Shame, I thought with seeing him training in them RVP pictures that he might make it. At least being at home we shouldn't be under as much pressure as last night.
Greenlizard0 Weekend Football Thread ** spoilers ** [17th - 22nd August 2012]
- Thread starter Robbo
- Start date
- Status
Shame, I thought with seeing him training in them RVP pictures that he might make it. At least being at home we shouldn't be under as much pressure as last night.
Caporegime
- Joined
- 18 Oct 2002
- Posts
- 37,804
- Location
- block 16, cell 12
What ? Swapping cleverly for carrick is hardly going to cause pandemonium in our opponents midfiekd and continuing scholes after he really came close to getting sent off without ever being productive last night?
I said 'that would do', not that the midfield is all of a sudden amazing. Look at the defence and attack for starters.
Carrick reads the game well and does a reasonably good job defensively, and he has a fairly good range of passing too. Ideally we'd want Carrick in that role with a ball winner next to him, like M'Vila or Javi Martinez (hypothetically, of course).
Real Madrid have Khedira there, for example, their formation is similar to that.
Kagawa was making brilliant runs forward but scholes kept spreading the ball wide.
Caporegime
- Joined
- 18 Oct 2002
- Posts
- 33,188
Maybe this is the answer as far as United are concerned.
That wouldn't work for a number of reasons, Scholes relegated to staying deep is a pointless waste of talent, RVP is BETTER as a withdrawn striker, he'll score less but effect the game more, Rooney just isn't as good as many people want to believe. I have no idea how he's perceived outside of England but I would guess its.... no where near as well as English fans perceive an England player.
He can be more effective on the wing and has done it before, why? In the role he currently plays you need finesse, passing skill, vision and technical ability, I don't think he has a single one of those things at all. What was he best at in his youth, power, running on the ball, not jinking around going around players runs but, "i'm fat and fast and you'll bounce off me" runs. He's got power in his leg to shoot or cross with loads of pace on the ball. Wing suited him when he played there because in general on the wing you're encouraged with the space and direction to run with the ball hard and to use power in your crosses or cut inside and shoot from the edge of the box with more space than standing outside the middle of the box.
He won't be a world class winger, but it plays to his strengths FAR better than a withdrawn striker/playmaker role which frankly I think he's inept at.
Utd should never, in a million years, have given Welbeck 80k a week, he's 4th string at best and personally I'd want a better 4th string option. Rooney was very effective played off the shoulder of the CB's, doing what Fellani did, using his mass/strength to bully defenders, between the midfield and defence he can't do that and what he needs to do, he's no good at.
The issue is, like Gerrard, if you stick him out wide will he stick to that role, if you stick him upfront will he stick to that role or will he drift into that withdrawn striker area?
The biggest issue last night was, Rooney wanted to play withdrawn striker, Kawaga was asked to play there, Welbeck pushed in there constantly and its Scholes best area on the pitch.... no one worked the left wing(or right when Nani switched to the left), there wasn't a lot going on in central midfield, and there wasn't a lot of actually good work going on in that attack central area because, well, too many cooks basically. If Kawaga is in there you need Rooney/RVP running across the defence, pulling them all over the place and passes being pinged into them both, Kawaga to drive through the gaps the others create sometimes and if you think Utd couldn't have won any crosses last night you're all mental.
Better delivery and some strikers running in behind the defenders at the right time, no reason they couldn't win crosses but its very hard to get ahead of defenders onto a ball in behind the defence when all the strikers wanted to drop deep.
Get a real DM, drop Carrick, play Rooney/RVP upfront, Young/valencia on the wings and Kawaga infront of the DM, but tell Rooney to stay the **** upfront and never drop deep, let RVP drop in to help Kawaga and interchange with him, do the 1-2's, put throughballs in he's so much better than Rooney in those aspects of the game its a joke.
Caporegime
- Joined
- 7 Apr 2008
- Posts
- 25,211
- Location
- Lorville - Hurston
i agree. Rooney imo is overhyped in england. i dont think he is a better player then rvp. far from it.
fergie needs to drop rooney if he cant accomodate both rvp and rooney.
rvp is fergies best striker by a country mile. use him. drop rooney.
Also welbekc hasnt signed a new contratc yet DM so where the hell are u getting this talk that his on 80k a week?
If his current contract is on 80k a week then thats a bigger joke then denilson and diaby being on 60k/70k a week.
at least denilson and diaby have been at arsenal for a while. wellbeck has only bene playing firs team football for united for about one season so far and very young? you telling me his on 80k already?
fergie needs to drop rooney if he cant accomodate both rvp and rooney.
rvp is fergies best striker by a country mile. use him. drop rooney.
Also welbekc hasnt signed a new contratc yet DM so where the hell are u getting this talk that his on 80k a week?
If his current contract is on 80k a week then thats a bigger joke then denilson and diaby being on 60k/70k a week.
at least denilson and diaby have been at arsenal for a while. wellbeck has only bene playing firs team football for united for about one season so far and very young? you telling me his on 80k already?
Caporegime
- Joined
- 9 Mar 2006
- Posts
- 58,058
- Location
- Surrey
I see we've reached the Rooney is average part of the banality.
Anyone that says drop Rooney frankly should just stay quiet as you clearly know nothing at all about football.
Anyone that says drop Rooney frankly should just stay quiet as you clearly know nothing at all about football.
Unfortunately any sense that DM talks is offset by this list he has of players he loves no matter what, and hates no matter what. There is no middle ground!
Caporegime
- Joined
- 7 Apr 2008
- Posts
- 25,211
- Location
- Lorville - Hurston
well change tactics and formation to accomodate rooney and rvp. simples.
anyone that says rooney is better then rvp needs to stay quiet
Surely 4-4-2 suits them best with a diamond formation in the middle:
Rooney - RvP
Nani - Kagawa - Carrick - Valencia
Of course that means their defence has to be fit to free up Carrick and Valencia. It's very attacking too.
They still need two new first team fullbacks.
His name is Kagawa.
Rooney - RvP
Nani - Kagawa - Carrick - Valencia
Of course that means their defence has to be fit to free up Carrick and Valencia. It's very attacking too.
They still need two new first team fullbacks.
His name is Kagawa.
They all look the same though.
SAF usually only ever praises the opposition when Man U win, I take the fact that he's moaning as a sign that his team was outplayed and he knows it. But for De Gea (and Jagielka!) that match would have been a goalfest.
Fantastic result for us last night but it will take more than one win to convince me we've finally shed our "slow starters" tag.
As for United, anyone writing them off after last night is an idiot. With RvP match fit and once the team have gelled properly with Kagawa they'll be a match for anyone. I'm glad we played them first!
do you think city or chelsea look at their team end ever think 'he does a reasonably good job'?
Van persie has had 18 good months. Even then he only scored 2 more than rooney last year who by all accounts was average? In the last 8 years he has outscored Van persie in all but the last 2 years. He was 6 goals behind RVP in 2011 and 2 behind him last year.
Both are as near as dammit on 1 goal per 2 games.
But but but, Rooney is so average!
Do you mean do they look at Carrick and think that or they look at one of their own players and think that?
i mean their own team. no one can compete with city and chelsea in the buying stakes but united obviously have money to spend (though AFAIK city have only signed one player but they have yaya, which is the area that needs addressing at united)
united are title challengers, have been since the pl started. to have a player like carrick used so versatile because 'he does a reasonably good job' is way off the mark in terms of competitevness.
united could be in serious danger of simply being bullied out of the centre and pushed out wide. if the oppossing teams simply stick a big player, full of energy to simply chase down and cause havoc, forcing united to play down the flanks, then they've won a major part of the battle.
...especially considering how poo their fullbacks are.
Carrick in midfield does more than just a reasonably good job, last night at centre back he did what could be considered a reasonably good job. As a midfielder Carrick is better than Mikel at Chelsea or Barry at City. Is he as good as someone like Toure at City? Of course not and it's obviously a problem that we dont have a player of his calibre but lets not start talking like we're the only team that plays someone in midfield who's not considered 'world class' because there's only one team in the world that has a midfield loaded with world class midfielders
- Status