Feel like I'm missing out on some low end *Solved with XXLS400*

I've got my BK Sub and trying to set it up, is the wholr point of the crossover that the sub does the frequencies the speakers can't habdle and the speakers simply don't try to play the frequencies below the crossover?
 
Correct. But be aware crossover is not a brick wall there will be some interaction and overlapping between the two.

As for setting up depends on your Denon . If it's set to 120hz that means have two crossovers in path so you may want.to use left and right outputs and filter the full range signal.
 
That's what I thiguht but I played 110hz flat , and crossover at 120, the wharfedales still playing 110hz, same with 50HZ.

Then again this is the crossover on the sub, the speakers won't know what the sub is doing, I can't manually set the crossover on the Denon.
 
Does the denon have a HPF? Setting the HPF should filter any frequencies away from the speakers and towards the subwoofers RCA/LFE output on the amp.

If not, connect the subwoofer using the high level lead to the speaker outputs and set the crossover to around 80Hz on the subwoofer. The speakers will still play as low as they can go, but the subwoofer will reinforce any frequencies lower than that of the crossover. It'll take some time to get right.
 
I'm using high oevel now, but on the low level nowt was happening with the crossover. My amp is Denon CEOL Piccolo Dra-n5
 
Bk doesn't have high pass filter.

Since sub out is filtered I'd use stereo outputs that way full range signal and put it around wherever your main speakers naturally roll off or a bit lower due to room gain.

Will take a while to get crossover and volume right.

Dead easy in AV system but not stereo
 
willhub said:
That's what I thiguht but I played 110hz flat , and crossover at 120, the wharfedales still playing 110hz, same with 50HZ.

Then again this is the crossover on the sub, the speakers won't know what the sub is doing, I can't manually set the crossover on the Denon.
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Should a normal as amp just stop when a crossover is set? I.e. mines at 80, below that should the speakers not produce anything? Sorry for the thread hijack but I figured its related.
 
theone8181 said:
Should a normal as amp just stop when a crossover is set? I.e. mines at 80, below that should the speakers not produce anything? Sorry for the thread hijack but I figured its related.
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If you have avr and set AV crossover to 80hz then everything below 80hz from all channels will.be redirected to the subwoofer, and then the lfe channel is added to that signal.

Crossovers aren't a brick wall though. So there is a slope on sub and speakers.

Also apparently if you don't set subwoofer to 120hz if you set to say 80hz then 80hz to 120hz is discarded not redirected to other speakers.
 
I think I probably need a new amp for a proper crossover, and for now ill make do using the neutrik cable.

I've got the sub in the best spot I can, not brilliant, both corners have doors in apart from the ones near the neighbors apt hence not placing speakers on that wall.

I've had to direct the sub sidewards firing towardd the forber, and made sure the door is closed, this doesn't look the best but in this flat I think it's the best compromise. I'll keep trying to fiddle with the crossover for the sub at least and I guess illI need a better amp.

Probably not wanting to get too hung up about it as amp wise I should get something solid and long lasting probably with Dolby Atmos but not for a while.
 
willhub said:
I think I probably need a new amp for a proper crossover, and for now ill make do using the neutrik cable.

I've got the sub in the best spot I can, not brilliant, both corners have doors in apart from the ones near the neighbors apt hence not placing speakers on that wall.

I've had to direct the sub sidewards firing towardd the forber, and made sure the door is closed, this doesn't look the best but in this flat I think it's the best compromise. I'll keep trying to fiddle with the crossover for the sub at least and I guess illI need a better amp.

Probably not wanting to get too hung up about it as amp wise I should get something solid and long lasting probably with Dolby Atmos but not for a while.
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Apart from weedy power on the Denon wouldn't worry about your amp concerning the sub. I use a sub in a hifi I send it full range and then use subs own crossover.

Since the Denon sub out is filtered and then you'll use the subs one as well, this is bad as have two crossovers in the path, so just use the stereo outputs like I'm doing. I use low level but you can use high level.


Another method is high pass but that involves a different sub or a dedicated high pass unit is outlaw ICBM-1 as requires pre level outputs on your amp, and ideally power amplifiers to loop back from pre to outlaw into power amp then onto speakers and sub.

That way filters out low stuff from speakers so frees up amp power increasing dynamic range . Basically same as avr bass management buy in analogue domain.
 
Not worth it for yourself as needs lots of new gear however for myself either had it already (high pass in the svs sb12+) or managed to get outlaw ICBM-1 pretty cheap.

It's good if you have high pass facility - it's not essential just if you fancy trying things out. Not many subs have high pass the ones that so are usually very cheap and nasty, or high ens..not much in between

The high pass in my sb12+ is fixed to 80hz this isn't ideal for the speakers so ICBM-1 allowed a lower crossover. Room was small so floorstanders speakers did not sound great and also had standmounts which struggled in lower bass, but from own experience with AV system and high pass in sub filtering out lower bass can clear up the bass room droan and speaker struggling.

For yourself use the speaker level neautrik to get combined stereo into mono high level, disable subin Denon it has that , and set crossover on sub to somewhere around your speakers low response give or take +/- 10db.
 
The denon has a bass settings, and can set it at -10 however this effects things negatively, using the RCA the bass doesn't do anything or the sub.

There isn't any settings other than that . There isn't much bass management from googling, probs new amp neered.

One suggestion was to send the normal speaker wire to the sub then to the speakees to use the crossover on the sub, but I'm not sure how I'd do that, the conneftorsc for that don't seem present.
 
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That's just the sub channel level, crossover will be fixed a probably 120hz, the manual will.say. 120hz is way too high for music. Personally I think 60hz is about right (ignoring the speakers, just what I find sub frequencies cut off for music is) So use the high level out.

Check the left and right outputs aren't filtered though if they are that is bad news. Play some bass heavy music (sub switched off) if it's lacking bass a lot compared to another system it could be a non defeatble bass management system. Doubt it but wouldn't be surprised as forcing it means freeing up power to the amplifiers and considering it's a micro aystem...
 
Not sure bass is lacking it certainly got a good thunp in it so can't be an issue like that, this is using the Neutrik connector wired into the speaker outputs on the amp

I rekon in the future 200-300 quid if I go down the second hand route I could turn my system into a pretty good 5.1
 
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hornetstinger said:
also apparently if you don't set subwoofer to 120hz if you set to say 80hz then 80hz to 120hz is discarded not redirected to other speakers.
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This is correct although only applicable to discrete audio formats (ie, something with a LFE Channel encoded in the audio). Besides, there's so little content on that range in LFE channels that it's not something you should worry about.
 
I have to say, I was surprised at low volumes how much this driver moves and thinking that I thought, well it won't go loud, but it appears the XXLS400 puts out much more excursion than what I am used to (Z5500 10" driver), really does move, looks like the peerless driver it was almost 1.5cm and wasn't even clipping!

Saying that, 180W vs 400W, I wouldn't say it's over two times as powerful in terms of output?

Don't get me wrong, I'm comparing ability in terms of output, in terms of quality, the XXLS sounds much more refined, and on the low frequencies, the same frequency, say 30Hz, sounds fuller and lower as weird as that sounds.


Another thing, using the Neutrik connector, if I turn the denon amp off, the sub has a loud humm, so I have now choice but to turn the subwoofer off at the back, it's not a big deal as that's what I'd likely do anyway to save electric.
 
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