Energy Prices (Strictly NO referrals!)

n111ck said:
If a smart meter has stopped transmitting readings is there anything I can do to fix it?

Reported to Eon weeks ago but no update..
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I've been trying to get EDF out to see our smart meter since July...and I call every month.

Last lie they told me was they did an OTA update, oh right, you did an OTA update to a smart meter you can't connect to....riiigght.
 
From 16 points on the 12th dec, 136 points on 19 jan to 520 points on the 23rd, all over the place, but still something for just doing a click.

24th is still calculating.

1272 points £1.59 currently.
 
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How I managed to get 2448 points on 23rd jan is a mystery, considering that's more than three other energy saving sessions combined... I'll take it though. Nearly £8 over the last 6 sessions
 
If you shift usage into the -4h to -1h timeframe before the session, it helps pay you back more in the session.

Example: If session is 16:00 - 17:00, then using more electric between 12:00 - 15:00 and then LESS electric in the session 16:00 - 17:00 will boost your earnings.

The hour before the sessions seems to be a dead zone doesn't count for anything.

I don't know why they calc it this way as it's open to abuse.
 
HungryHippos said:
If you shift usage into the -4h to -1h timeframe before the session, it helps pay you back more in the session.

Example: If session is 16:00 - 17:00, then using more electric between 12:00 - 15:00 and then LESS electric in the session 16:00 - 17:00 will boost your earnings.

The hour before the sessions seems to be a dead zone doesn't count for anything.

I don't know why they calc it this way as it's open to abuse.
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Would have to ask National Grid as their silly system. Pretty much all my heavy daily load use is after 7.30pm and normally as late as 9.30pm so I am never in a window to load shift anyways and pretty much never use peak so to date I have earnt £0.61 over the seven sessions calculated so far and 1 session left to be calculated.

In total I have had 488pts from actual saving sessions and 600pts from the bonus of signing up. I will have 100pts from this next session they have not calced yet and then maybe some points for actual energy saved. So total is 1088pts = £1.36
 
CaptainRAVE said:
For £1 is not even worth my time signing up.
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This is the issue with the system, the savings are huge on a national level but the incentive is tiny on an individual one. I guess the question is how people are better incentivised to take part or, flipping it on its head, whether people are penalised for not taking part. Unfortunately it's proven repeatedly over time that the only way to change behaviour is by inconveniencing people.
 
Savings aren't huge ~ 300Mwh per session 1% of total ... and they could boot up a drax coal station at 600Mw if really needed
they need to explain how much headroom there really is if they turned everything up to 11, and the idea this could avoid blackout if gas store/generation was depleted needs to be explained
 
One More Solo said:
This is the issue with the system, the savings are huge on a national level but the incentive is tiny on an individual one. I guess the question is how people are better incentivised to take part or, flipping it on its head, whether people are penalised for not taking part. Unfortunately it's proven repeatedly over time that the only way to change behaviour is by inconveniencing people.
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Penalising is awful idea though. I am already only using between 1.3kWh to 3kWh a day depending if I am in or not. Why should I get penalised when I am already minimising the usage? How does that work for those with babies that need warmed milk or similar when they need it and thus might have to use the power during these penalised periods etc. What about those whom are heavy user due to home medical equipment that are already struggling.
 
Curlyriff said:
Penalising is awful idea though. I am already only using between 1.3kWh to 3kWh a day depending if I am in or not. Why should I get penalised when I am already minimising the usage? How does that work for those with babies that need warmed milk or similar when they need it and thus might have to use the power during these penalised periods etc. What about those whom are heavy user due to home medical equipment that are already struggling.
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You're using basically nothing so there isn't anything for you to really save on, these kinds of things will definitely benefit heavier users more, or those who can probably load shift.
 
HungryHippos said:
You're using basically nothing so there isn't anything for you to really save on, these kinds of things will definitely benefit heavier users more, or those who can probably load shift.
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Aye I have no problem. I wasn't expecting anything. I am just confused why someone would suggest the way to possibly go is to penalise people instead. How would it work. I just wanted to see some more thought about it. Such as if you went that way
  • Base daily usage allowance to be agreed 5kWh a day or something
  • Medical exemption for those that use medical equipment at home, be that a general blanket exemption or it needs further assement where medical equipment gets an allowance on top of daily
  • Those with children under 4yrs (preschool) get a higher daily allowance of say 10kWh
  • Work From Home have 10kWh allowance for days accordingly.
That sort of thing. But it huge amount of admin work and to make sure it is not abused so then is it worth the cost relative.
 
Curlyriff said:
Penalising is awful idea though. I am already only using between 1.3kWh to 3kWh a day depending if I am in or not. Why should I get penalised when I am already minimising the usage? How does that work for those with babies that need warmed milk or similar when they need it and thus might have to use the power during these penalised periods etc. What about those whom are heavy user due to home medical equipment that are already struggling.
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Your already getting penalised since the current system for most aggregates all the units costs and spreads them out.
So they VERY expensive generation brought online to support the peak your also paying for, and yet, you use very little of it.

Its why I think time of use tariffs will be the game changer we need rather than doing the opposite and trying to incentivise switching.
 
Curlyriff said:
Aye I have no problem. I wasn't expecting anything. I am just confused why someone would suggest the way to possibly go is to penalise people instead. How would it work. I just wanted to see some more thought about it. Such as if you went that way
  • Base daily usage allowance to be agreed 5kWh a day or something
  • Medical exemption for those that use medical equipment at home, be that a general blanket exemption or it needs further assement where medical equipment gets an allowance on top of daily
  • Those with children under 4yrs (preschool) get a higher daily allowance of say 10kWh
  • Work From Home have 10kWh allowance for days accordingly.
That sort of thing. But it huge amount of admin work and to make sure it is not abused so then is it worth the cost relative.
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Its really flawed.
Your making the assumption that the costs are similar to generate the electricity in the whole 24 hour period when thats very much not true
 
Mercenary Keyboard Warrior said:
Its really flawed.
Your making the assumption that the costs are similar to generate the electricity in the whole 24 hour period when thats very much not true
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No I am not. I am well aware of the different costs and time zones. But that is my point.

However as you noted above we are already penalised as it is aggragate cost over the total 24hr period. Now penalising being discussed was in terms of during these reduction aim periods those that do not manage to do so should be penalised thus something such as the charge for use of electric charged in that time period should cost more.

However if you are already using minimum at that time period why should my usage be penalised when it can't be load shifted as I have already done so in my daily life. How do you account for those that litereally can't load shift such as examples above with WFH, Children, medical requirements. Why should they be penalised for something that they have zero control over beyond the fact that unfortunatly the fairest system is to indeed aggragate the cost of production of power over a 24hr use.
 
Curlyriff said:
No I am not. I am well aware of the different costs and time zones. But that is my point.

However as you noted above we are already penalised as it is aggragate cost over the total 24hr period. Now penalising being discussed was in terms of during these reduction aim periods those that do not manage to do so should be penalised thus something such as the charge for use of electric charged in that time period should cost more.

However if you are already using minimum at that time period why should my usage be penalised when it can't be load shifted as I have already done so in my daily life. How do you account for those that litereally can't load shift such as examples above with WFH, Children, medical requirements. Why should they be penalised for something that they have zero control over beyond the fact that unfortunatly the fairest system is to indeed aggragate the cost of production of power over a 24hr use.
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I am saying your logic is flawed.
TBH its typical "lower user" logic.

I disagree with penalising, I am saying we should be moving to variable cost.
If the total cost of every unit consumed is less (it should be as it will encourage movement to lower cost periods) everyone in total will pay less.
The spikes will be lower and hence the additional very expensive loads will be lower or not used

Variable pricing would naturally punish those who didn't switch.

WFH, children, medical requirements, low income etc, the majority would or should see lower bills.
 
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