Energy Prices (Strictly NO referrals!)

[Stumble Bum]

Could you guys take a look at my bill please. I am with Sainsburys Energy on their SVR tariff and the unit prices they are charging me are confusing. I was under the impression that under the government cap we would be charged a maximum of 34p per kwh with a standing charge of 45p per day for electricity and 10.3p per kwh for gas with a standing charge of 27p per day. What Sainsburys seem to be doing is billing me for a higher rate and then redoing the figures for a lower rate and then subtracting that from the higher total. They won't explain where they get these rates from or why they aren't just applying the government capped rates. The only reply I got from them after waiting 18 days for one was "that's the way the industry has told us to do it"!! Surely this can't be right? In all the years I have been paying for energy this is the first time I have not been able to understand my bill.

I'm with Sainsbury's too, what's not to understand about the bill? They've given you their Standard variable rate, then they show you the government support. i.e 17p which gets taken off the bill and the difference is what you pay, for as long as the 17p subsidy is in place. I don't see another way that they should show it as I'm sure they're required to provide the breakdown.

I believe the reason the standing charge is a little higher is that the unit price is lower than it would need to be so it averages out within the cap.

 

[LabR@t]

I had a conversation with a lad from work who said energy won't be much more than 2.5k he was quite shocked when I told him that 2.5k a year is only the average house price

He thought I was joking when I said we could be looking at 8 to 10k next winter way energy prices keep rising

8-10k will never happen, the country would fall

 

[MatsyLR]

Could you guys take a look at my bill please. I am with Sainsburys Energy on their SVR tariff and the unit prices they are charging me are confusing. I was under the impression that under the government cap we would be charged a maximum of 34p per kwh with a standing charge of 45p per day for electricity and 10.3p per kwh for gas with a standing charge of 27p per day. What Sainsburys seem to be doing is billing me for a higher rate and then redoing the figures for a lower rate and then subtracting that from the higher total. They won't explain where they get these rates from or why they aren't just applying the government capped rates. The only reply I got from them after waiting 18 days for one was "that's the way the industry has told us to do it"!! Surely this can't be right? In all the years I have been paying for energy this is the first time I have not been able to understand my bill.

snip

They are doing it in an odd way but I'll break it down (I worked on the phones until recently not at Sainsbury's though)

For electric:

You used 193 KWH
Unit rate of 48.49p gets that to £93.59
Energy price gaurentee takes £32.81 of that taking your TRUE COST to £60.70

The gaurentee has a unit rate of of 17p applied to it taking your Electric UNIT cost down to 31.49p, which turns into 33.06p ish after VAT which is slightly below the capped rate.
Then you have your standing charge on top so £60.70 + £15.08 = £75.86 plus VAT at £3.79 = £79.57 (its never going to be to the penny correct when doing it manually)

For gas your unit rate after doing the same as above comes to 9.78p without VAT and 10.26p after VAT which runs in line also with the capped rate.
The standing charge for GAS is pretty spot on, the ELECTRIC one will be to ofset the unit rate for your electric being slightly lower than the cap.

They are doing it in a rather stupid manner but the figures are correct, I'm sure they do it on purpose to confuse people.
My Octopus bill is pretty spot on in terms of making the calculations clear.

 

[Curlyriff]

They are doing it in an odd way but I'll break it down (I worked on the phones until recently not at Sainsbury's though)

For electric:

You used 193 KWH
Unit rate of 48.49p gets that to £93.59
Energy price gaurentee takes £32.81 of that taking your TRUE COST to £60.70

The gaurentee has a unit rate of of 17p applied to it taking your Electric UNIT cost down to 31.49p, which turns into 33.06p ish after VAT which is slightly below the capped rate.
Then you have your standing charge on top so £60.70 + £15.08 = £75.86 plus VAT at £3.79 = £79.57 (its never going to be to the penny correct when doing it manually)

For gas your unit rate after doing the same as above comes to 9.78p without VAT and 10.26p after VAT which runs in line also with the capped rate.
The standing charge for GAS is pretty spot on, the ELECTRIC one will be to ofset the unit rate for your electric being slightly lower than the cap.

They are doing it in a rather stupid manner but the figures are correct, I'm sure they do it on purpose to confuse people.
My Octopus bill is pretty spot on in terms of making the calculations clear.

Octopus show it the same way on my bill. They show their rate less tge gov support.

So does Eon for my brother and SSE for my dad. Pretty sure it's 100% the legal requirement to show the breakdown as it is on the bill.

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[Nuttah]

Last night I came back home to a room temp of 5.6C, I honestly dont think my home has ever been that cold, it felt like I was standing outside in snow or something, walking through front door was a gust of cold air, it honestly felt like it was colder than outside. Hands painful and could feel on head, was concerned for my health the GCH was put on and has been on since, I figured since we about to get a boost of 10C outside so its just one day really. Plus if it was 12C outside tomorow and 5C inside, it would take a while for it to naturally heat up inside, better its already there.

So no data yet on the gas consumption, I will provide it tomorrow.
The radiator in my living room isnt fully up to temp, so that area isnt as warm, hallway has no radiator so also bit cooler, the bedroom hit 14.9C but now at 15.5C with PC on and will probably hit 16-17C, this is with boiler maxed out, no room thermostats, radiator maxed out. About 14-15 hours of boiler on.

--edit--

Kitchen is pretty warm, not measured temp but feels like how it should be with heating on, it has a double glazed window, the only one in my property.

That's low. I've not been able to use the CH over the past weeks (broken and needs replacement) and the lowest I hit was 7 degrees. The first 4-5 days of the cold snap were fine, but it's become uncomfortable over the past few days. Got a couple of portable heaters, but they've done little and rarely get a room anything over 12-13 degrees. My savior has been an electric throw. Hoping this warm front sticks around for a while and allows the house to retain some heat.

 

[chrcoluk]

Could you guys take a look at my bill please. I am with Sainsburys Energy on their SVR tariff and the unit prices they are charging me are confusing. I was under the impression that under the government cap we would be charged a maximum of 34p per kwh with a standing charge of 45p per day for electricity and 10.3p per kwh for gas with a standing charge of 27p per day. What Sainsburys seem to be doing is billing me for a higher rate and then redoing the figures for a lower rate and then subtracting that from the higher total. They won't explain where they get these rates from or why they aren't just applying the government capped rates. The only reply I got from them after waiting 18 days for one was "that's the way the industry has told us to do it"!! Surely this can't be right? In all the years I have been paying for energy this is the first time I have not been able to understand my bill.

They could have done the bill better.

They charging you an SVR of 48p, and then applying the discount after from the government, so you actually paying about 31p unit.

Same again on gas, you paying around EPG rates on gas after the discount.

 

[chrcoluk]

That's low. I've not been able to use the CH over the past weeks (broken and needs replacement) and the lowest I hit was 7 degrees. The first 4-5 days of the cold snap were fine, but it's become uncomfortable over the past few days. Got a couple of portable heaters, but they've done little and rarely get a room anything over 12-13 degrees. My savior has been an electric throw. Hoping this warm front sticks around for a while and allows the house to retain some heat.

Yeah once I thought my health is at risk, I just turned it on, right now I am actually too hot though, it started suddenly rising much quicker about 4 hours ago, and before I realised room hit 21C, this is way too hot, heating off again. I should be good for a while now I think the warmer weather has made it here now.

Hope things improve for you, maybe try an electric blanket? they cheap and will help your body feel much warmer.

 

[stuman]

so our house has been set at 21 degrees for the duration and we are averaging £6 a day including 2 showers.

This is a 100sqm 3 bed detached house.

Something to be said for a new build - they’re cheap to run!

Edit to add: wet underfloor heating so flow temperature set at 40degrees

 

[squerble]

so our house has been set at 21 degrees for the duration and we are averaging £6 a day including 2 showers.

This is a 100sqm 3 bed detached house.

Something to be said for a new build - they’re cheap to run!

You must have better insulation than ours slightly less cost for 19ºC, for same usage and house size/type.

 

[rumple9]

Just got my bill in, not as bad as I expected. £125 for the last 35 days upto yesterday (so longer than a month because I changed my payment date). £93 electric + £32 gas, less £67 from the government so £58 for the month.

I was surprised at how much I had reduced my energy usage compared to the same period last year (elec reduced from 9kwh to 6kwh per day, gas reduced from 22kwh to 6kwh per day). If I stopped gaming on an evening I could reduce my elec usage much further!

 

[stuman]

Just got my bill in, not as bad as I expected. £125 for the last 35 days upto yesterday (so longer than a month because I changed my payment date). £93 electric + £32 gas, less £67 from the government so £58 for the month.

I was surprised at how much I had reduced my energy usage compared to the same period last year (elec reduced from 9kwh to 6kwh per day, gas reduced from 22kwh to 6kwh per day). If I stopped gaming on an evening I could reduce my elec usage much further!

Wow that’s good going!

Is it a middle flat?

I’m pretty sure there’s a video out there on making an efficient gaming pc (undervolting helps!)

 

[Haggisman]

I was surprised at how much I had reduced my energy usage compared to the same period last year (elec reduced from 9kwh to 6kwh per day, gas reduced from 22kwh to 6kwh per day). If I stopped gaming on an evening I could reduce my elec usage much further!

Obviously depends on your GPU, but I don't think PC gaming makes that much difference. My active usage increases by ~200w when I fire up a game (RX 6800), so that's ~7p for an hour. 2 hours every day for a month would be a total of ~£4.20. I know every little helps, but if that £4.20 is the difference between being able to afford it or not then it's probably worth looking for bigger cost savings elsewhere!

 

[chrcoluk]

My baseline electric seems considerably higher, which is something I need to investigate (I used 6.2 kWh, with just fridge, 3 lights, and network equipment on).

But I now have the measurements for 24 hour gas. I have seen people post gas graphs that show high usage for first 1 or 2 hours followed by very low levels to just "top up", mine looks considerably different, so you know whats coming.

No room thermostats, 3 radiators.

I posting from phone app so its in kWh not m3. Cost approx £14.50 for the day. But would have been about 1/3 that for 8 hours. The highlighted amount is 30 mins not 1 hour. Bear that in mind if looking at per hour costs.

The good news is today with heating off all day, temp only bottomed out at 16.1C, so I am way away now from needing "any" kind of heating at least for a couple of days I guess.

 

[squerble]

My baseline electric seems considerably higher, which is something I need to investigate (I used 6.2 kWh, with just fridge, 3 lights, and network equipment on).

Unless you're powering network gear for half of your town, you have not used 6.2kWh on just those things. That's very wrong, something else must be on.

 

[Mercenary Keyboard Warrior]

heating water pumps use a reasonable amount, especially if old and knackered

 

[chrcoluk]

Unless you're powering network gear for half of your town, you have not used 6.2kWh on just those things. That's very wrong, something else must be on.

Hence the investigation.

Had a smart cam on for security I just remembered, 2 smart plugs on their off switch but still using their own power, new things purchased like electric blanket off but still plugged in.

Its nothing big though that was turned on. Also the 6.2 kwh included after I came back, so its higher than expected but not for just the idle usage, sorry I didnt mention that, it was a passing comment, the main thrust of my post was the gas central heating consumption.

I do have power consumption figures for my network gear though, and its higher than some might think. I think everything combined from the figures I noted is easily over 70w now, as the hub 5 from virgin media doesnt seem to have energy saving its a bit of a guzzler.

 

[pastymuncher]

They are doing it in an odd way but I'll break it down (I worked on the phones until recently not at Sainsbury's though)

For electric:

You used 193 KWH
Unit rate of 48.49p gets that to £93.59
Energy price gaurentee takes £32.81 of that taking your TRUE COST to £60.70

The gaurentee has a unit rate of of 17p applied to it taking your Electric UNIT cost down to 31.49p, which turns into 33.06p ish after VAT which is slightly below the capped rate.
Then you have your standing charge on top so £60.70 + £15.08 = £75.86 plus VAT at £3.79 = £79.57 (its never going to be to the penny correct when doing it manually)

For gas your unit rate after doing the same as above comes to 9.78p without VAT and 10.26p after VAT which runs in line also with the capped rate.
The standing charge for GAS is pretty spot on, the ELECTRIC one will be to ofset the unit rate for your electric being slightly lower than the cap.

They are doing it in a rather stupid manner but the figures are correct, I'm sure they do it on purpose to confuse people.
My Octopus bill is pretty spot on in terms of making the calculations clear.

Thank you kind sir. Why couldn't the person who finally replied to me from Sainsbury's Energy just explain that instead of a stroppy one liner "that's the way the industry body has told us to do it" with no ex[lanation. Customer service has really gone downhill since Covid!!

 

[LabR@t]

Heating switched off again, £10 day better off

 

[Broken Hope]

We're still on an older fixed tariff so only 17p per unit electric and 3p per unit gas, using around £3-£4 a day in total, tariffs runs out 1st of February.

 

[MatsyLR]

Thank you kind sir. Why couldn't the person who finally replied to me from Sainsbury's Energy just explain that instead of a stroppy one liner "that's the way the industry body has told us to do it" with no ex[lanation. Customer service has really gone downhill since Covid!!

Its easy to be jaded by customers calling, specially nowdays. Agent's shouldn't be taking it out on customers but it happens....could also be a newbie (as they are recruiting like mad at the momen and the agent just didn't know what to say)
I know where I worked they don't tell you how to work out a bill manually anymore in training, your just assumed to know how. Reading a bill is skimmed over quickly and your expected to pick it up on the floor.

I left at the point where the phones where kicking off due the cost of living and the winter approaching. People I still speak with who are still there are not having a good time, just constant complaining easy to see how stressed they are.