apply it. Usually use RHI to inject the files and was working good yesterday on Shadow of The TR, but today I reinstalled NR for the updates and it just broke it.

Now I cant get away from 99% GPU usage (on a underclock) even if I drop the resolution down to 0.25.

Tried Optiscaler out and liked the results but couldn't get frame gen to load, so have given it a break for now.

 

[Dicehunter]

Love the potential of remastering older games.

But got frustrated with it today and may wait for easier methods to apply it. Usually use RHI to inject the files and was working good yesterday on Shadow of The TR, but today I reinstalled NR for the updates and it just broke it.

Now I cant get away from 99% GPU usage (on a underclock) even if I drop the resolution down to 0.25.

Tried Optiscaler out and liked the results but couldn't get frame gen to load, so have given it a break for now.

I reckon once Nvidia release their performance update in a couple of months like they said they will, The mods will get quite interesting.

 

[Purgatory]

NVIDIA keeps DLSS Multi Frame Gen locked to RTX 50, modders just got it working on RTX 30 with DLSS5 included - VideoCardz.com

1. Modders have adapted NVIDIA's DLSSG runtime for Ampere, enabling up to 4X Multi Frame Generation on RTX 30 GPUs. RTX 3080 users already report working results.

videocardz.com

Modern SLI? Modder runs DLSS 5 across two RTX 5060 Ti GPUs, with one dedicated to Neural Rendering - VideoCardz.com

A new ReShade add-on moves DLSS 5 Neural Rendering to a second GeForce GPU. Cyberpunk 2077 was demonstrated using two RTX 5060 Ti 16GB cards.

videocardz.com

So soon back to sli and crossfire setups just to run Nvidias new gimpwares. PhysX all over again..

 

[TimTamMan]

Nvidia would love that!

I was hoping for different players going into this market, if it eventuates. With big tech seemingly all trying to design own silicon you hope some of the people involved will split off to start their own

 

[Dicehunter]

I was hoping for different players going into this market, if it eventuates. With big tech seemingly all trying to design own silicon you hope some of the people involved will split off to start their own

While that would be good, The big players can simply buy up all fab time so smaller companies don't get a look in, Jensen is that spiteful and would do it simply to stop others.

 

[Purgatory]

While that would be good, The big players can simply buy up all fab time so smaller companies don't get a look in, Jensen is that spiteful and would do it simply to stop others.

He learned from the best Steve Jobs.. RIP.. I dislike talking about people that past this way, but Steve Jobs was very spiteful and mellowed out a little later in life, sadly when he was ill and a little late in my book as he had the potential to do so much good and mend bridges before he got ill.

I don't think Jensen will be remembered well in time. . Maybe one day he wakes up and realises before it's too late.

Greed is a serious illness and one thing you can't take with you is all the money when you are gone..