EV general discussion

[tonys]

The comment was buy a repaired or refurbished one. I don’t see a refurbished one ?

Have you asked about shipping and fitting yet ?

Not really sustainable either. Rely on a crashed car to replace a broken battery with a second hand one with unknown history

You can take the same risk with a secondhand engine. Again no real difference between them

 

[tonys]

Not really. More that some people seem to think that EVs have solved inherent ICE issues and then come out with stuff like 'all you need to do to get the range and performance back to how it was when it was new is fit a new battery'.

That isn't a Haynes one spanner level of job, nor is it a cheap one. It's at least on par with replacing an engine in an ICE car. What do you think that does to it's performance and economy?

It isn't yet, as EV battery technology is compared to ICE relatively new. Get the design right and it can become proper plug and play at a reasonable cost. No getting yourself worked up about it

 

[Jonnycoupe]

You can take the same risk with a secondhand engine. Again no real difference between them

Yep and most garages turn away work to fit them for that reason.

You do realise just how big and heavy a battery is don’t you?

 

[tonys]

Yep and most garages turn away work to fit them for that reason.

You do realise just how big and heavy a battery is don’t you?

The same as an engine?

 

[adam cool dude]

Not really. More that some people seem to think that EVs have solved inherent ICE issues and then come out with stuff like 'all you need to do to get the range and performance back to how it was when it was new is fit a new battery'.

That isn't a Haynes one spanner level of job, nor is it a cheap one. It's at least on par with replacing an engine in an ICE car. What do you think that does to it's performance and economy?

I disagree. Removing an engine is quite a feat whereas in the future I am sure batteries will be a piece of pie to swap out. From what I have seen with the model S is that it just drops out of the bottom. No different to removing a fuel tank just bigger really!

 

[adam cool dude]

The same as an engine?

Try multiplying that by 4!

 

[tonys]

Try multiplying that by 4!

Ok, just a little bit heavier.
Depending on how it's placed I assume easier to remove than an ICE engine?

 

[OspreyO]

Ok, just a little bit heavier.
Depending on how it's placed I assume easier to remove than an ICE engine?

Have you removed an engine?

 

[tonys]

Have you removed an engine?

No, why is that relevant?

 

[OspreyO]

No, why is that relevant?

You're making statements of fact without knowing the facts.

It's not trivial to remove an engine or a battery. Engine is more difficult. But then cost comes into it.

 

[OspreyO]

Love how this thread really doubles down on outliers to make a sweeping generalisation. Which makes no sense because they are outliers.

 

[tonys]

You're making statements of fact without knowing the facts.

It's not trivial to remove an engine or a battery. Engine is more difficult. But then cost comes into it.

My brother in law was a mechanic so yes I do have an idea on what it takes to remove an engine on older vehicles, not the newer ones true, but that's why you pay for it to be done. Batteries again I don't know but just assume they are not completely built in to make it near impossible to remove. There are people who will spend and spend just to keep their car on the road but can't afford to buy new and all the scenario's in-between.

 

[JonRGV250]

It's not trivial to remove an engine or a battery. Engine is more difficult. But then cost comes into it.

Yes, the engine is, but the battery is a piece of cake.

 

[tonys]

Love how this thread really doubles down on outliers to make a sweeping generalisation. Which makes no sense because they are outliers.

Yes, especially if they can see the bigger picture

 

[jpaul]

better equivalence - suspect the man hours of the ice engine removal&diagnosis won't be dissimilar to those associated with repair on an ev's invertor .

Todays media discourse on slowed ev uptake, Hyundai boss apparently saying price parity ice&ev's will be 2030, suggesting man-hours in ev production process not significantly less than ice,
what's in the bom's.

 

[bigmike20vt]

whilst price parity at purchase would be nice and I look forward to it, personally I save around £1500 a year in fuel. For me that is part of the equation as well.

 

[Jonnycoupe]

The same as an engine?

No where near. 500kg and 1m by 1m. Serious kit to lift a car and lower the battery.

 

[tonys]

No where near. 500kg and 1m by 1m. Serious kit to lift a car and lower the battery.

Compared to dismantling half the engine bay with probably specialist tools and an engine hoist?

 

[OspreyO]

Yes, the engine is, but the battery is a piece of cake.

If you're just replacing the battery. More likely you're replacing modules and thats a bit of work. Even the Tesla's is a lot of labour to get the adhesive off and put it back on. That's before you get into diagnostics of what's wrong with the battery. BMS or whatever.

For sure not like doing an engine but it's not nothing either.

That said it's vastly more common to be swapping an engine than a battery. But I've never had to do engine swap in decades of driving. But a battery swap will be far rarer.

But even regular modern stuff like a EGF or DPF was a tonne of work as they made them virtually inaccessible on some cars.

 

[Jonnycoupe]

Compared to dismantling half the engine bay with probably specialist tools and an engine hoist?

Piece of cake. Could do it on my drive.

Let’s be honest through, what do I know about putting engines in cars and then batteries in electric vehicles with awareness of the service requirement and design for manufacture….

Oh yes probably the only person on this forum who does it. I don’t know why I continue to entertain the comedy Google mechanics when they have a great opportunity to learn but instead make out I’m the idiot?