F1 2011 season news / pre-season updates

Status
Not open for further replies.
sunama said:
If we don't have this "false and artificial" method, would you rather have processional racing?

I would much rather have the movable rear wing, for more exciting racing and the possibility of making more mistakes.

For me, the movable rear wing has increased the excitement, going into the first GP of the season.
Click to expand...

I would prefer the FIA to put their money into developing a package that promotes overtaking through driver skill and not at the press of a button. In addition, I wish they would test these things out before implementing it. The FIA talk of cost cutting, but they cause so much unnecessary spending for the teams.
 
I think a lot of people have the wrong impression about KERS and the new rear wing device. It is not as simple as simply pressing a button to overtake.

I would argue that to overtake with so many different buttons to press (in 2011), it requires a greater level of skill than at any time in F1.

Where previously, you could follow the car in front closely...wait for a mistake and "feel" the car, dealing with any twitches or sliding, in 2011, you have a car which:

is ridiculously twitchy and easy to spin off with,
is nigh on impossible to follow the car in front, closely
requires the driver to work harder than ever (ie, with all the different settings)

There have been many reports of drivers stating that the work load inside the cockpit is now at its highest ever. Even in the link above by Davidson, he comments about the work load and the possible implications. To say that a driver merely has to press a button to overtake, IMO is completely wrong.
 
arknor said:
overtaking will look just as boring as if you were overtaking a backmarker..
Click to expand...

I'm not sure how you can say this when nobody on the face of this planet, as yet, has seen an F1 car, overtaking another, with the assistance of the rear wing device.

Alonso commented earlier this year, that the movable rear wing will help overtaking, but overtaking a car in front will still be nigh on impossible, unless you have a significant speed advantage.

I think we should just wait for the first race to happen, before making any judgements.

I do not believe that a competitive overtake in 2011, is going to be as easy as overtaking a backmarker.
 
Question? If a car passes another in the rear wing zone shall we call it, if the pass is made, within the zone, with, say another 200ft of ''zone left'' can the car who has just been passed, activate his wing to try and take it back straight away? Or does he need to wait until the next zone as it where...?

If that is the case, you could potentially see situations where the guy who is about to be passed, knows he will be passed, backs off a bit, so he has enough time to attempt a fight back before the corner. Which again could exagerate the effect. I'm not suggesting a full lift off of the throtle, but easing a bit, to maximise his amount of time in the pound seat. My understaind is kers is more of an acceleration aid rather than top speed, and I believe the drivers have free reign on Kers? Could imagen, the radio message:

He's 1.5 seconds behind, store kers (or some sort of code that words it to that effect)

He's activated the rear wing,

Pass,

Overtaken driver activates his own wing/Kers (with Kers being built up on the run up to the over taking zome) and takes place back immedietly. Other driver in theroy would already of used his KERS to catch the driver infront, so the lift off may end up being a tactical ploy.



God this could get awful messy and confusing. Does anyone understand what I just asked? lol!
 
Last edited:
This rear wing is only going to help at high speeds though really isn't it? It's going to be of sod all use diving up the inside of someone into a turn which is what the majority of overtakes are, very rarely do you see a car just power past someone on a straight, so we see a small increase in that sort of behaviour but I can't see it doing much to change 'normal overtaking' as it's under braking and you're usually wanting all the downforce you can get.
 
sunama said:
I'm not sure how you can say this when nobody on the face of this planet, as yet, has seen an F1 car, overtaking another, with the assistance of the rear wing device.

Alonso commented earlier this year, that the movable rear wing will help overtaking, but overtaking a car in front will still be nigh on impossible, unless you have a significant speed advantage.

I think we should just wait for the first race to happen, before making any judgements.

I do not believe that a competitive overtake in 2011, is going to be as easy as overtaking a backmarker.
Click to expand...

well its pretty obvious 99% of overtaking will be in a straight line , no following closely in corners , no squirming all over the back of a gearbox.

f1 is all about aero and fake boost buttons when it needs to be more about fat wide tyres with tons of grip and wide cars which also offers grip and stability in corners, i'd lower and make the rear wing wider like back in the late 90s to
 
Surely though, if you make the rear wing wider and give more mechanical grip, you are going to increase cornering speeds and overall lap times will tumble. This is the sort of thing that the FIA have been trying to prevent since Senna's death (ie. trying to slow cars down).

My belief is that we should completely remove the front and rear wings and increase the width of the tyres. Once we know the effect this has on aerodynamic downforce, we can go from there.

The KERS button is the only boost button which has been tested so far and from what I remember, only Hamilton was able to extract anything out of it. Off the top of my head I can't think of anybody else who actually used that button as an overtaking weapon.

In summary, I can't see how anybody could say that overtaking is going to be too easy, given that we have just finished a season where overtaking on a dry track was nigh on impossible.
 
sunama said:
In summary, I can't see how anybody could say that overtaking is going to be too easy, given that we have just finished a season where overtaking on a dry track was nigh on impossible.
Click to expand...

Because you will be getting an extra 70BHP from the rear wing, that's a huge advantage. Of course it depends where they put the timing line but if you have a car with great aero grip out the box they will have a massive advantage as they can run less wing and really fly when they use the button.

Not only that but you will see multiple Kers failures per race for a while. Overtaking will be very easy against a non kers car when you can use the wing as well.

The only reason you didn't see much Kers overtaking last time is because the Kers cars where not fast enough against the Brawn and Red Bull. Even when they tried to use Kers to pass the cars could usually cover it.

I really hate the idea of the wing, Kers I don't have an issue with. It could be better but atleast you all have the same amount of time to use it. The rear wing, where you can use it but the car infront can't stinks of manufacturered racing. It's like saying when a football team gets to the penalty spot the goal keeper has to sit down.

No moves will be great anymore, because if you have a system to go faster and the car infront can't use his system well it hardly makes for the pass of legends.
 
Last edited:
Like I said, there is a lot of doom mongering, before we have even seen this device in action. I think we should hold fire until at least the first GP of the season.
I do not believe that the movable rear wing is going to make overtaking as easy as some people on here are stating.

We don't even know the precise position that the movable rear wing can be activated yet. I believe that this will be different for each track Drivers can't engage the wing whenever they want to ... there are strict rules as to when the wing can be engaged.
 
sunama said:
Like I said, there is a lot of doom mongering, before we have even seen this device in action. I think we should hold fire until at least the first GP of the season.
I do not believe that the movable rear wing is going to make overtaking as easy as some people on here are stating.

We don't even know the precise position that the movable rear wing can be activated yet. I believe that this will be different for each track Drivers can't engage the wing whenever they want to ... there are strict rules as to when the wing can be engaged.
Click to expand...

well its not going to be in a corner is it :p

we saw last year how easy the fduct made it against cars without an Fduct its going to be the same thing but with added kers, no one will bother trying to overtake in a corner anymore because theres no point when you can have risk free idiot proof overtaking on a straight
 
If memory serves me correctly, at the start of the season, McLaren were the only team to have the F-Duct. The only driver it helped (with regards to overtaking), was Hamilton. Button wasn't able to use it in quite the same way.

Even though the McLaren was the only car to have this device, they still were not able to win races, on merit, on a dry track. That win came in the middle of the season, after all the rival teams had developed F-Ducts of their own.

Moreover, the F-Duct was not quite the God-send that many people thought it would be. No other team/driver was able to make the F-Duct work in the same way that Hamilton used it (and that includes Button, who rarely overtook anybody in 2010).

In 2009, once again, nobody apart from Hamilton was able to make the KERS device work in a way which allowed them to overtake cars.

What I would suggest is that it is not the device itself which is allowing the overtake, but Hamilton.

Hamilton is arguably the most aggressive driver F1 has seen in a very long time. He is also the best overtaker in business, by quite a big margin. I would hypothesise that although KERS, F-Duct (and soon to be movable rear wing) are going to assist in overtaking, it won't be as easy as you state. Most drivers won't be able to overtake easily (as is the norm in F1), even with the rear wing device...Hamilton on the other hand (just like he did in 2009 and 2010), probably will.
 
lol with the BS every time you come out with this fanboy hamilton was the only one able to use kers , only one able to use fduct , only one able to use everything..

getting old now , never known such a massive fanboy in all my life
 
I would be very interested to hear of examples of some other drivers using KERS or the F-Duct to carry out overtakes. I notice that you haven't given any...

Jenson Button in 2010 would be a good start. McLaren was the only car to have the F-Duct in the opening few GPs. Who did he overtake during these opening GPs, using the all-powerful F-Duct, as you professed, in your previous post?

Here is an intersting article by Brundle. It was after the first few GPs of the 2010 season.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/8655252.stm

It is also interesting that of the 39 competitive overtakes from the two McLarens, 32 of them were achieved by Hamilton, a couple of them on Button himself.
Click to expand...

There isn't any need for me to say any more on this. When it comes to overtaking...Hamilton is by far and away the best in the business, even when it means overtaking his own (World Champion) team-mate.
 
Last edited:
OMG you guys (eyes dj22 and sunama) still slinging it out in the offseason :p

Apparently Planet F1 reported that Bernies book claims Alonso asked Mclaren to sabotage his car... go check it out :)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom