EBD ban.

The Q maps I will let you have. They have changed the rule on that. However, I have no issue with the fact the FIA have changed there own rules. I have issue with the fact the exception existed in the first place. However, this is not linked to EBD's at all. You could have no EBD and run an engine map that was so rich that any more than 5 laps and the car would blow up, and use it only in Qualifying.

The off throttle maps however, have been found to be illegal in relation to the current rules. They have deemed that the use of the engine to provide aero grip while off throttle falls foul of the ban on moveable aero grip regulations that are currently in place.
 
Todge said:
You mean your previous job title WASN'T "Head of Distribution" for the Milton Keynes branch of Red Bull?

So you've been at this for a while then? That sure helps explain why you are all so good at it lol.
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As i type this, i can see 3 people sat at their desks that i worked with at Lola in 1996, 2 that worked for Arrows and a couple who have previously worked for McLaren,Honda,Williams. F1 is like that though,people tend to always turn up working next to you again at some stage. So in answer to your question, yes quite a longtime.
 
CS||nuTs said:
As i type this, i can see 3 people sat at their desks that i worked with at Lola in 1996, 2 that worked for Arrows and a couple who have previously worked for McLaren,Honda,Williams. F1 is like that though,people tend to always turn up working next to you again at some stage. So in answer to your question, yes quite a longtime.
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On a different note. I get your initial trust messages and have tried emailing back with no luck. Also tried contacting you via trust.
 
Looking forward to this weekends Silverstone GP I'm still not sure how to read RB going in. We've had Horner Vettel and now Webber say they aren't fussed, its no biggie, we don't use hot blown anyway and then Newey say that the car has been designed with that exhaust since the beginning compared to everyone else bolting it on for the start of the season.
 
I can see where they are coming from. The 'sudden loss of grip when coming off throttle' problem is something teams found when trying to copy RBR's EBD, RBR never appeared to suffer it publicly. Whether this is because their exhaust is designed to work with out it, or they got it designed and working right from the start, I guess we will wait and see.
 
Skeeter said:
I can see where they are coming from. The 'sudden loss of grip when coming off throttle' problem is something teams found when trying to copy RBR's EBD, RBR never appeared to suffer it publicly. Whether this is because their exhaust is designed to work with out it, or they got it designed and working right from the start, I guess we will wait and see.
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My guess is that they discovered that problem (or knew it would be problem right away), so came up with a solution before using it to race?
 
Even if RBR do go backwards by about 2-3 tenths of a second per lap...will it really make any difference to the title race?

Put simply, Vettel is in stunning form. Some people are saying that it is the car which is doing all the work. I strongly disagree. You only have to look at the margin by which he has outperformed Webber. Even drivers who have the best car by far, would struggle to pick up 6 x wins and 2 x 2nd places, from 8 races. In his current form, in the same car even Hamilton/Alonso would struggle to beat him.

Vettel's form will dip later on in the season, however, the dip won't last forever...probably for about 3-4 races and then he will be back beating Webber by big margins, again.

The only chance we have of seeing a close championship fight is if RBR were banned for 3 races. Let Alonso and Hamilton finish in the top 2 in those races and then all of a sudden, we have a close fight for the WDC.

Of course, this doesnt mean that RBR can get complacent. They mustn't. The last thing they need is to have 2 x DNFs and then Ferrari or McLaren to mount the mother of all come-backs.

Statistically, I think Vettel now has it in the bag and as a result, the fizzle has gone out of this year's championship (even though we have Pirelli tyres and DRS).
 
Someone on this forum stated that Webber was giving Vettel a good run for his money last year as Webber could give the car a touch of throttle in corners that Vettel couldn't, due to no off throttle mapping last year?

So.. if this is/was the case, then surely Mark should be on for beating Mr Finger this weekend?
 
I can't believe that anybody is coming up with excuses for why Vettel is doing so well (compared with Webber and other drivers).

Vettel is driving out of his skin right now and I really don't think it would matter who his team-mate was right now. He is just in brilliant form.

I don't care much of a car advantage you have. If you have 6 wins and 2 second places in 8 races, I don't think any driver can complain. I remember when Mansell (1992) and Prost (1993) had cars with a massive advantage, even they didnt get 6 wins and 2 second places from the first 8 races. And IMO, Vettel's car advantage isn't as great as what we saw in 1992/3.

From memory, MSc (2004), is the only driver to have stronger results than what Vettel currently has.

For Webber fans: Webber will beat Vettel in a few races this year (when Vettel's form dips), but Vettel will be back on top by the end of the season (unless Vettel's dip in form comes in the final few races).
 
Come on Sunama, you know why he's doing well ;)

He's the team number one. Judging by the never ending list of problems that just so managed to happen to Webbers car at almost every race at the start of the Season, Seb had sod all in comparison!

Vettle also IMO isn't so easy to judge race craft wise. This year if your tyres are fresher than anyone on old tyres it's childs play to pass. Compare that to last year where you'd have a decent fight on your hands to see a pass.

For me he's driving in excellent form, I can't deny that. The team are doing an excellent job, but I just find the waters rather muddy when you try to judge how much of a driver he is when he aces the poll every race then vanishes off into the distance because there's nobody infront to slow him down.

How much better would the races be if It was Webber starting behind Vettel at every race? You'd have the two equal cars fighting it out constantly, but that just doesn't seem to happen.. I can't help but feel that Webber got his wings clipped somewhat after Istanbul 2010.
 
Bit of a whine from Newey tbh. And incorrect too. They haven't 'decided they are illegal from this race', they were deemed illegal (rightly so, if you look at the rules) 2 weeks before the Spanish GP, but because the rear end designs have been moulded around the exhaust the FIA have allowed the teams time to adjust their designs before implementing the ban.

Sounds a bit like a man building up a bank of excuses in preparation for questions around why his car is no longer the fastest. A situation which I cannot see happening, but its worth preparing for all the same.
 
TaKeN said:
Come on Sunama, you know why he's doing well ;)
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I believe that Vettel is beating his team-mate by one of the biggest margins of any driver (compared with his team-mate) so far this year. Vettel is giving Webber the same sort of hammering which Alonso is giving Massa.

If Alonso is ranked as the best driver in F1, then based on the statistics, Vettel is right up along side him (so far in 2011).

In some races, Webber has posted the fastest lap of the race. Why did he not show this pace in qualifying? Why did he not show this pace earlier in the race? He clearly had the fastest car under him.

The simple truth is that Webber (for whatever reason), isn't doing as good a job as Vettel.

Some people have even suggested that Vettel has had the best car and then just drives off into the distance. As some commentators have pointed out, in some of the races, Vettel has not had the fastest race car. But, what he does, is make the best possible use of his machinery. He is making winning (and getting pole), look easy. In truth, it is not. Only when a driver is at the absolute top of his form, can he make beating Alonso/Hamilton/et all, look so easy.

What is strange is that when Senna made winning look easy (in the best car), everybody hailed him as an F1 God. Yet, when Vettel does the same...he is not held in such high regard.

For me, so far this season, Vettel has been the best driver (only 14 points dropped from 8 races), with Button marginally ahead of Alonso and Hamilton.
 
Difference is senna, Alonso, Hamilton and others have proven they can haul a rubbish car up the grid.
Now Vettel has really impressed me this year and he is clearly a great driver. But until he gets a rubbish car but still drags it onto the podium then it's hard to say he's as well rounded as the others. The problem with this is, he needs such a car to prove that. So for the moment I'm going to sit on the side line.
 
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sunama said:
What is strange is that when Senna made winning look easy (in the best car), everybody hailed him as an F1 God. Yet, when Vettel does the same...he is not held in such high regard.
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I don't know what suddenly caused Webber to go from biting at Vettels ankles (2010 Season) to being the way he is now, I can only assume it's a combination of him struggling with the new Pirellis (as he's said himself many a time) and his lower status within the team.

RBR have the tactics of the Grand Prix mapped out perfectly, thrash everyone in qualifying and bolt from the pack to victory, for me It's impossible to judge whether a driver is any good from that.

It takes great skill to lead that car from the start to end, but with no-one else in your way it's a half arsed test, As Acid mentioned give Vettel a slower car (one that he hasn't gained P1 in for Qually!!) and lets see him boss his way through the field for victory. Then we can properly judge his talent
 
TaKeN said:
RBR have the tactics of the Grand Prix mapped out perfectly, thrash everyone in qualifying and bolt from the pack to victory, for me It's impossible to judge whether a driver is any good from that.
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That's the part that is not easy.

RBR don't have the fastest car in every GP, but Vettel almost makes it looks like that it is the case. In a few GPs, RBR have not been the fastest, but Vettel has rode his luck and driven to victory.

I agree that Vettel has had it a little easy, when he gets pole position, but that in itself is a skill, ie. to get pole position in almost every race.

Vettel is doing a fantastic job right now. He is putting his team-mate to shame, in exactly the same way that Alonso is doing. Alonso does it and people say that he is a fantastic driver; Vettel does it and people are coming up reasons as to why Vettel isn't the real deal.

Sorry guys, but there is no getting around it: anybody who can make winning look so easy, is actually a pretty damn good driver, who happens to be in top form - especially when they are up against Alonso and Hamilton, who (in some races), happen to be in faster cars.
 
Some times I wonder if you even read people's posts.

I think everyone has said hes a good driver.
Alonso has a lot more experience and we know how he handles all situations. Vettel we simply don't know.
The car is the fastest, especially in qauli mode by a huge amount. I fully believe they sacrifice race pace for qauli pace and then run hot and turn the engine down.
 
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