I always worry when I see somebody arguing against a simple solution and instead argue for something a lot more complex, which they're also unable to explain properly, or how it would succeed.
Does something need to be done about dogs?
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I always worry when I see somebody arguing against a simple solution and instead argue for something a lot more complex, which they're also unable to explain properly, or how it would succeed.
Soldato
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Simple solutions are usually short-term or too limited in scope to stop the actual problem, though, especially when addressing crime.
As a wise man has so reliably informed me, this is not a monocausal problem and certainly not a simple one.
Yes this is complex, but not complicated, and is being used in various walks of life to great effect. It's arguably the same principles that led to the status dogs becoming so popular in the first place, so seeking to reverse that through the same methods seems reasonable enough. Use against crime is still progressing although, as always, the government tends to take the short term approach to what is a long term engagement, and does not tend to publicise much on the matter.
As for explaining it - It's one of those things that I understand better than I can articulate, else I'd be teaching it or something, hence the links to the more scholarly articles.
Social engineering (political science) - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
Social marketing - Wikipedia
See - No magic, and no need for the simpleton's solution, either.
See we're back to the handwaving... you don't actually have an example, you just make vague gestures towards muh psychology and... boom, that's suddenly a magical solution to stopping people from buying a type of dog we could simply ban.
Why bother with speed limits when we could magically socially engineer everyone into being safe drivers?
This is what I've pointed out multiple times now, it's a handwaving argument and he doesn't seem to recognise that even after he's demonstrated again and again that he has no response to the accusation other than replying with more handwaving.
Soldato
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Fine, you win. Congratulations.
Soldato
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Well I didn't see that coming
Dog of peace
Bedworth: Woman dies after being attacked by dog
Two people are arrested after a woman in her 70s dies in a dog attack in Bedworth.
www.bbc.co.uk
Another all too delicious child
Thankfully still alive.
Thankfully still alive.
Soldato
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I had a nightmare about one last night. 
I read on another forum though, about a lady who described her neighbours' staffy dog, get sadly killed by one because it had stolen the nasty one's ball. So it must have been playing on my mind.
I read on another forum though, about a lady who described her neighbours' staffy dog, get sadly killed by one because it had stolen the nasty one's ball. So it must have been playing on my mind.
Dog of peace
Bedworth: Woman dies after being attacked by dog
Two people are arrested after a woman in her 70s dies in a dog attack in Bedworth.www.bbc.co.uk
Nice to see that banning whatever breed it was stopped such a tragic thing from happening. /s
What would a licence do to stop these clearly irresponsible owners of an already banned breed?
It needs to be the breeders that are targeted and prosecuted. They are dealing in breeds of death.
RIP.
Edit: caught up on recent posts. A large counter campaign (it's essentially all propoganda to sell a persona anyway) to the 'hard men with dogs' image to damage that presentation could be something that works. Would take a lot of skill to pull off, but also a high chance of messing it up and backfiring with demand going up.
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That's why you need enforcement to go with bans and licenses.
That's assuming the Police were ever made aware of this banned dog existing in the first place.
Just banning something doesn't make it go away.
Not breeding it in the first place does - needs to be done at source.
That's true, but with suitable enforcement bans become more effective.
Unlicenced dogs could be easily identified and confiscated upon being reported. If breeders need to be licenced + owners need to be licenced (and carry that licence) then a police officer spotting a dodgy-looking, possibly banned dog (or having one reported to them) can request the owner show their licence.
DailyMail tells me almost daily that Dogs are evil and should probably be banned, they murder someone every day
Cyclists also evil and probably should be burned at the stake.
How about ban dangerous breeds, require all dog owners to actually attend a course showing they can actually control their dog with orders.
All dogs should be on leads in public too... if you want to let your dog off the lead go to it in a fenced off area.
I'm sick of seeing dogs off leads in parks when the parks clearly have signs saying keep dogs on a lead.... also see them in fields near my house that have signs saying "keep dogs on leads around livestock" yet you see dogs running around the field and all the cows hiding in the corner for almost the whole day.
any shared cycling paths, dogs never on the leads.... I let them chase me for 2 miles and make sure I don't go fast enough to lose the dog... not my problem if you can't control your dog
Cyclists also evil and probably should be burned at the stake.
How about ban dangerous breeds, require all dog owners to actually attend a course showing they can actually control their dog with orders.
All dogs should be on leads in public too... if you want to let your dog off the lead go to it in a fenced off area.
I'm sick of seeing dogs off leads in parks when the parks clearly have signs saying keep dogs on a lead.... also see them in fields near my house that have signs saying "keep dogs on leads around livestock" yet you see dogs running around the field and all the cows hiding in the corner for almost the whole day.
any shared cycling paths, dogs never on the leads.... I let them chase me for 2 miles and make sure I don't go fast enough to lose the dog... not my problem if you can't control your dog
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So it relies heavily on reporting, which can be done already.
From the recent deaths, is there any evidence that authorities were made aware of a possibly dangerous dog?
I can't see it stopping anything.
Start with the clearly dangerous breeds, including crosses, being added to the dangerous dogs list. Ban imports of them so breeders can't start up business on them.
Breeders need to be licenced and checked on.
Once all that's done, then go after licencing every dog owner in the country.
Cows generally have killed more people than dogs in this country FFS.
Did initially wonder this:
^^^ Jono was also quite correct to question this in the end, it is rare it turns out there was a plot twist to the pack of dogs/dog walker story here:
www.thesun.co.uk
^^^ Jono was also quite correct to question this in the end, it is rare it turns out there was a plot twist to the pack of dogs/dog walker story here:
Woman mauled to death while walking pack of dogs was ‘killed by own Bully XL’
A WOMAN mauled to death while walking a pack of dogs is believed to have been killed by her own pet – an American Bully XL. Witnesses claimed the canines which Natasha Johnston, 28, was paid …
www.thesun.co.uk
Nope not reliant on that as I've just described. But also that can't easily be done already as we don't have licenses and some of these dangerous breeds are currently permissible.
I've never, ever seen a police officer when out with my dogs. It would rely on someone to report me if I didn't have a licence, same way as now. It changes nothing other than inconveniencing millions, another 'tax' and won't stop criminals.
My guys behave, if they don't I will get in trouble, they are my responsibility under the current law. They have to be microchipped with my details (by law), and when out in public have a collar with my details on (by law). What exactly will a licence add here to stop ******** owners not doing the above, or even just not bothering and chancing never being caught. There aren't ANPR cameras for dogs, and the police don't have resources to go around checking every dog walkers papers.
The dangerous breeds list needs updating, I totally agree. Then enforcement needs to be enacted or it's pointless. Breeders need to be the number one target prior to going after owners with new enforcement. I've seen some horrendous breeders and refused to take dogs from them and reported them anonymously.
Now I would understand your point if it wasn't just one type of dog/owner causing the uptick in attacks.