Farage

treacle · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:22

https://mtc.cdn.vine.co/r/videos/02...p4?versionId=jqEX3a4dAu3vPFufSYFdA57Lg92aopdE

Judgeneo · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:23

Skidder said:
Does the name Farage sound a bit foreign to anyone else?

Does sound a wee bit French. In a paxman interview years back this was brought up, and he claimed its just an accent thing, and you should pronounce it in the same way you would pronounce garage. Which would suggest he's not foreign, just a dirty southerner

RaohNS · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:23

gettothechopper said:
Turkey will never join the EU while Cyprus is unresolved
Its been 42 years so far - no sign of anything changing

Also Erdogan worming back to Putin straight after the referendum result shows you Turkey being less optimistic about getting into Europe

I wouldn't be too sure on that front either. Cyprus shmyprus will be the EUs response

Greebo · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:25

Six6siX said:
I can't see how you can draw that conclusion to be honest. It's a completely different scenario to what might have been should the UK have stayed in the EU given our stance on Turkey.

Our stance on Turkey is that we were the ones leading and pushing for Turkey to join quicker and the EU were dragging their heels. Now the UK has gone, I suspect Turkey will never join with our backing gone.

In fact Boris was the biggest instigator and pusher of the EU to take Turkey.

RaohNS · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:26

Washout said:
As you say, they will lose a lot of money. However in giving the middle finger what position will this country be? However bad it'd be for Europe it'd be far worse for the UK.

That would be under the assumption we wouldn't have other deals in place. I cannot see the EU risking up to 100,000 jobs across its two largest and richest members.

Greebo · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:27

Skidder said:
Does the name Farage sound a bit foreign to anyone else?

Six6siX · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:28

Greebo said:
Our stance on Turkey is that we were the ones leading and pushing for Turkey to join quicker and the EU were dragging their heels. Now the UK has gone, I suspect Turkey will never join with our backing gone.

In fact Boris was the biggest instigator and pusher of the EU to take Turkey.

Could be true also. I'm just suggesting that we'll never know how two completely independent scenarios will play out so evidence of the event occurring (or not) in one case can't be used to prove that it would or would not occur in the other scenario.

Greebo · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:28

Avenged7Fold said:
Cant believe Nigel had the gall to say the MEPs never had a proper job when many are accomplished and well established figures in the previous fields. As far as i am concerned, he is the one that neglected his job by rarely turning up to eu parliament and trying to be disruptive as possible by opposing eu decisions for the sake of causing friction.

Perhaps if he had turned up for more than 40% of the votes then there might not have been things invoked by the EU which we werent happy about in the UK??

But that wouldnt have done his cause any good though?

RaohNS · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:30

Six6siX said:
Not at all. I'm saying is that the Turkey situation with the UK as part of the EU is different to a post Brexit EU. So actually I'm agreeing with you on that - the situation is different now so priorities are different.

What I don't agree with is this:

because Turkey joining the EU post Brexit is of no relevance to the message the Remain campaign because it's a completely different situation.

It has always been the goal of having Turkey to join regardless. It will now just be shifted up a gear. Glad we agree or at least are in the same book.

But remain were touting that Turkey would be joining in the year 3000. Absolutely not true.

As I am sure you are aware the EU have accepted several members who have not met criteria for joining.

Six6siX · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:30

Greebo said:
Perhaps if he had turned up for more than 40% of the votes then there might not have been things invoked by the EU which we werent happy about in the UK??

But that wouldnt have done his cause any good though?

This is my thinking. It always confused me as to why we had an anti-EU MEP

RaohNS · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:32

Greebo said:
Perhaps if he had turned up for more than 40% of the votes then there might not have been things invoked by the EU which we werent happy about in the UK??

But that wouldnt have done his cause any good though?

Perhaps he recognises the futility of the UK's vote? 72 proposals and 72 dismissals.

Its like some parliamentarians not showing up to vote in the HoC. You only get two options, if you disagree with both what would be the point in throwing your weight into the ring?

I would rather the expenses saved in such an instance.

Washout · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:33

RaohNS said:
That would be under the assumption we wouldn't have other deals in place. I cannot see the EU risking up to 100,000 jobs across its two largest and richest members.

Bottom line is we're not going to be bargaining from a position of strength. We're playing poker and they can see our cards. We can see theirs too but they've got a better hand and we've gone all in regardless.

Greebo · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:34

RaohNS said:
It has always been the goal of having Turkey to join regardless. It will now just be shifted up a gear. Glad we agree or at least are in the same book.

But remain were touting that Turkey would be joining in the year 3000. Absolutely not true.

As I am sure you are aware the EU have accepted several members who have not met criteria for joining.

And again until Turkey gives up Cyprus, they would never get support from the 28 countries in the EU. Somebody would use their veto.

There is the human rights issue as well. SOme countries may have joined without fulfilling at 35 points but the main ones which Turkey won't are can't commit to are the biggest ones and would never be allowed.

There is more chance that the EU gives the UK full free access with no freedom of labour movement at all then there is the EU accepting Turkey in its current state.

Also with the UK leaving, Turkey would be a massive net gainer from the EU coffers and already the other states will have to dip into their pockets massively to replace the UK's payment so the member stats wont want another country requiring lots of money.

Avenged7Fold · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:36

RaohNS said:
Perhaps he recognises the futility of the UK's vote? 72 proposals and 72 dismissals.

Rather he wanted to make the UK's vote more futile by rarely turning up and when he did turn up, he aimed to make the UK's vote seem futile, regardless of the topic or subject. Looks like he caught you pretty easily.

Six6siX · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:37

RaohNS said:
It has always been the goal of having Turkey to join regardless. It will now just be shifted up a gear. Glad we agree or at least are in the same book.

But remain were touting that Turkey would be joining in the year 3000. Absolutely not true.

As I am sure you are aware the EU have accepted several members who have not met criteria for joining.

Exaggeration for sure. But I think the point was that it wouldn't happen for a long time. Or at least that's the message that was being put across.

Shock as campaigns lie or bend the truth to suit an agenda!

RaohNS · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:38

Washout said:
Bottom line is we're not going to be bargaining from a position of strength. We're playing poker and they can see our cards. We can see theirs too but they've got a better hand and we've gone all in regardless.

I see it as us having each other over the same barrel.

We will be open for business from the world.

I would like to see trade deals coming in from the commonwealth and wider eg BRICS. We know two of those should be easy to negotiate

ron3003 · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:38

Skidder said:
Does the name Farage sound a bit foreign to anyone else?

Dunno.
Does the name Skidder sound like someone who's ******** their pants to anyone else?

RaohNS · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:39

Avenged7Fold said:
Rather he wanted to make the UK's vote more futile by rarely turning up and when he did turn up, he aimed to make the UK's vote seem futile, regardless of the topic or subject. Looks like he caught you pretty easily.

Nope. Because my original statement of 72 losses out of 72 shows that.

Avenged7Fold · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:40

I dont think you understand that you have been landed...

RaohNS · 1 Jul 2016 at 11:41

Greebo said:
And again until Turkey gives up Cyprus, they would never get support from the 28 countries in the EU. Somebody would use their veto.

There is the human rights issue as well. SOme countries may have joined without fulfilling at 35 points but the main ones which Turkey won't are can't commit to are the biggest ones and would never be allowed.

There is more chance that the EU gives the UK full free access with no freedom of labour movement at all then there is the EU accepting Turkey in its current state.

Also with the UK leaving, Turkey would be a massive net gainer from the EU coffers and already the other states will have to dip into their pockets massively to replace the UK's payment so the member stats wont want another country requiring lots of money.

I agree with most of your post but the niggle is still the fact that Turkey has better odds of joining. It has a cheap economy (a massive black economy) and a young population.

Six6siX said:
Exaggeration for sure. But I think the point was that it wouldn't happen for a long time. Or at least that's the message that was being put across.

Shock as campaigns lie or bend the truth to suit an agenda!

True enough