Few other players who are prone to the old handball who aren't hated
Greenlizard0 Weekend Football Thread ** spoilers ** [1 - 3rd December 2012]
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Few other players who are prone to the old handball who aren't hated
It is the aggregate of generally unpalatable acts though innit ?
It Was a pen that he didn't get, but instead of coming away from that game smelling of roses, he handballs against a team of relegation battlers who collectively cost less than him!
If only he walked to training then he'd be loved! I bet Suarez has a 4x4 just to damage the environment.
Nope. Suarez's arm was in a natural position - he's always got his arm raise appealing for decisions
Joking, right?
Nope. Suarez's arm was in a natural position - he's always got his arm raise appealing for decisions
I was being sarcastic. Suarez is a monster on the pitch and (most of the time) I love him for it. If he played for another team I'd probably hate him though. However for you to claim that Bale's such a good role model because he walks to training, while ignoring the fact that he cheats as much as anybody in the league makes your criticism of Suarez laughable.
Your comments on Bale cheating are obviously nonsense.
I think he is a good role model because he is pretty grounded, has worked his way up and doesn't go on the lash (I don't think he drinks at all). He doesn't scream at the ref and hurl out abuse. He doesn't do horror tackles either.
He is a bloody golden boy that the media seem intent on targetting now. The irony being that last season he was dangling his leg to get a free kick every now and again. This season he stopped that and has been booked for diving when he was fouled!
Edit - My criticism of Suarez is because he is a vile, odious lump of a footballer who everyone HATES except Liverpool fans. He is a good footballer but time and time again he just does horrible things on the pitch. He spits, he screams at the ref, he has tantrums, he dives, he pretty much assaulted Scott parker, he tried to say that he was using that n word in a friendly way (whaaaat?!?).
Finally, I get the impression that even if Bale dived 3 or 4 times outside the box, that somehow brings him down to the level of Suarez in Liverpool supporters' eyes as of Suarez is somehow then vindicated. It shouldnt and it doesn't; Suarez is clearly a cynical monster as you say and Bale clearly isnt. They are light years apart in their behaviour.
I think he is a good role model because he is pretty grounded, has worked his way up and doesn't go on the lash (I don't think he drinks at all). He doesn't scream at the ref and hurl out abuse. He doesn't do horror tackles either.
He is a bloody golden boy that the media seem intent on targetting now. The irony being that last season he was dangling his leg to get a free kick every now and again. This season he stopped that and has been booked for diving when he was fouled!
Edit - My criticism of Suarez is because he is a vile, odious lump of a footballer who everyone HATES except Liverpool fans. He is a good footballer but time and time again he just does horrible things on the pitch. He spits, he screams at the ref, he has tantrums, he dives, he pretty much assaulted Scott parker, he tried to say that he was using that n word in a friendly way (whaaaat?!?).
Finally, I get the impression that even if Bale dived 3 or 4 times outside the box, that somehow brings him down to the level of Suarez in Liverpool supporters' eyes as of Suarez is somehow then vindicated. It shouldnt and it doesn't; Suarez is clearly a cynical monster as you say and Bale clearly isnt. They are light years apart in their behaviour.
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Well I am just home from Liverpool, cheap drinks, nice people and DREADFUL football. 0-0 would have been fair because no one could be bothered after 3 games in 6 days from both teams.
Then again Suarez is better than everyone on our team and lump it to him probably deserves more than a point...
On the plus we looked solid at the back and our keeper Gazza put the terrible game on Wednesday behind him to have a great game today.
On the downside Adkins needs to rotate the squad, several players didn't get a look in, despite Puncheon being TERRIBLE for the entire time he was on. Very frustrating that Rodriguez gets game time despite having a real pacey winger on the bench, forcing 4-4-2 is stupid as it does not work for us and we look stupid chasing the game with it.
Shame as a point was in our grasp, but then again 1-0 isn't embarrassing at all, just boring as hell.
Have to win against Reading now next weekend.
Then again Suarez is better than everyone on our team and lump it to him probably deserves more than a point...
On the plus we looked solid at the back and our keeper Gazza put the terrible game on Wednesday behind him to have a great game today.
On the downside Adkins needs to rotate the squad, several players didn't get a look in, despite Puncheon being TERRIBLE for the entire time he was on. Very frustrating that Rodriguez gets game time despite having a real pacey winger on the bench, forcing 4-4-2 is stupid as it does not work for us and we look stupid chasing the game with it.
Shame as a point was in our grasp, but then again 1-0 isn't embarrassing at all, just boring as hell.
Have to win against Reading now next weekend.
You think Arsenal should have 18 or more world class players? I assume that's what you mean by 'top'. Also you said in an earlier post that Wenger was conned into buying Cazorla. I also assume this means you don't rate Cazorla at all?
Out of interest, who is in this second eleven that you're thinking of?
These two sentences are nonsense imo
Bale's never needed any encouragement to throw himself to the ground. Lots of players do it and he's up there with the best (or worst depending which way you look at it) of them.
As for being targetted by the media; it hardly gets a mention
The only reason anything was said on motd was because he's been booked twice in a row for diving so they had to discuss it. Look at the media attention Ronaldo, Suarez or several other players got/get - anything said about Bale pales in comparison.Lump it to him?
Not sure 23 shots was dreadful football, we put together some nice moves and Lambert had two decent shots for you
Lol yeah most of those shots went over or wide....
no one was at the races in my view and it was a bit of a meh game. (aka we had an answer to most attacking moves and no one had many proper chances)
crude way to put EVERYTHING good Liverpool do goes through Suarez, it's not a bad thing as such but we worked it out very quickly and no one else provides anything going forward. So we closed Suarez down and took him out the game and left Liverpool looking fighty but average. Harsh way to put it but Liverpool need 2-3 more really creative/incisive players because there is such a limit to them going forward currently.
Caporegime
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Second eleven would be the first eleven who didn't play
Not all of them are stars, but you're talking about in that season, our "best" eleven could beat anyone and give the likes of Barca a run for their money, throw in 5 changes for rotation and that team could and still should beat most of the table, and should also still do well against the top four.On Carzorla, he started well, he's been pretty woeful in the past 6 weeks, his shooting has been pretty terrible, sure he scored a great goal, but he shoots from range and goes from not very close to just over, and he's scored.
The main thing is, there was lots of crap in the press about how desparate they were to offload players and risk of going bankrupt and being thrown out of La liga, he was just about the only player they sold, and 9 goals is hardly spectacular for last season in La Liga, Michu scored 15 last season, and we bought a guy that costs what 7-8 times as much who is less good by the looks of things, and largely because the press stories seemingly made it appear like its a deal whose time limit could expire very soon, its like we jumped on it without thinking.
Maybe he'll turn out really good, but maybe Michu at 2mil should have been where we were looking? Ultimately I can't see Michu who had a significantly better season than Santi, with a significantly worse club.... costing so much less, isn't by FAR the better business deal, and we could get him for a way smaller wage. Also, just for the facts to be out there, Vela, a player we OWNED outscored and out assisted Santi last year......
You don't need 18 "world class" players, because ultimately world class means smeg all. You need 18 players capable of playing in a title winning side though. That doesn't mean 18 Ronaldo's, it means a few top creative players a few top defenders, a few top midfielders, a top goalkeeper, a couple top strikers AND several players who are consistently decent....
Its not the best players who cost you titles, its the 5 guys who when others are injured, step in and screw everything up because they are so inconsistent. A last seasons Arteta, not a Song/Denilson, Kos rather than Djourou, Sagna rather than Santos.
Our back up players, who due to something at Arsenal and injuries, play loads, need to NOT be total screw ups, they don't have to be Ronaldo, Fabregas or Ivanovic, just solid players who might not win you games, but won't lose you games.
You'll do better with 5 stars and 13 players who rarely if ever put in stinking performances, than 9 stars and 9 players who frequently have truly horrendous games, because the backup WILL play loads of games, and if they frequently suck, they will cost you point after point. 4-5 years ago when we had a mostly good squad, just playing 3 rubbish players who either make constant mistakes or offer 1 minute of football in every 90, Song/Denilson and say Walcott, you can see the difference, its the one run that Song wouldn't track that leads to us conceding, while a Flamini or Gilberto would never be so lazy and ignore the run. You put 2-3 weak spots in even with great players around them, the whole team becomes vunerable, you put in 3 completely solid, players, who rarely make mistakes but will rarely score or doing anything brilliant either, they won't win you games, but you have other guys for that, they won't cost you games, and that is the difference between title winning sides and not.
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Ahh, I thought you meant we were lumping it forward. A lot goes through him because he's so good. I think you're being slightly harsh on us though. The second half tailed off - I assume the 3 games in a week started to take its toll on both sides - but I didn't think you shut Suarez down, he looked like he could open you up at will.
Harsh way to put it but Liverpool need 2-3 more really creative/incisive players because there is such a limit to them going forward currently.
First half we (collectively) played very well and could & should have put the game to bed. As above though, the second half looked like the second half of a 3rd game in a week.
That said, we certainly do need reinforcements in the final third. Sterling's already a very good player and is only going to get better but in a front 3 he needs to add the goal threat to his game and we can't be relying on a 17 year old too much. It's the 3rd player of the front 3 (and cover/an impact player off the bench) that's our biggest issue - whoever we play there is a compromise. Today it was Shelvey, who's got an eye for goal but isn't natural out wide. Other times it's been Suso or Enrique who have done a decent job but ultimately they're playing out of position.
Second eleven would be the first eleven who didn't play
On Carzorla, he started well, he's been pretty woeful in the past 6 weeks, his shooting has been pretty terrible, sure he scored a great goal, but he shoots from range and goes from not very close to just over, and he's scored.
The main thing is, there was lots of crap in the press about how desparate they were to offload players and risk of going bankrupt and being thrown out of La liga, he was just about the only player they sold, and 9 goals is hardly spectacular for last season in La Liga, Michu scored 15 last season, and we bought a guy that costs what 7-8 times as much who is less good by the looks of things, and largely because the press stories seemingly made it appear like its a deal whose time limit could expire very soon, its like we jumped on it without thinking.
Maybe he'll turn out really good, but maybe Michu at 2mil should have been where we were looking? Ultimately I can't see Michu who had a significantly better season than Santi, with a significantly worse club.... costing so much less, isn't by FAR the better business deal, and we could get him for a way smaller wage. Also, just for the facts to be out there, Vela, a player we OWNED outscored and out assisted Santi
I guess my observation about Arsenal's '2nd XI' for that season was that yes they had an impeccable first team, but still mostly mediocre/unproven players in the bench. I certainly don't think that a 2nd team with the likes of Cygan, Aliadiere, Kanu, Keown etc is much to speak of... My point is that Arsenal have never had much depth in their squad, which is a problem.
I don't think you can compare (now) Cazorla to Michu. Michu has clearly been a great buy, but don't tell me that you would have been happy to see him arrive even for £2million at the start of the season. Also while Arsenal miss having a goal scoring midfielder, creativity is probably more vital, especially after the loss of Fabregas. You don't need to score to be effective- see Modric. And Cazorla clearly has a great eye for a pass, and definitely a step up from an increasingly insignificant Arteta.
Vela had his chances, and he never performed. So maybe he never got a proper long run in the PL, but what if he did? People would have just slammed Wenger for giving him a run.
Overheard someone making an interesting point after the match today that one worrying thing for Arsenal is that when Wenger is changing the team these days he is putting in seasoned pros who are not up to the task, rather than youngsters who may have potential as we used to (note I am not one of these people obsessed with youth players, in my book if you are good enough, you are young enough). In other words when players got injured we used to be calling on Djourou/Senderos/Fabregas/Flamini/Denilson/Toure/Clichy/Vela/Bendtner/Aliadiere/Quincy/Walcott etc and there was a chance that some of those could develop into top players or indeed maybe they were already good enough but just hadn't the opportunity to prove it due to age. Whereas now when we rotate players in or fill the bench they are generally well into their 20s or above people like Santos, Gervinho, Arshavin, Rosicky, Djourou, Chamakh etc who are not going to improve massively.
Now some might say that in years gone by the big criticism was that Arsenal were lacking in experience, that having to blood those youngsters gave them a soft underbelly that would be exploited in trips to the northwest. But the point being made is that if you have experienced backup players they need to be GOOD players first and foremost because otherwise you may as well be taking a chance on youth prospects e.g. Eisfeld - apart from anything else it will keep the wage bill down a bit. In the glory years of 2002-4 Arsenal just about had that with players like Edu, Reyes, Wiltord, Keown, Parlour, Kanu etc with say a backup leftback being a kid called Gael Clichy who even at 17 was better than Andre Santos will ever be.
Now some might say that in years gone by the big criticism was that Arsenal were lacking in experience, that having to blood those youngsters gave them a soft underbelly that would be exploited in trips to the northwest. But the point being made is that if you have experienced backup players they need to be GOOD players first and foremost because otherwise you may as well be taking a chance on youth prospects e.g. Eisfeld - apart from anything else it will keep the wage bill down a bit. In the glory years of 2002-4 Arsenal just about had that with players like Edu, Reyes, Wiltord, Keown, Parlour, Kanu etc with say a backup leftback being a kid called Gael Clichy who even at 17 was better than Andre Santos will ever be.
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Soldato
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I agree with most of that. The hate for Bale is mostly born from jealousy. Players like him will just get kicked out of the game unless they try to protect themselves. How many times has Bale been sidelined for months because of bad tackles? Phil Neville did him when he was flying for us, put him out for months. Charlie Adam tried to end his career a couple of times and that's just off the top of my head.
Bale is looking for the fouls he knows are coming... I don't like it but it's been the norm in the game since the Prem started so why are people still up in arms about it?
Suarez is a dirty, cheating, horrible little toe rag... like most Uruguayan footballers?
At the end of the day Bale is a role model I wouldn't mind my son following. Would anyone want to have Suarez as his sons idol?
Soldato
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Rooney's touch for van Persie's goal was just awesome.
I totally agree, we don't these though vile foreigners in our football. We all dream of a team of Gareth Bales
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