EV general discussion

Tinders said:
Toyota have been talking about solid state batteries for an absolute age, still no sign of it actually being developed and used outside of labs.
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A Motorbike company has just announced a bike with Solid State batteries, unfortunately until it ends up in the hands of actual reviewers it's still very much pie in the sky I think.

gearjunkie.com

You Can Finally Buy an EV With a Solid-State Battery: It’s a Motorcycle

Big range and extremely quick charging are the promises of the new solid-state battery tech in the Verge Motorcycles TS.
gearjunkie.com gearjunkie.com

thepack.news

Donut Lab unveils world’s first production-ready solid-state battery at CES – thepack.news

thepack.news thepack.news
 
Assuming we're talking about the Donut SSBs, I think they've been launched in some motorcycles now, so it definitely appears to be a step forward and out of the realms of mythology :p

Edit - as per the post above from @Armageus that's beaten me to it!
 
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Given how much ‘regular’ lithium ion has evolved since solid state was first hyped up, I’m not sure they’ll be the ‘revolution’ they are hyped up to be.

Back when they were first being touted as the next big thing we had 1C NMC/NCA packs shipping in cars.

Now with have 5C LFP with significantly higher densities than those old 1C packs. It’s not like NMC/NCA has stood still either and the densities on those are higher again.
 
b0rn2sk8 said:
Given how much ‘regular’ lithium ion has evolved since solid state was first hyped up, I’m not sure they’ll be the ‘revolution’ they are hyped up to be.

Back when they were first being touted as the next big thing we had 1C NMC/NCA packs shipping in cars.

Now with have 5C LFP with significantly higher densities than those old 1C packs. It’s not like NMC/NCA has stood still either and the densities on those are higher again.
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It still appears to be a good step (seems they can fit a 30kWh pack in the same footprint as the older 20kWh pack) but not the sort of "we'll get a million miles range from a 100 gram battery" revolution many are probably expecting :p
 
In the -5 weather the other day, range was down to 150m (77kw battery). But I was only doing short trips that day. Did a run up to manchester the other day and got 230miles, so not too bad
 
MrRockliffe said:
@Armageus this video appears to be click bait but it’s actually a very well put-together high-level investigation on said batteries.
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Still doesn't really tell us anything other than it's *maybe* some sort of Finish Capacitor tech, but given the claims and lack of detail regarding actual chemistry it may as well be magic pixie dust
 
Armageus said:
Still doesn't really tell us anything other than it's *maybe* some sort of Finish Capacitor tech, but given the claims and lack of detail regarding actual chemistry it may as well be magic pixie dust
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No absolutely, hence why I mentioned it was a high-level investigation

Certainly gave more info that I’ve been able to find elsewhere, but I think that’s the most you’ll get given the company have offered little to no info, which is suspicious in of itself.
 
turbot1984 said:
140 miles my worsty in the really cold stuff (i4 90% charge -3c).
BMW claim 355 miles, cheeky, very cheeky.
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To be fair, having just looked at my last trip last night taking the daughter to swimming training, i averaged 1.7mi/kwh for the 7 mile journey, heated everything on for us both and a little spirited driving (to make sure i was satisfied with the handling of my heavy EV of course......) probably contributed to that on top of the cold weather! :D
 
Rroff said:
I'm a little wary replying to this as I can't be sure how much my experience translates to the specific model in question, but I'd say chassis compliance and performance was not a problem, steering/handling is decent, but when threading through bends on an open road the braking and throttle response just wasn't satisfying - something which can probably be tweaked somewhat in software but I think part of the lack of engagement is the missing sensation from an engine (which would be a wider criticism) when you get back on the power coming through or out of a bend - and personally simulated noise and transmission effects do nothing for me there. I really like the styling of the Polestar 2 - I find the style of so many new vehicles especially EVs hateful but externally in grey I think it looks great and the interior mostly works for me aside I'm not a big fan of the Volvo style big vertical screen and too many controls placed into the infotainment system rather than physical buttons which is a shame as otherwise it is decently driver focussed.

On the other hand I've seen videos of people pushing the Ioniq 5n which look a lot of fun but without experiencing it myself I can't say how the engagement would work for me.
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Appreciate the reply. One thing I've really praised in the P2 was the regen/braking crossover but unsure whether this is due to the massive gold brembo calipers or calibration they have on my particular model. I found BMW to be the worst for this, especially the iX1. Agree on the throttle response, it's a very exponential map which makes the urgency when pressing on a little lacklustre. There is no sport mode in the car from what I can see so it's the same whether I'm pootling or pressing on. Guessing they want to keep the Swedish simplicity.

The interior is showing its age now and one of my biggest gripes is the lack of OLED display for your speedo. Really poor almost TN panel in there where blacks are grey. I'll get this snapdragon update done some time also dependant on cost to replace the atom IHU. I've realised with a lot of automation that I never need to touch the centre console anyway so the lack of buttons becomes a moot point for me. When I am in a VAG vehicle however...it can be really troublesome!

I was also looking at a 5n at this time but range was too low and I was thinking the very smart mimicry of a ICE car would grow old. I have a Gixxer 1000 and other car in storage for that hooliganism!
 
kefkef said:
(to make sure i was satisfied with the handling of my heavy EV of course......)
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Ok ... loud and clear :-)
This chap got caught out in his Volvo EX90 .... never go to your local shops with less than 50% charge! ;-)
images-16.jpg
 
turbot1984 said:
140 miles my worsty in the really cold stuff (i4 90% charge -3c).
BMW claim 355 miles, cheeky, very cheeky.
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It's so annoying! I purchased the P2 because of the claimed 351 miles WLTP but charging to max for the first time with the dash set to dynamic and showing 200 miles was very concerning...I've now set to Standard and ignorance is bliss. Looking forward to the summer range...
 
Armageus said:
Still doesn't really tell us anything other than it's *maybe* some sort of Finish Capacitor tech, but given the claims and lack of detail regarding actual chemistry it may as well be magic pixie dust
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I watched this on the train on the way to work this morning, and it's got Theranos written all over it. I suspect many investors are about to learn the hard way what due diligence is.
 
Logsi said:
It's so annoying! I purchased the P2 because of the claimed 351 miles WLTP but charging to max for the first time with the dash set to dynamic and showing 200 miles was very concerning...I've now set to Standard and ignorance is bliss. Looking forward to the summer range...
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Yeah it’s all nonsense. I had a SMLR P2 and summer was 250 and winter 220 on average.

My EQC is even worse now :D
 
It’s the same with ICE MPG claims being about 25% - 30% way over reality. The problem with EVs is the difference between “best case scenario” and reality is so much more noticeable.

MPH claims of 55 mpg, real life 40 mph is barely noticeable when you still get 600 miles to a full tank.

Claiming 350 WLTP but getting 300, or even just 220 in winter is so much more noticeable. Then you factor in the fact these numbers are only if you charge to 100%, but they recommend only charging to 80%.

They don’t help themselves do they?
 
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I’m not sure why you’d only charge to 80% if you needed greater than 80% of range on a given day though so that point isn’t exactly relevant.

I’m also sure I’d notice the difference between 40mpg and 55mpg.

Everyone just ignores the 55 MPG number because it’s not real world and most cars don’t actually get 600 miles to a tank either. Hardly any do these days given how few are diesel and there are almost as many EVs out there now as diesels.

Some PHEVs have tiny fuel tanks and not dissimilar ranges to an EV, yes I know you can refuel it quicker.

At the end of the day, the WLTP is set by regulators, they could change it.
 
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ICDP said:
It’s the same with ICE MPG claims being about 25% - 30% way over reality. The problem with EVs is the difference between “best case scenario” and reality is so much more noticeable.

MPH claims of 55 mpg, real life 40 mph is barely noticeable when you still get 600 miles to a full tank.

Claiming 350 WLTP but getting 300, or even just 220 in winter is so much more noticeable. Then you factor in the fact these numbers are only if you charge to 100%, but they recommend only charging to 80%.

They don’t help themselves do they?
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Here we go .. ..
I drove up to Oban in my 535D Touring during winter, it hit -11c ... loved every minute of it :-)
 
I can see why that would seem to be the only valid metric, but for many people it doesn’t always matter how far you are driving in one trip, but how long you get before having to charge again for daily use.

A lot of the EV owning people I know tend to charge to 100% in winter because of their range anxiety seeing 150 - 160 miles of range at 80%.
 
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