Euro 2012 Qualifiers 7/8/11 October ** Spoilers**

I don't think you can compare the red cards from the games though, Rodwell's dismissal had a much bigger impact, it made the game easier for Liverpool for a very long time.

England were really very poor, I thought they did "alright" at times in the first half, but meh on the whole.

I'm sick to death of England and the manager / squad.

I need a new international side :p

Yet despite being poor they led while it was 11v11. As above, none of us know what might have been but it's common sense that sending off made the end of the match considerably harder than it needed to be.

As for Capello/ the England side as a whole; I read earlier that of the last 8 England managers Capello's got the 2nd best record with an average of 2.27 points per game, just behind Sven who averaged 2.29 points per game. The other 6 (english) managers records were a fair way behind theirs.
 
You think it would suit someone like Cleverly or Wilshire who like to play in that space?
His absence should help anyone that likes to play anywhere from the halfway line in to the oppositions box, especially players like Lampard and Gerard who naturally play in the space Rooney drops in to.
 
In fact I remember being very critical of Mascherano for getting sent off at OT a few seasons ago, despite the fact that I didn't think he deserved to be sent off (based on what others had and would be let off for).

If it was the game he got sent off in the first half for backchat he definitely had himself to blame, he'd been booked already, told to keep quier, and then just wouldn't give it up, constantly badgering the ref (including what looked like swearing iirc). In some ways worse than Rooney tonight IMO, Rooney had a red mist moment, literally half a second of lashing out, then he realised he'd made a mistake. With Mascherano it was much more drawn out, then even after he'd been sent off he carried on acting like a ****. Talk about letting your team down.
 
Yet despite being poor they led while it was 11v11. As above, none of us know what might have been but it's common sense that sending off made the end of the match considerably harder than it needed to be.

As for Capello/ the England side as a whole; I read earlier that of the last 8 England managers Capello's got the 2nd best record with an average of 2.27 points per game, just behind Sven who averaged 2.29 points per game. The other 6 (english) managers records were a fair way behind theirs.

I'm aware of his record and it's annoying :p

I dislike his team selections and his player selections, I dislike his style of football too.

England got in to the lead easily, their performances dropped off after half time (ish) Rooney getting sent off was because he was stupid, however the defending for the second goal was poor, nobody closed the cross down. The defending and team looked very poor before Rooneys card imho.

I liked Sven, but his insistence on playing Lampard and Gerrard and messing about with players out of positions annoyed me.

His absence should help anyone that likes to play anywhere from the halfway line in to the oppositions box, especially players like Lampard and Gerard who naturally play in the space Rooney drops in to.

How would you line up your midfield out of interest?

Would you put someone like Cleverly in along side Gerrard or Lampard and then play a holding midfielder? Would you still stick with four four two?
 
There's a difference in my eyes between giving a player some "stick" and hanging images of him around the ground. How many of those on this forum who critisise a player do you think actually take things that far?
 
I'm aware of his record and it's annoying :p

I dislike his team selections and his player selections, I dislike his style of football too.

England got in to the lead easily, their performances dropped off after half time (ish) Rooney getting sent off was because he was stupid, however the defending for the second goal was poor, nobody closed the cross down. The defending and team looked very poor before Rooneys card imho.

I liked Sven, but his insistence on playing Lampard and Gerrard and messing about with players out of positions annoyed me.

Like I initially said, the general performance of the side can't be blamed on Rooney but it's not unreasonable (or trolling) to blame him for the outcome. Not that I'm agreeing with it.

On Sven: Playing players out of position? Other than the left side of midfield (where we had no natural player), I can't recall Sven asking players to play out of position. And the Gerrard/Lampard debate was mainly media driven bs. It wasn't an ideal pairing but it was far and away the best pairing we had.
 
Did he not farm Gerrard on to the right? Left?

Did he not bring in players like Andy Johnson to name one (others have escaped me) and play him on the left.

I've also said for many years Downing should be played on the left :p
 
Tummy if you think I am being harsh on him, wait till you read the back of the papers today.

We should be talking about the Euro's, talking about the team but now its about Rooney and how many long of a ban will he get.
 
of the last 8 England managers Capello's got the 2nd best record with an average of 2.27 points per game, just behind Sven who averaged 2.29 points per game. The other 6 (english) managers records were a fair way behind theirs.

Golden generation mate, you knows it :)
Steve Mclaren must have just been unlucky.
 
Did he not farm Gerrard on to the right? Left?

Did he not bring in players like Andy Johnson to name one (others have escaped me) and play him on the left.

I've also said for many years Downing should be played on the left :p

Gerrard played RM for a time under McClaren and LM at times with Capello but was always CM under Sven.

Like I said, the only position where players played out of position was LM and that was because (at the time) there was no natural LM around. Other than that, Sven generally played players in their correct positions.
 
Gerrard played RM for a time under McClaren and LM at times with Capello but was always CM under Sven.

Like I said, the only position where players played out of position was LM and that was because (at the time) there was no natural LM around. Other than that, Sven generally played players in their correct positions.

Except for the fact that either Gerrard, or more usually Lampard dropped back to play the more defensive midfield role, of which neither played that role for their club, and was one of the key failings of the time. Yeah, they both played in the middle but its a VERY different role.

Parker isn't exactly the single best passer, or tackler, or footballer ever, but he's been a MASSIVE improvement in defensive midfield for England since he started playing, a HUGE difference. Infact since England started playing, a real defensive midfielder and playing Lampard as a real attacking midfielder, Lampard has looked hugely better, and England "had" looked hugely better. We've since reverted, stuck Barry back in, defence has been injury hit and Wilshire has been missing.


The main other thing Sven had us doing during his time was, being diving cheats, we became a team where EVERY attacking player(which with Lampard playing deep rarely if ever included him) diving like crazy to get Beckham freekicks, that was our entire gameplan, with no plan B, dive, freekick, dive freekick.

Sven sucked balls, tactically inept, and generally retarded while wasting the single most consistant attacking central midfielder and scorer, as a defensive midfielder.

Capello sucks, its not about points, internationals are set up so that you have to be flat out retarded to not get into the late knock out stages of a tournament if you are one of the top leagues in the world. England and first knock out stage is the VERY LEAST we should achieve, thats how bad McClown was.

Capello has us playing generally not very good football, when the "in" players aren't available his team selection is woeful. Young should have been the first name on the team sheet for four years, yet again he's been involved in every goal scored, his record in either getting the assist or scoring since when he was finally started around xmas last year is phenomenal, he's been by a distance Englands best player.

Wilshire was excellent, Parker has been mostly excellent, yet when one or both is out, we drop back to Barry who has been consistantly absolutely crap for England for the best part of 10 years. Jesus Christ, Walcott ffs, anyone, and I mean anyone who picks Walcott as a first team player, in any position at any level is just stupid.
 
I'm trying to work out how teams can qualify. So there's 16 places in the tournament, 2 have gone to Poland and Ukraine, 9 automatic spots for the top teams of the mini leagues so Germany, Italy, Holland, England and Spain are in there. That means there are 4 more automatic spots available. Now there are only 5 places left as 11 are taken so how they get those 5 as there are 9 teams who came 2nd in their group?
 
I'm trying to work out how teams can qualify. So there's 16 places in the tournament, 2 have gone to Poland and Ukraine, 9 automatic spots for the top teams of the mini leagues so Germany, Italy, Holland, England and Spain are in there. That means there are 4 more automatic spots available. Now there are only 5 places left as 11 are taken so how they get those 5 as there are 9 teams who came 2nd in their group?

Like this:

2 - Hosts Poland and Ukraine
9 - Group winners
1 - The second-placed team with the highest number of points from matches
4 - The eight remaining second-placed teams will take part in two-legged play-offs to decide the four remaining qualifiers.
 
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