F1 2013 - The begining of the end

might as well just convert a dyson, what has happened to the world, there's no passion anymore, no excitement, no risk and no emotion, just money....

I feel sorry for you young guys, you will never experience the passion of the fight, just a load of corporate droans.... yawn yawn yawn.

Do they think a load of tree huggers are going to suddenly start watching F1, are they mad!!!
 
I don't see how this will be any less exciting. The lap times will be similar? I don't understand how a 2.4 v8 (or 3.0 v12) is any more exciting than a 1.4 i4 turbo with KERS. In fact I'd suggest the new system will be more exciting.
 
That's the thing, it can't get any less exciting. Cars are too dependant on aero, the big engines are just for the exotic factor, what would you rather hear being completely wrung out a 4 cylinder or a 12 cylinder?

Personaly I think they should go back to manual shift as well, add driver error into equation again. They have ditched T/C now do the same with semi auto shift.
 
I don't see how this will be any less exciting. The lap times will be similar? I don't understand how a 2.4 v8 (or 3.0 v12) is any more exciting than a 1.4 i4 turbo with KERS. In fact I'd suggest the new system will be more exciting.

But the noise! The noise of 18,000rpm engines is something unique to F1! Its epic. Without it the whole live experience is diluted.

That's the thing, it can't get any less exciting. Cars are too dependant on aero, the big engines are just for the exotic factor, what would you rather hear being completely wrung out a 4 cylinder or a 12 cylinder?

Personaly I think they should go back to manual shift as well, add driver error into equation again. They have ditched T/C now do the same with semi auto shift.

Asleast they got rid of that preselected downshift stuff they had a few years back where they selected "4 downshifts" and then just jumped on the brake and the gearbox did it for them.
 
That's the thing, it can't get any less exciting. Cars are too dependant on aero, the big engines are just for the exotic factor, what would you rather hear being completely wrung out a 4 cylinder or a 12 cylinder?

Personaly I think they should go back to manual shift as well, add driver error into equation again. They have ditched T/C now do the same with semi auto shift.

Semi-auto is part of the cost cutting though. All teams have them, so no advantage is gained and it is very difficult to miss shift or over rev and hence blow an engine.
 
Semi-auto is part of the cost cutting though. All teams have them, so no advantage is gained and it is very difficult to miss shift or over rev and hence blow an engine.

Sod cost cutting. I would like (and I assume the majority of F1 viewers) a mildly safer version of this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dWLhhTto00&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rH1jNf_Hw0&feature=related
or
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SK6RZdb-Ooo&feature=related
Perhaps not this, testes of granite.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KqZBJCFS_Ng
 

You have not lived untill you have heard that, at that track! And you have only 2 years left to do it.

My appeal against 12,000rpm engines, in 27 seconds.
 
You have not lived untill you have heard that, at that track! And you have only 2 years left to do it.
Even the current V8's sound crap compared to the V12's of the past.

I remember when they went from V10 to V8 there were a few cars that ran rev limited V10's and even of TV you could hear the difference with the V10 sounding much better.

The pinnacle of motorsport running a hybrid 1.6L engines, they might as well just use a Prius as a base chassis :mad:
 
The pinnacle of motorsport running a hybrid 1.6L engines, they might as well just use a Prius as a base chassis :mad:

The pinnacle of motorsport should be pushing the technology, pushing the R&D. That absolutely does not mean large capacity NA engines. That technology is decades old, is heavy and inefficient. If that's what you like, great, but maybe you should be watching some form of historic racing. F1 is moving forward, another decade or two we might even see an all-electric top flight series. The R&D going into KERS etc is what will deliver that future.

Everyone loves the sight and sound of a Spitfire, everyone also recognises it as a bit of history. Same will be true of large capacity NA engines.
 
The pinnacle of motorsport should be pushing the technology, pushing the R&D. That absolutely does not mean large capacity NA engines. That technology is decades old, is heavy and inefficient. If that's what you like, great, but maybe you should be watching some form of historic racing. F1 is moving forward, another decade or two we might even see an all-electric top flight series. The R&D going into KERS etc is what will deliver that future.
Fair point, but I still would have liked to see a bit bigger engine than what is used in a Focus or Golf, 600bhp for the ultimate racing series, that's a joke.

Why not use 2 liter engines and aim for 1000bhp and if safety is an issue make the monocoque bigger so it can handle harder impacts (or get the drivers to wear high visibility jackets with a hardhat, lol)
 
Everyone loves the sight and sound of a Spitfire, everyone also recognises it as a bit of history. Same will be true of large capacity NA engines.

I can understand what you are saying but these old engines would blow these new Eco hippy engines into the weeds, we are talking 1300bhp from a 1.5 4pot in 1986 how can you say a 1.6 4pot developing 600bhp is progress? Sure it may consume less fuel and not ruin the atmosphere as much but who cares? If I want to get excited about mpg I will watch 24hr races.

1300bhp can be done in 1984 the it damn sure can be done today more reliably, efficently and cheaply.
 
I love F1, and try to remain positive as I am a big fan. I have seen many changes over the years but this one I have to say, I can only see as a negative thing. F1 is not just about providing competitive racing to the fans (although that is part of it and they have done a good job on breaking away from the Ferrari dominance culture years where one team strides ahead a bit too much). It's also about teams competing in terms of Technology. F1 has always been about the cutting edge tech and historically should really be about how fast someone can design and race a car around a track. It's a difficult balance to providing entertainment vs Manufacturer competitivity with technological developments.

The problem with the introduction of more and more rules, is that eventually it becomes too bland. There is nowhere left to go. The sport seems to chop and change as it feels like with rules, so companies are not attracted to F1 in fear of their R&D on project X going out the window due to rule changes and a constant moving target. That's why the grid may still stay "small" at 20 or so cars. F1 back in the day used to have nearer 50 cars competing on track it seemed like.

We all accept change to improve the sport, but it used to be exciting and all about new changes to make the cars go faster, but now we have so much standardisation, it feels more like they are trying to make all the cars the same performance wise, to make it more exciting. This works in some series of racing, but not in F1. Give the manufacturers some variable to work with. They have Aerodynamics and that's about it. This is a bad thing. Aero developments only hurt the sport spectating wise, as the dirty air factor becomes even more apparent and the cars rely to heavily on aero for grip.

I would like to see the encouragement of more mechanical grip, and frankly LESS rules generally. It should be more about providing a brief, a problem if you will, and then the manufacturers can solve it with suitable constraints to make the cars similar enough, but to be able to have the freedom to create and to innovate.

Ideal world would be: Make a car with these dimensions and the engine must not output more than XXXc02 levels.

Instead we have: You are making your car engines in this way because we need to cut emissions.

If it's all about being green, there are so many other areas they could save the planet in terms of haulage and transport between events.

The history of big N/A screamers belongs in F1. I could let go if only they would give them the freedom to make something better. Why can't the cars go faster? Why slow them down year upon year? This is F1, not a walk in the park. It's meant to be dangerous. It's meant to be the fastest possible.
 
Interesting little nugget of info Re. 2013 season regs on twitter this morning:

@ScarbsF1 said:
In researching the 2011 regs, I've found that the plan is to ban high noses in 2013, with the nose tip limited to something like ~12cm high
That sounds about the levels they were in 94/95?

Are the FIA finally starting to cotton on to reducing underfloor aero is the way forward for better racing?
 
I expect that if today's teams were given as much freedom as was allowed in the 70s and 80s the field would spread out too much. The smart designers with large budgets would build cars several seconds a lap better than the lesser teams. Surely that's not what we want? I like it that half the grid are within half a second of each other.
 
I can understand what you are saying but these old engines would blow these new Eco hippy engines into the weeds, we are talking 1300bhp from a 1.5 4pot in 1986 how can you say a 1.6 4pot developing 600bhp is progress? Sure it may consume less fuel and not ruin the atmosphere as much but who cares? If I want to get excited about mpg I will watch 24hr races.

1300bhp can be done in 1984 the it damn sure can be done today more reliably, efficently and cheaply.

But it doesn't look good to sponsors. If sponsors wont play then we cant watch races.

In addition the FIA have been trying to stop cars getting too fast for years. If the regs vanished we'd have amazing cars but almost certainly more deaths. Needless to say it's something no one really wants to see.

Also wern't those engines only used for like one race?

Despite all of the outcry and the whinging, F1 will remain the top level of motorsport. It will be home to the best drivers and the latest innovation and that it what it is all about. No doubt similar regulations will follow for lesser series soon and its only natural.

I just wish they had focussed more on dirty air than engines for the new rules.
 
So completely unrestrict the engines and kers etc, but give a fuel limit for the race...

Yeah, I'd agree. Except for the cost angle. The sport can't afford for one or two rich teams to develop an awesome package and ruin the competition as most won't be able to keep up the development pace.
 
Back
Top Bottom